Noisy neighbors to the north acting up again. o,0

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Re: Noisy neighbors to the north acting up again. o,0

Post by JimC » Wed Nov 24, 2010 8:31 pm

Clinton Huxley wrote:
Deep Sea Isopod wrote:Don't expect any help from the UK
Meant to mention that when CES called for a "British carrier group" as part of a military option. What carrier group?

We could send a sternly worded letter. If someone lends us the money for a stamp.
I think he said the same about "Australian forces steaming north" :hehe:

We might be able to spare an elderly frigate with a 75 mm gun... :eddy:

And we might be able to scrape up an infantry company (fleshed out with a Kiwi platoon, of course...)
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Re: Noisy neighbors to the north acting up again. o,0

Post by FBM » Thu Nov 25, 2010 12:18 am

The story is slipping from the headlines of the international news sites, so I imagine interest is waning. Hope you'll endure one more update from a local source:
Conservatives vent fury over Lee’s soft response to attack



Anger from conservatives - even the ruling Grand National Party - over the administration’s soft reaction to North Korea’s deadly shelling of Yeonpyeong Island boiled over yesterday.

The military also came under heavy criticism for failing to react more strongly. Lawmakers grilled Minister of National Defense Kim Tae-young about the armed forces’ initial counterattack on the North, saying the military should have responded more ruthlessly, including conducting an air strike on the guns used in the attack.

Tuesday’s artillery barrage on the island near the western inter-Korean border was the first North Korean attack on South Korean soil since the Armistice Agreement ended the Korean War in 1953. It was also the second deadly attack on the South in less than eight months. The North torpedoed the warship Cheonan in March, which Pyongyang denies.

President Lee Myung-bak had roller-coaster reactions to the attack throughout the day on Tuesday as Blue House officials repeatedly changed the tone of what Lee said.

Shortly after Tuesday’s attack, Lee was quoted by the presidential office during an emergency meeting that the government must “do everything to prevent the situation from escalating into a full-blown war.”

Blue House senior presidential secretary for public affairs, Hong Sang-pyo, retracted that remark a few hours later and flatly rejected that Lee had ordered the military to refrain from taking any actions that could escalate the situation. The denial was reiterated by the presidential chief of staff, Yim Tae-hee, at a National Assembly hearing yesterday.

Later Tuesday night, Lee visited the Joint Chiefs of Staff, and Blue House officials quoted the president ordering “powerful retaliation if the North stages additional provocations,” including a strike on a missile base if necessary.

“The retaliation must be so powerful that the North would never provoke again,” Lee was quoted as saying.

Conservatives were upset about the president’s initial response. Even the ruling Grand Nationals raised their voices at a meeting of lawmakers to criticize the Blue House’s tepid handling of the situation.

GNP Representative Hong Sa-duk attacked the Blue House’s soft stance.

“Let me say a word about those bastards at the Blue House who advised the president to say the situation should be managed to avoid a full-blown war,” Hong said. “They must all be fired for advising the president to have such a weak response.”

Said GNP Representative Song Kwang-ho: “What did our military do for an hour after the North’s attack? The game is all over and what stern countermeasures are we talking about?

“We must use all our firepower to devastate the North if a single round of shell lands here,” Song added.

GNP lawmakers shouted their agreement. Criticizing the military leadership for doing nothing while waiting for orders from above, Song said Lee should fire the defense minister and top military officials, including the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff. The conservative opposition Liberty Forward Party was the first to condemn the Blue House on Tuesday.

“The [president’s] order to avoid a full-blown war could have put a break on the military employing swift and overpowering countermeasures, so that’s just wrong,” said Lee Hoi-chang, head of the LFP.

At the National Assembly, lawmakers grilled Defense Minister Kim as to whether the military’s immediate countermeasure was swift and powerful enough to counter the North’s attack. The North fired 170 rounds of artillery while the South fired back 80 rounds. According to the military, the North concentrated its shelling for 21 minutes starting at 2:34 p.m. and then paused until it launched a second barrage at 3:10. The second attack continued for 31 minutes. It took 13 minutes for the South to fire back at the North after the initial attack.

