"Man-made gods wreak havoc under inviting cloak of atheism"

Holy Crap!
Post Reply
User avatar
klr
(%gibber(who=klr, what=Leprageek);)
Posts: 32964
Joined: Wed Mar 04, 2009 1:25 pm
About me: The money was just resting in my account.
Location: Airstrip Two
Contact:

"Man-made gods wreak havoc under inviting cloak of atheism"

Post by klr » Tue Jul 05, 2011 2:37 pm

It's Monday, so it must be time for the usual atheist-bashing/religious apologist nonsense ...

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/opi ... 89384.html
JAMES MACKEY

RITE AND REASON: THE IRISH Times of June 4th last reported the contributions to the World Atheist Convention of noted international theologian and evangelist of atheism, Richard Dawkins, together with that of our recently self-outed atheist Senator Ivana Bacik.

Dawkins a theologian? Certainly so; the term “theology” was coined long ago by Greek philosophers in order to identify that part of philosophy that consists in reasoning about gods; so that those who reason there is no god are as much theologians as those who reason there is one.

Furthermore, when Christians made their entry on the stage of history, and wanted to produce a philosophical support for their theistic belief as recorded in their Bible, they borrowed pre-Christian Greek philosophy for the purpose. They saw little or no difference between their god and the dominant god of the most advanced version of Greek religion. “Change a few phrases,” said St Augustine, “and they [the Platonists] might be Christians.” So Dawkins is a theologian.

Bacik, however, does not appear to want to be bothered about providing reasons for her atheism at all. She prefers to rely on the direct dogmatic route to the cavalier and surely thoughtless assertion that in our “remarkable times, all our gods have crumbled, [as] sacred texts, infallible truths, have been exposed as shams”.

Yet if she had tried to acquaint herself with theology, and if she had managed to modify just a little her crass dismissal of all sacred texts as mere shams, she might have learned something about the existence of gods. Namely, that humanity at all times has been capable of creating gods in its own image.

And these created gods are real gods, for they quickly reveal the power of taking over and ruling the lives of those who create them. They are more than capable of directing these lives as whimsically to wellbeing as to the devastating destruction of Homo sapiens, habitat and all.

Bacik stumbles on traces of the principal deity of this age-old man-made pantheon, when she talks about being “struck by the comparison between the unquestioning deference shown to bankers with that shown to religious authority”.

For investment bankers are the high priests of Mammon whose very raison d’etre is the increase and increase of Mammon at whatever cost to human life and habitat. That lesson of reigning man-made gods, and the havoc they wreak on their very own creators, is taught by the prophet from Nazareth, who clearly identified Mammon as the principal rival to the God he knew as our common father.

And if we Irish have not learned that lesson from our present predicament, we never will; and we will pay the price. We are already noticing the promised punishments that attach to the very suggestion of disobeying some of Mammon’s rules as laid down by the “Vatican” of the International Monetary Fund.

So, despite Bacik’s praise of atheism as “profoundly moral” in itself, and unquestionably a source of “respect for others’ beliefs, combining reason and compassion”, there is too much evidence of declared atheism hiding malignant man-made theisms under its inviting cloak.

As of Dawkins-type attacks and outright persecution of religions by atheistic humanist regimes that can rival the apparently unending and mutual persecution of each other by faiths such as Judaism, Christianity and Islam. Each can be as bad as the next.

James Mackey is visiting professor in the school of religions and theology at TCD, and Thomas Chalmers professor emeritus of theology at the University of Edinburgh. His most recent books include Jesus of Nazareth and Christianity and Creation
God has no place within these walls, just like facts have no place within organized religion. - Superintendent Chalmers

It's not up to us to choose which laws we want to obey. If it were, I'd kill everyone who looked at me cock-eyed! - Rex Banner

The Bluebird of Happiness long absent from his life, Ned is visited by the Chicken of Depression. - Gary Larson

:mob: :comp: :mob:

devogue

Re: "Man-made gods wreak havoc under inviting cloak of athei

Post by devogue » Tue Jul 05, 2011 2:41 pm

What a fuck awful article. Tortured and almost unreadable.

User avatar
Xamonas Chegwé
Bouncer
Bouncer
Posts: 50939
Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2009 3:23 pm
About me: I have prehensile eyebrows.
I speak 9 languages fluently, one of which other people can also speak.
When backed into a corner, I fit perfectly - having a right-angled arse.
Location: Nottingham UK
Contact:

Re: "Man-made gods wreak havoc under inviting cloak of athei

Post by Xamonas Chegwé » Tue Jul 05, 2011 2:46 pm

So bankers are as bad as religion and share some social characteristics therefore... what? :dunno:

This is nothing but a "your shit smells as bad as mine so mine doesn't stink at all" argument. :airwank:
A book is a version of the world. If you do not like it, ignore it; or offer your own version in return.
Salman Rushdie
You talk to God, you're religious. God talks to you, you're psychotic.
House MD
Who needs a meaning anyway, I'd settle anyday for a very fine view.
Sandy Denny
This is the wrong forum for bluffing :nono:
Paco
Yes, yes. But first I need to show you this venomous fish!
Calilasseia
I think we should do whatever Pawiz wants.
Twoflower
Bella squats momentarily then waddles on still peeing, like a horse
Millefleur

User avatar
Animavore
Nasty Hombre
Posts: 39276
Joined: Sun Mar 01, 2009 11:26 am
Location: Ire Land.
Contact:

Re: "Man-made gods wreak havoc under inviting cloak of athei

Post by Animavore » Tue Jul 05, 2011 2:48 pm

article wrote:James Mackey is visiting professor in the school of religions and theology at TCD,
Mackeys go home :lay:
Libertarianism: The belief that out of all the terrible things governments can do, helping people is the absolute worst.

User avatar
Geoff
Pouncer
Posts: 9374
Joined: Wed Feb 25, 2009 4:39 pm
Location: Wigan, UK
Contact:

Re: "Man-made gods wreak havoc under inviting cloak of athei

Post by Geoff » Tue Jul 05, 2011 3:04 pm

devogue wrote:What a fuck awful article. Tortured and almost unreadable.
Indeed so, although he did (perhaps accidentally) get one thing right:
...she might have learned something about the existence of gods. Namely, that humanity at all times has been capable of creating gods in its own image.
I think that's the first theologian that I've seen admit the fact that man made gods, not vice-versa.
Image
"...anyone who says it’s “just the Internet” can :pawiz: . And then when they come back, they can :pawiz: again." - Tigger

User avatar
Hermit
Posts: 25806
Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2009 12:44 am
About me: Cantankerous grump
Location: Ignore lithpt
Contact:

Re: "Man-made gods wreak havoc under inviting cloak of athei

Post by Hermit » Tue Jul 05, 2011 3:08 pm

Xamonas Chegwé wrote:This is nothing but a "your shit smells as bad as mine so mine doesn't stink at all" argument.
...combined with "you are as bad as we are", or, to use Mackey's own words: "...outright persecution of religions by atheistic humanist regimes that can rival the apparently unending and mutual persecution of each other by faiths such as Judaism, Christianity and Islam. Each can be as bad as the next." Unfortunately, (for him) he cannot point out how any humanistic regime has ever got anywhere near the the crusades, inquisitions, pogroms, witch hunts, and so forth in the persecution of religions stakes, unless he defines the dictatorships of the 20th century onwards as humanist regimes.
I am, somehow, less interested in the weight and convolutions of Einstein’s brain than in the near certainty that people of equal talent have lived and died in cotton fields and sweatshops. - Stephen J. Gould

User avatar
klr
(%gibber(who=klr, what=Leprageek);)
Posts: 32964
Joined: Wed Mar 04, 2009 1:25 pm
About me: The money was just resting in my account.
Location: Airstrip Two
Contact:

Re: "Man-made gods wreak havoc under inviting cloak of athei

Post by klr » Tue Jul 05, 2011 3:09 pm

On the claim that you need to be a theologian to hold forth on gods, etc.: What was that observation by RD, about not needing to know anything about Fairies to realise that it was all bunkum?
God has no place within these walls, just like facts have no place within organized religion. - Superintendent Chalmers

It's not up to us to choose which laws we want to obey. If it were, I'd kill everyone who looked at me cock-eyed! - Rex Banner

The Bluebird of Happiness long absent from his life, Ned is visited by the Chicken of Depression. - Gary Larson

:mob: :comp: :mob:

User avatar
Horwood Beer-Master
"...a complete Kentish hog"
Posts: 7061
Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2009 2:34 pm
Location: Wandering somewhere around the Darenth Valley - Kent
Contact:

Re: "Man-made gods wreak havoc under inviting cloak of athei

Post by Horwood Beer-Master » Tue Jul 05, 2011 4:17 pm

"Man-made gods"? As opposed to..? :dunno:
Image

User avatar
Santa_Claus
Your Imaginary Friend
Posts: 1985
Joined: Thu Jul 29, 2010 7:06 pm
About me: Ho! Ho! Ho!
Contact:

Re: "Man-made gods wreak havoc under inviting cloak of athei

Post by Santa_Claus » Tue Jul 05, 2011 4:32 pm

Time to slow down on the Guiness.
I am Leader of all The Atheists in the world - FACT.

