Ban Ronald McDonald?

[Coito ergo sum]

No, Mr. Obtuse. That's not all that liberty is, but the liberty to eat what you want, drink what you want, and say what you want, is a part of liberty. Maybe not in your world, where liberty means "do as you're told."

Oh, like some kind of librarian utopia. A world of small children who don't wanna be told to do anything regardless of the harm it causes others. OK.

Not libertarian. Just a liberal republic that protects fundamental liberties in large measure, rather than an authoritarian regime that governs and nitpicks every aspect of our lives. You like the latter, I prefer the former. Got it. I must have missed the part about the "harm" eating Big Macs, speaking one's mind, and having abortions does to "others." But, I'm sure you'll provide a clear explanation of that.

Don't tell me what I "like"...you have no clue.

[

I'll stop when you stop.

Got it. Eating shit macs causes massive harm to animals and the environment (which of course causes massive harm to human animals as well).

Killing them has a habit of doing that. Eating plants does massive harm to animals and the environment too, by the way.

Abortions, free speech? Who the fuck ever said there was anything wrong with abortions or free speech?

I listed them among the liberties I was talking about, and then you proceeded to mock. You'll have to pay attention to what someone writes before responding to it with knee jerk nonsense.

[Coito ergo sum]

So don't eat it. Eat what you want to eat.

[Coito ergo sum]

Yeah - see if the burger you ACTUALLY get looks anything like that ad agency propaganda lie.
You'll get a soggy bun with some frumpy lettuce showing, and a meat patty so small you can't even see it unless you lift off the top of the bun...

There's a place down the street that says they have the "Worlds Greatest Hot Dog."

[Hermit]

Yeah - see if the burger you ACTUALLY get looks anything like that ad agency propaganda lie.
You'll get a soggy bun with some frumpy lettuce showing, and a meat patty so small you can't even see it unless you lift off the top of the bun...

There's a place down the street that says they have the "Worlds Greatest Hot Dog."

Yes, but does it accompany the claim with a picture implying that the hot dog will look like this?

[Coito ergo sum]

Yeah - see if the burger you ACTUALLY get looks anything like that ad agency propaganda lie.
You'll get a soggy bun with some frumpy lettuce showing, and a meat patty so small you can't even see it unless you lift off the top of the bun...

There's a place down the street that says they have the "Worlds Greatest Hot Dog."

Yes, but does it accompany the claim with a picture implying that the hot dog will look like this?

They do make their hot dog look suspiciously plump and juicy, and I'm thinking they won't place the toppings and condiments precisely in the order shown in the advertisement. I'm thinking of complaining to the Attorney General.

[Super Aguri]

Banning the clown wont solve anything.

What they really need to do is put the clown on trial... Find it guilty of all charges, and then BURN IT.

[sandinista]

Sandy, I ought to send you a .pdf of the Wealth of nations and an MP3 of Deutschland über Alles for putting that up, and I think I'm going to have a nice burger today, and fantasies of wafting by MS meat and onion laden breath to your nose.

Hey, I said I was sorry! I would deserve whatever you send. Saying that, posting that disgusting burger was just as bad...with no apology.

sandinista wrote:
Got it. Eating shit macs causes massive harm to animals and the environment (which of course causes massive harm to human animals as well).

Killing them has a habit of doing that. Eating plants does massive harm to animals and the environment too, by the way.

...and, again, you keep saying liberty is just doing whatever you want without worrying about any consequences. You, wrongly, stated that eating at mcshit does no harm to anyone. It does. Again you make a false equivalence, like you tend to do. Seriously, talking to you is like talking to a christian who thinks that creationism and evolution are two equal "theory's". "Eating plants" does not come even close to the massive harm caused to the environment from factory farmed industrial meat. The harm caused by huge multinational producers of cheap mass produced meat products is undeniable and catastrophic. So, in short, yes, eating at mchit does cause harm to animals and human animals.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2 ... -free-diet

sandinista wrote:
Abortions, free speech? Who the fuck ever said there was anything wrong with abortions or free speech?

I listed them among the liberties I was talking about, and then you proceeded to mock. You'll have to pay attention to what someone writes before responding to it with knee jerk nonsense.

I mock because you make no sense. Generally I do pay attention. If attention is deserved.