“If you had used our Air Force capability from the beginning and completely destroyed the North’s guns, there would have been no second attack,” said GNP Representative Chung Mi-kyung to the defense minister.

She also criticized the military for only firing 80 rounds in return.

Said Kim in reply: “If we had used our Air Force capability, the North probably would have been unable to stage the second attack. But that could have led to a full-blown war.”

He also said 90 of the 170 rounds that the North fired went into the sea.

GNP lawmaker Kim Jang-soo, who served as a defense minister in the Roh Moo-hyun administration, urged the military to act more aggressively.

“The military’s countermeasure to the second attack was disappointing,” he said. “It is understandable to counter the first shelling with the K-9 artillery system, but we should have countered the second attack with a ruthless surgical air strike.

“If there is another provocation, you should hit them hard, even if it will cost your minister’s post,” Kim said.


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Re: Noisy neighbors to the north acting up again. o,0

Post by Trolldor » Thu Nov 25, 2010 1:07 am

In other words:

"Rawr, you should have escalated and engaged in another war!"
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Re: Noisy neighbors to the north acting up again. o,0

Post by Coito ergo sum » Thu Nov 25, 2010 1:18 pm

Clinton Huxley wrote:
Deep Sea Isopod wrote:Don't expect any help from the UK
Meant to mention that when CES called for a "British carrier group" as part of a military option. What carrier group?

We could send a sternly worded letter. If someone lends us the money for a stamp.
Don't you have, like, the HMS Illustrious?

You blighters should never have given up your colonies. You can't afford anything now that you have nobody to exploit.

At least throw in your Bay and Albion Class landing ship/platform docks, send over a submarine, and throw in you helicopter carrier, HMS Ocean.

You Brits can still fight, but more and more you're fighting with a French accent.... :biggrin:

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Re: Noisy neighbors to the north acting up again. o,0

Post by Coito ergo sum » Thu Nov 25, 2010 1:21 pm

The Mad Hatter wrote:In other words:

"Rawr, you should have escalated and engaged in another war!"
Arguably, artillery barrages on a neighboring country, destroying buildings, including homes, and killing civilians, as well as military personnel, is itself an "escalation" and an act of war.

These things are done by the DPRK for reasons. They aren't just crazed lunatics. If this is let go, it changes the dynamic. It reinforces the DPRK's claim to a farther south sea boundary line, and that island. Maybe the DPRK will do some military exercises in the waters around that island. Would you allow that? Or, would "escalate?"

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Re: Noisy neighbors to the north acting up again. o,0

Post by Clinton Huxley » Thu Nov 25, 2010 4:11 pm

Coito ergo sum wrote:
Clinton Huxley wrote:
Deep Sea Isopod wrote:Don't expect any help from the UK
Meant to mention that when CES called for a "British carrier group" as part of a military option. What carrier group?

We could send a sternly worded letter. If someone lends us the money for a stamp.
Don't you have, like, the HMS Illustrious?

You blighters should never have given up your colonies. You can't afford anything now that you have nobody to exploit.

At least throw in your Bay and Albion Class landing ship/platform docks, send over a submarine, and throw in you helicopter carrier, HMS Ocean.

You Brits can still fight, but more and more you're fighting with a French accent.... :biggrin:
We could send Prince William....
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Re: Noisy neighbors to the north acting up again. o,0

Post by Gawdzilla Sama » Thu Nov 25, 2010 4:12 pm

CO-HOST: How would you handle a situation like the one that just developed in North Korea? [...]

PALIN: But obviously, we've got to stand with our North Korean allies. We're bound to by treaty -

CO-HOST: South Korean.