Come look inside Santa's Hole :ninja:

You want to hear the truth about Santa Claus???.....you couldn't handle the truth about Santa Claus!!!

User avatar
Pappa
Non-Practicing Anarchist
Non-Practicing Anarchist
Posts: 56488
Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2009 10:42 am
About me: I am sacrificing a turnip as I type.
Location: Le sud du Pays de Galles.
Contact:

Re: "Man-made gods wreak havoc under inviting cloak of athei

Post by Pappa » Tue Jul 05, 2011 4:38 pm

So gods are 'real' in the sense that they are powerful ideas then?

User avatar
Gawdzilla Sama
Stabsobermaschinist
Posts: 151265
Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2009 12:24 am
About me: My posts are related to the thread in the same way Gliese 651b is related to your mother's underwear drawer.
Location: Sitting next to Ayaan in Domus Draconis, and communicating via PMs.
Contact:

Re: "Man-made gods wreak havoc under inviting cloak of athei

Post by Gawdzilla Sama » Tue Jul 05, 2011 4:54 pm

As noted elsewhere, "Is OFF a TV channel?"
Image
Ein Ubootsoldat wrote:“Ich melde mich ab. Grüssen Sie bitte meine Kameraden.”

User avatar
Robert_S
Cookie Monster
Posts: 13416
Joined: Tue Feb 23, 2010 5:47 am
About me: Too young to die of boredom, too old to grow up.
Location: Illinois
Contact:

Re: "Man-made gods wreak havoc under inviting cloak of athei

Post by Robert_S » Tue Jul 05, 2011 5:02 pm

Gawdzilla wrote:As noted elsewhere, "Is OFF a TV channel?"
To be fair OFF is much more interesting than 90% of the channels in any cable/satellite package I've ever seen.
What I've found with a few discussions I've had lately is this self-satisfaction that people express with their proffessed open mindedness. In realty it ammounts to wilful ignorance and intellectual cowardice as they are choosing to not form any sort of opinion on a particular topic. Basically "I don't know and I'm not going to look at any evidence because I'm quite happy on this fence."
-Mr P

The Net is best considered analogous to communication with disincarnate intelligences. As any neophyte would tell you. Do not invoke that which you have no facility to banish.
Audley Strange

User avatar
Geoff
Pouncer
Posts: 9374
Joined: Wed Feb 25, 2009 4:39 pm
Location: Wigan, UK
Contact:

Re: "Man-made gods wreak havoc under inviting cloak of athei

Post by Geoff » Tue Jul 05, 2011 5:51 pm

Robert_S wrote:
Gawdzilla wrote:As noted elsewhere, "Is OFF a TV channel?"
To be fair OFF is much more interesting than 90% of the channels in any cable/satellite package I've ever seen.
Which just makes the analogy even more apt!
Image
"...anyone who says it’s “just the Internet” can :pawiz: . And then when they come back, they can :pawiz: again." - Tigger

User avatar
Gawdzilla Sama
Stabsobermaschinist
Posts: 151265
Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2009 12:24 am
About me: My posts are related to the thread in the same way Gliese 651b is related to your mother's underwear drawer.
Location: Sitting next to Ayaan in Domus Draconis, and communicating via PMs.
Contact:

Re: "Man-made gods wreak havoc under inviting cloak of athei

Post by Gawdzilla Sama » Tue Jul 05, 2011 6:04 pm

Geoff wrote:
Robert_S wrote:
Gawdzilla wrote:As noted elsewhere, "Is OFF a TV channel?"
To be fair OFF is much more interesting than 90% of the channels in any cable/satellite package I've ever seen.
Which just makes the analogy even more apt!
And OFF has more content than Faux News.
Image
Ein Ubootsoldat wrote:“Ich melde mich ab. Grüssen Sie bitte meine Kameraden.”

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests