Before You Buy Anything Else From Amazon, Read This...

[kiki5711]

@Gallatones - There's an account in the book "Don't Sleep There Are Snakes" of very similar behaviour by the Piraha people. In their culture it's obviously not abusive at all and equates to the way we might cuddle a child or kiss whichever part of them they've just hurt. I'd recommend reading the book because it also contains an account of the author (then a missionary) losing his faith due to exposure to the Piraha's worldview.

is there anything on the web regarding this. I'm interested in reading it. I couldn't find anything other then their culture without numbers or something like that.

[Pappa]

@Gallatones - There's an account in the book "Don't Sleep There Are Snakes" of very similar behaviour by the Piraha people. In their culture it's obviously not abusive at all and equates to the way we might cuddle a child or kiss whichever part of them they've just hurt. I'd recommend reading the book because it also contains an account of the author (then a missionary) losing his faith due to exposure to the Piraha's worldview.

is there anything on the web regarding this. I'm interested in reading it. I couldn't find anything other then their culture without numbers or something like that.

Not a lot, as far as I know. The wiki page sums up some of the basics:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pirah%C3%A3_people

And this is worth a read:
http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2007 ... ntPage=all

[JOZeldenrust]

Somehow I can't shake the feeling that the whole hype over the Piraha people is going to turn out to be a lot of bad research methods and confirmation bias on the part of Everett. His claims are outrageous (only being concerned with what they can see, not having cardinal or ordinal numbers, unorthodox handling of children, I'm reminded of the tribes of one-legged people from medieval anthropology books), he devoted way too much time to this tribe for my taste; his investment may well have stimulated him to make exotic observations, and he's the only guy doing research on the Piraha. To me, it seems this has all the hallmarks of acedemic fraud.

[Cunt]

Somehow I can't shake the feeling that the whole hype over the Piraha people is going to turn out to be a lot of bad research methods and confirmation bias on the part of Everett. His claims are outrageous (only being concerned with what they can see, not having cardinal or ordinal numbers, unorthodox handling of children, I'm reminded of the tribes of one-legged people from medieval anthropology books), he devoted way too much time to this tribe for my taste; his investment may well have stimulated him to make exotic observations, and he's the only guy doing research on the Piraha. To me, it seems this has all the hallmarks of acedemic fraud.

I have heard such criticisms before, but isn't there another way to criticize a scientific paper? Like make a better one?

I am willing to start funding your meta-data research, or even a trip there if you can think of an effective way to clearly falsify some of the main claims.

Oh, and I should mention, I don't have much for funding...

[Pappa]

Somehow I can't shake the feeling that the whole hype over the Piraha people is going to turn out to be a lot of bad research methods and confirmation bias on the part of Everett. His claims are outrageous (only being concerned with what they can see, not having cardinal or ordinal numbers, unorthodox handling of children, I'm reminded of the tribes of one-legged people from medieval anthropology books), he devoted way too much time to this tribe for my taste; his investment may well have stimulated him to make exotic observations, and he's the only guy doing research on the Piraha. To me, it seems this has all the hallmarks of acedemic fraud.

I took his research as a very interesting first step. His main claim about their language is that their cultural habits restrict their language. They are intentionally insular as a defence mechanism, protecting their culture from modification from outside. I'd recommend reading his book, which is all personal observation and comment rather than science. As I've said in another thread, the anti-Chomskian rant gets a bit tiring, but the personal account in the book is interesting.

I think it's unfair to say he's spent too much time with the Piraha. Gerardo Reichel-Dolmatoff spend the best part of 30 years with the Tucano peoples and produced some of the most insightful anthropology I've ever read because of it. Researchers who spend limited time with people often produce poor observations because of the limited view of their culture they get. It will be interesting to see what others have to say about the Piraha when further research is published though.

[kiki5711]

Other than reading that book, (which I haven't read) I can't find anywhere about how they interact with their children.

[lordpasternack]

Just coming back to this topic here - I remember coming across this piece a while back, and thought I should post it just to be looked at. It might not be genuine, of course, and it's very confused - but interesting to look at on the merit of the various bits of confusion running through it.

Was I really molested or was it my fault?

I was "molested" from the time i was 5-12 by my step father. I tell people that I was molested, but lately it has been eating at me bc I feel like I am lying. I remember him doing things to my mom in front of me. Then he started lifting my shirt when he would wake me for school (i was 5) and "kissing" my chest. I liked it and used to take my shirt off so that he would do it. I had a crush on him. This continued for years, it escalated to more though, touching and oral sex -only to me I never touched him. I remember I liked it and I used to go up to his room willingly. It stopped when i was 12 and told my step father id idnt want to. I told my bf of 5 years that i wasnt really molested and that i liked it. He said that he was very shocked bc he didnt know that it was consentual. This makes me blame myself further. I am now 23 he is 31 and we have a 2 year old son. I told my mom when i was 6 and when i was 14, she didnt believe me either time. She is still with him... AM I TO BLAME?

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index ... 222AA9AtM7

Read through it a few times and try to decipher what it is that the author is trying to ask what she is to blame for. It isn't a classic case of a suffering victim feeling they provoked their assailent - it's more complex and confused than that.

On a few readings over it myself, I seem to conclude almost that she feels guilt for the fact that she isn't sure she feels like a victim - that she should want to hold this man to account, but she didn't at the time and feels confused about how she should feel about it now. Guilty because she specifically, willingly chose to initiate some of the activities, seems to suggest that they were congenial, and is again now confused about how she thinks she ought to feel, as opposed to how she felt at the time. Guilty perhaps because she feels subjectively that she did enjoy some of the experiences at the time, and that might just be sinful in itself in her mind…

Another noteworthy part of this that I'd point out is that she claims that it did stop quite simply at her request. There's also a point that she wasn't asked or at any rate didn't follow through with performing any favours for him.

Have at it, if you will. It might be made-up, but it has a smell of genuineness to it - particularly with all the confused emotions and unusual bits of misplaced guilt…

[lordpasternack]

And an interesting contrast from the same cesspit of fascinating cretinousness that is Yahoo Answers:

I was molested when I was six years old?

I'm a male and young adult now, and I was molested when I was six, by another boy my age. While my clothes were on he rubbed by penis, and grabbed my balls. I told my parents and my teacher, and they did NOTHING about it. This went on for about a month everyday at recess. I'm now an adult, but all through my life, I've had a fetish for "shemale porn", transgendered women, and I have an infatuation for foreskin, and penis', although I consider myself straight, and I like women. Do you think that this has anything to do with me being molested. For the first time, i'm finally putting two and two together. Also what are some side effects of molestation?

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index ... 209AAPB4cW

And the "best answer" reads thus:

Another kid rubbing you is hardly molestation. Just about all kids do that one way or another.

If you have fantasies and infatuations, then you have a problem that you need to deal with.

I think you need to deal with the fact that you were not molested. Probably you have a guilt conscience because you enjoyed it. Really there is nothing wrong with that.