[Warren Dew]

"Eating plants" does not come even close to the massive harm caused to the environment from factory farmed industrial meat.

Eating plants is responsible for the vast majority of deforestation that has occurred across human history. Beside agriculture, modern feedlots are a relatively minor concern.

[sandinista]

"Eating plants" does not come even close to the massive harm caused to the environment from factory farmed industrial meat.

Eating plants is responsible for the vast majority of deforestation that has occurred across human history. Beside agriculture, modern feedlots are a relatively minor concern.

reference?

There are many to choose from to show that raising cattle and clearing land for feed for cattle is now the main cause of deforestation and environmental destruction. A quick wiki check:

The annual rate of deforestation in the Amazon region has continued to increase from 1990 to 2003 because of factors at local, national, and international levels.[5] 70% of formerly forested land in the Amazon, and 91% of land deforested since 1970, is used for livestock pasture.[12][13] The Brazilian government initially attributed 38% of all forest loss between 1966 and 1975 to large-scale cattle ranching. According to the Center for International Forestry Research (CIFOR), "between 1990 and 2001 the percentage of Europe's processed meat imports that came from Brazil rose from 40 to 74 percent" and by 2003 "for the first time ever, the growth in Brazilian cattle production, 80 percent of which was in the Amazon was largely export driven."[14]

The removal of forest to make way for cattle ranching was the leading cause of deforestation in the Brazilian Amazon from the mid 1960s.

[Warren Dew]

reference?

Code: Select all

Main direct drivers             Rate of Deforestation/Degradation (percentage)

Commercial agriculture:
Commercial crops                                        20
Cattle ranching (large scale)                           12

Subsistence farming:
Small scale agriculture/shifting cultivation            42
Fuel-wood and NTFP gathering                             6

Wood extraction:
Commercial (legal and illegal)                          14
Fuel-wood/charcoal (traded)                              5

United Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change, Investment and Financial Flows to Address Climate Change, 2007, p. 81.

Globally, subsistence farming is #1, farming of commercial crops is #2, and ranching is far behind at #4. But hey, feel free to cherry pick atypical regional data so you don't have to admit the truth.

[Gallstones]

I am really craving a cheeseburger loaded right now.

I think McDonald's is the only place still open.

Yeah - see if the burger you ACTUALLY get looks anything like that ad agency propaganda lie.
You'll get a soggy bun with some frumpy lettuce showing, and a meat patty so small you can't even see it unless you lift off the top of the bun...

Not when I make it at home. Mine might not be a perfectly disc shaped, but they pile up as well as that one.

[sandinista]

reference?

Code: Select all

Main direct drivers             Rate of Deforestation/Degradation (percentage)

Commercial agriculture:
Commercial crops                                        20
Cattle ranching (large scale)                           12

Subsistence farming:
Small scale agriculture/shifting cultivation            42
Fuel-wood and NTFP gathering                             6

Wood extraction:
Commercial (legal and illegal)                          14
Fuel-wood/charcoal (traded)                              5

United Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change, Investment and Financial Flows to Address Climate Change, 2007, p. 81.

Globally, subsistence farming is #1, farming of commercial crops is #2, and ranching is far behind at #4. But hey, feel free to cherry pick atypical regional data so you don't have to admit the truth.

admit the truth do you have a link to that chart? I think you're the one cherry picking btw.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2367646/

The farm animal sector is the single largest anthropogenic user of land, contributing to many environmental problems, including global warming and climate change.

[Warren Dew]

do you have a link to that chart? I think you're the one cherry picking btw.

Don't know how to google a document title? Perhaps that explains your frequent lack of facts. Here's a link to the PDF:

http://unfccc.int/resource/docs/publica ... _flows.pdf

And if I were cherry picking, I definitely wouldn't be quoting a UN document.

[sandinista]

do you have a link to that chart? I think you're the one cherry picking btw.

Don't know how to google a document title? Perhaps that explains your frequent lack of facts. Here's a link to the PDF:

http://unfccc.int/resource/docs/publica ... _flows.pdf

And if I were cherry picking, I definitely wouldn't be quoting a UN document.

I quoted a UN report as well. yah, you're so full of sh...facts

[Warren Dew]

I quoted a UN report as well.

To the contrary, you quoted a wikipedia page and a U.S. Humane Society report. You also didn't notice that the quotes don't actually support your position.