Origin of Abrahamic religions

[kevbo]

Hello,
Long time atheist here.. Its been a while since I've really become engaged in it though. Lately I've been thinking about Abrahamic religions (Islam, Christianity, and Judaism) and their origins, and the reasons they were created. My apologies if my thoughts aren't well written.. I've been writing all day and I'm a bit brain dead. Also, my knowledge of ancient history is pretty poor. I'll do my best.

Its difficult for me to search for answers to my questions, sadly, because researching religion is almost always tainted with bias. I guess what I am mainly interested in is a possible rational explanation for the creation of these religions. The reasons that people believe in these religions are often discussed, usually pointing to human chauvinism and the desire to feel a purpose in life. Or whatever. But this is different. I could be wrong here, but most ancient religions (Greek comes to mind) seem to be an innocuous attempt at explaining what people did not know or could not understand. Abrahamic religions attempt to create historical accounts that are tantamount to modern propaganda.

So who created these accounts and why? What was the purpose of the three religions? I have to wonder if this was some of scheme to promote nationalism, perhaps by a king or something, or an ethnic thing where one group wanted to claim that one of their people was the true son of "God" (although Jesus was a Jew, so I'm not sure about that). What I'm thinking is that, I don't know, a nation was falling apart and the people were losing their sense of nationalism, so the king said "No, no, no - Abraham was not the son of God, one of OUR people was the true son of God and we have the accounts that prove it!" And then maybe Christianity started to spread to other Arabic countries and suddenly Mohammad became the true prophet. Perhaps it was a means of controlling the population. But given the nature of politics, I seem to have no doubt that this was some sort of political ploy. Maybe there was a war being planned and an "us vs them" mentality needed to be strengthened. Maybe someone just wanted their name ingrained in history forever. Is there any evidence for any of this?

I could have it all wrong, too. Perhaps Mary was just a girl who didn't want to tell her father that she had sex with a man, or didn't want to tell Joseph that she had been sleeping around. Then, she made up an elaborate lie about an angel coming to her in her sleep and that she would be giving birth to the son of "God." Having been raised believing this, Jesus then became convinced he was the son of God and the rest was history. Or maybe he was a schizophrenic suffering from delusions of grandeur. Regardless, as an atheist, I believe that someone, somewhere knew that this stuff wasn't true. My question is who and why?

Thanks!

[Rum]

Welcome first of all! And an apology as I don't have the time to spend on a long response. But basically of course they started as one religion. One assumes the wandering tribe which developed their initial beliefs wanted to think of themselves as special and unique and possessors of the one truth. This, conveniently allowed them to justify any measures they needed to take to protect or extend their own interests.

Christianity and then Islam, of course came much later and were in effect schisms of Judaism, driven by changes in circumstances and the poor 'fit' the old religion had in those new circumstances.

Brief as I said - but welcome again!

[Feck]

Most of the codified belief of the jews were written after the return from Babylon ..before then they were Polytheistic like most of the other peoples around them ,there is more and more archaeological evidence to support this from Jerusalem .

[Tero]

Well, this one has a lot of cultural baggage. Some religions are just simple rules of do this, do that and a hint of god.

[Tero]

>>So who created these accounts and why? What was the purpose of the three religions?<<

Back to this old question. If there are creationists who believe the Bible literally, how exactly was Genesis recorded? There was nobody that could read or write, and Adam and Eve were totally clueless where they came from. Well, Adam had a rib problem, but he got it back, apparently.

But seriously, how do the fundies explain this infallible record of old things?

[Deep Sea Isopod]

Religion dates back to many thousands of years before Abraham. Putting a god in place of ignorance was the thing to do. Someone done something bad, and suddenly Mount Jumbawumba exploded.
Someone else walked under a ladder, and a tin of paint fell on them.
Superstitious nonsense!

[Animavore]

try this book.



notice the subtext: the first three-thousnd years, it starts wi th the jews, greeks and romans

[FBM]

Hi, kevbo and welcome. I'll be taking a class called The Biblical Movement during the next trimester, so maybe I'll have more to offer then. However, with respect to the OP: There must have been at least one leader in the history of the tribes somewhere along the line who knew that s/he hadn't really talked to God or seen a burning bush or parted the Red Sea, yada yada, but told the story anyway. I suspect that they probably justified what they did with something along the lines of Plato's Noble Lie.

6 The Noble Lie
The Politics of Lying

Malcolm Schofield

Socrates' introduction of the Republic's notorious “noble lie” comes near the end of Book 3 (414b-c). “We want one single, grand lie,” he says, “which will be believed by everybody - including the rulers, ideally, but failing that the rest of the city.” Grand lie? Noble lie? G. R. F. Ferrari has a good note on the issue: “The lie is grand or noble (gennaios) by virtue of its civic purpose, but the Greek word can also be used colloquially, giving the meaning 'a true-blue lie,' i.e. a massive, no-doubt-about-it lie (compare the term 'grand larceny').” This is not the only point on which there might be argument about the translation. Some prefer to “lie” the more neutral “falsehood” (which need not imply deliberate deception), others “fiction ” (perhaps trying to prescind from questions of truth and falsehood altogether). Cornford had “bold flight of invention.” I think “lie” is exactly right. But the argument for that will emerge later, in section II. The noble lie is to serve as charter myth for Plato's good city: a myth of national or civic identity - or rather, two related myths, one grounding that identity in the natural brotherhood of the entire indigenous population (they are all autochthonous, literally born from the earth), the other making the city's differentiated class structure a matter of divine dispensation (the god who molds them puts different metals in their souls).

[Tero]

Sorry, kevbo is not coming back. I just used the thread to underline the impossibility of anyone actually writing Genesis, if there was a Genesis.

[FBM]

I just noticed the date on the OP and the number of kevbo's posts. Ah, well, maybe someone will find that info useful someday. :sighsm: