BREXIT! BREXIT! BREXIT!

[JimC]

We need Ani's opinion on this...

Where the fuck are you, Ani?

[Brian Peacock]

What is the position of Eire on all this?

The same as the EU: the negotiated deal is the only basis for an orderly divorce, one in which the UK effectively remains in the EU Customs Union and adheres to significant portion of the Single Market until, that is, some other solution to prevent a hard border between NI and Eire can be agreed.

[JimC]

What I really meant was how will they cope with a hard Brexit, and a hard border...

[pErvinalia]

So much hardness...

[Sean Hayden]

I just keep thinking about Scotland, and how obvious it was to everyone that leaving would be bad, and how wrong they'll all be now despite the best arguments, and the experts, and the evidence.

They must feel absolutely hoodwinked by the little fuckers in England.

[Hermit]

I just keep thinking about Scotland, and how obvious it was to everyone that leaving would be bad, and how wrong they'll all be now despite the best arguments, and the experts, and the evidence.

They must feel absolutely hoodwinked by the little fuckers in England.

Or could it be that in 2014 it was better to remain a part of the UK? That circumstances have changed in unforeseen ways since then?

[JimC]

[Rum]

Maybe they’ve just done their sums properly. I’ve not heard a creditable case for Scotland being able to stand on its own two feet economically, even with EU dosh. You just have to drive a while around Scotland to see signs announcing that this that and the other project was funded by the Eu already.

[Brian Peacock]

I just keep thinking about Scotland, and how obvious it was to everyone that leaving would be bad, and how wrong they'll all be now despite the best arguments, and the experts, and the evidence.

They must feel absolutely hoodwinked by the little fuckers in England.

Or could it be that in 2014 it was better to remain a part of the UK? That circumstances have changed in unforeseen ways since then?

There's a palpable sense of non-English identity in Scotland and I think the SNP have done well to piggyback the anti-Brexit sentiment here, but at the same time Scotland is massively subsidised by Westminster - to the tune of c.£2000 per person per annum more in public spending than South of the border. In a post Brexit UK I think a vote for an independent Scotland would be one act of collective self-harm piled on top of another.

[Sean Hayden]

I just keep thinking about Scotland, and how obvious it was to everyone that leaving would be bad, and how wrong they'll all be now despite the best arguments, and the experts, and the evidence.

They must feel absolutely hoodwinked by the little fuckers in England.

Or could it be that in 2014 it was better to remain a part of the UK? That circumstances have changed in unforeseen ways since then?

Sure. Except I remember their argument, at least one of them being to leave so as not to be at the mercy of the little fuckers in England.

This seems to be a direct result of being at the mercy of the little fuckers.

[Hermit]

I just keep thinking about Scotland, and how obvious it was to everyone that leaving would be bad, and how wrong they'll all be now despite the best arguments, and the experts, and the evidence.

They must feel absolutely hoodwinked by the little fuckers in England.

Or could it be that in 2014 it was better to remain a part of the UK? That circumstances have changed in unforeseen ways since then?

There's a palpable sense of non-English identity in Scotland and I think the SNP have done well to piggyback the anti-Brexit sentiment here, but at the same time Scotland is massively subsidised by Westminster - to the tune of c.£2000 per person per annum more in public spending than South of the border. In a post Brexit UK I think a vote for an independent Scotland would be one act of collective self-harm piled on top of another.

Yes, well, Scotland was an entirely separate country until the death of Elizabeth I in 1603 spelt the end of the Tudor dynasty in England. The best qualified successor to the English throne in terms of bloodlines was James Stuart, aka King James VI of Scotland. He became James I, King of England by virtue of being the great-grandson of Margaret Tudor, who in turn was Henry VIII's elder sister.

That was just a personal rather than a political union, though. The political union between Scotland and England did not eventuate until just over a century, three English civil wars, the Cromwellian interregnum and yet another dynastic change later. So, yeah, in historical terms the political union of England, Scotland and Ireland is quite a recent one.

[Brian Peacock]

I think the enclosures and clearances played a significant role in forming the Scots psyche, expressed today as a casual loathing of the English that is still quite prevalent in many aspects of popular and political culture.

[Hermit]

I just keep thinking about Scotland, and how obvious it was to everyone that leaving would be bad, and how wrong they'll all be now despite the best arguments, and the experts, and the evidence.

They must feel absolutely hoodwinked by the little fuckers in England.

Or could it be that in 2014 it was better to remain a part of the UK? That circumstances have changed in unforeseen ways since then?

Sure. Except I remember their argument, at least one of them being to leave so as not to be at the mercy of the little fuckers in England.

This seems to be a direct result of being at the mercy of the little fuckers.

Correction: It seems obvious to some Scots that they were "absolutely hoodwinked by the little fuckers in England". Similar arguments are being made by several dozen active separatist movements in Europe. they all feel hard done by. Good luck to all of them with their struggles to escape the clutches of their oppressors. Especially the Bavarians. I've mentioned it before, and I'll say it again: Bavarians are the missing link between Austrians and humans. Separatist Scots emulate them.

[Sean Hayden]

--poor guys

[Hermit]

I think the enclosures and clearances played a significant role in forming the Scots psyche, expressed as a casual loathing of the English rhat is still quite prevalent in many aspects of popular and political culture.

I'm not sure if the small Scottish landholders and peons suffered any more of those than their English counterparts.