PALIN: Eh, Yeah. And we're also bound by prudence to stand with our South Korean allies, yes.
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Re: Noisy neighbors to the north acting up again. o,0

Post by Robert_S » Thu Nov 25, 2010 4:27 pm

Gawdzilla wrote:CO-HOST: How would you handle a situation like the one that just developed in North Korea? [...]

PALIN: But obviously, we've got to stand with our North Korean allies. We're bound to by treaty -

CO-HOST: South Korean.

PALIN: Eh, Yeah. And we're also bound by prudence to stand with our South Korean allies, yes.
Genius!!!! We'll become allies with the North, build bases on their territory to operate from and then and invade the South FOR them!

What could possibly go wrong? :dunno:
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Re: Noisy neighbors to the north acting up again. o,0

Post by Gawdzilla Sama » Thu Nov 25, 2010 4:41 pm

Robert_S wrote:
Gawdzilla wrote:CO-HOST: How would you handle a situation like the one that just developed in North Korea? [...]

PALIN: But obviously, we've got to stand with our North Korean allies. We're bound to by treaty -

CO-HOST: South Korean.

PALIN: Eh, Yeah. And we're also bound by prudence to stand with our South Korean allies, yes.
Genius!!!! We'll become allies with the North, build bases on their territory to operate from and then and invade the South FOR them!

What could possibly go wrong? :dunno:
Well, Sarah is a Yankee, so anything with "North" in it is automatically an ally of Alaska. And/or the US.
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Re: Noisy neighbors to the north acting up again. o,0

Post by FBM » Thu Nov 25, 2010 11:19 pm

Gawdzilla wrote:CO-HOST: How would you handle a situation like the one that just developed in North Korea? [...]

PALIN: But obviously, we've got to stand with our North Korean allies. We're bound to by treaty -

CO-HOST: South Korean.

PALIN: Eh, Yeah. And we're also bound by prudence to stand with our South Korean allies, yes.
Good gravy. I thought you were making that up, but...http://www.boingboing.net/2010/11/24/pa ... gotta.html
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Re: Noisy neighbors to the north acting up again. o,0

Post by Gawdzilla Sama » Thu Nov 25, 2010 11:21 pm

FBM wrote:
Gawdzilla wrote:CO-HOST: How would you handle a situation like the one that just developed in North Korea? [...]

PALIN: But obviously, we've got to stand with our North Korean allies. We're bound to by treaty -

CO-HOST: South Korean.

PALIN: Eh, Yeah. And we're also bound by prudence to stand with our South Korean allies, yes.
Good gravy. I thought you were making that up, but...http://www.boingboing.net/2010/11/24/pa ... gotta.html
Too stupid to be a joke.
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Re: Noisy neighbors to the north acting up again. o,0

Post by Hermit » Fri Nov 26, 2010 12:46 am

Coito ergo sum wrote:...not keen on being under Chinese yolk.
Sorry, but I find that funny.

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Re: Noisy neighbors to the north acting up again. o,0

Post by Gawdzilla Sama » Fri Nov 26, 2010 1:25 am

Seraph wrote:
Coito ergo sum wrote:...not keen on being under Chinese yolk.
Sorry, but I find that funny.

The limitations of spell checkers can leave egg on face.
Smell checkers are infallible. :lay:
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Re: Noisy neighbors to the north acting up again. o,0

Post by Ronja » Fri Nov 26, 2010 4:21 am

Gawdzilla wrote:
Seraph wrote:
Coito ergo sum wrote:...not keen on being under Chinese yolk.
Sorry, but I find that funny.

The limitations of spell checkers can leave egg on face.
Smell checkers are infallible. :lay:
:hehe: :hehe: :hehe:
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Re: Noisy neighbors to the north acting up again. o,0

Post by Clinton Huxley » Fri Nov 26, 2010 7:57 am

Gawdzilla wrote:
Seraph wrote:
Coito ergo sum wrote:...not keen on being under Chinese yolk.
Sorry, but I find that funny.

The limitations of spell checkers can leave egg on face.
Smell checkers are infallible. :lay:
I predict this war will be ova before its begun.
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