Suicide intervention discussion

[maiforpeace]

The subject is suicide being noble?

I think it can be. It can also be a rational choice at times or at least seem so rational that I wouldn't judge anyone for doing it. I have a friend who is likely to kill himself in the next few weeks. He has himself boxed in so bad that his situation leaves everyone speechless.

We'll see how I feel if he actually does it. Unfortunately he has expressed and interest and a plan to steal my 45 to get the job done with.

I'm so sorry your friend is in such pain.

May I ask what why he is contemplating suicide?

[SpeedOfSound]

The subject is suicide being noble?

I think it can be. It can also be a rational choice at times or at least seem so rational that I wouldn't judge anyone for doing it. I have a friend who is likely to kill himself in the next few weeks. He has himself boxed in so bad that his situation leaves everyone speechless.

We'll see how I feel if he actually does it. Unfortunately he has expressed and interest and a plan to steal my 45 to get the job done with.

I'm so sorry your friend is in such pain.

May I ask what why he is contemplating suicide?

Too complicated and personal to explain. He can't stay sober and his life is quickly evaporating. I'm trying to decide whether or not to 911 him this time. The thing is you hear them threaten so many times and not do it that you don't know when the cops busting in the door is the thing to do. He keeps getting in deeper and deeper and then sobering up for a month then back in deeper. Fuck. I have to figure out what to do.

The thing is if he killed himself now I wouldn't be pissed at him. I'd do it too if I were in his shoes.

[Feck]

The subject is suicide being noble?

I think it can be. It can also be a rational choice at times or at least seem so rational that I wouldn't judge anyone for doing it. I have a friend who is likely to kill himself in the next few weeks. He has himself boxed in so bad that his situation leaves everyone speechless.

We'll see how I feel if he actually does it. Unfortunately he has expressed and interest and a plan to steal my 45 to get the job done with.

I'm so sorry your friend is in such pain.

May I ask what why he is contemplating suicide?

Too complicated and personal to explain. He can't stay sober and his life is quickly evaporating. I'm trying to decide whether or not to 911 him this time. The thing is you hear them threaten so many times and not do it that you don't know when the cops busting in the door is the thing to do. He keeps getting in deeper and deeper and then sobering up for a month then back in deeper. Fuck. I have to figure out what to do.

The thing is if he killed himself now I wouldn't be pissed at him. I'd do it too if I were in his shoes.

Does he have anybody that needs him ? seems there is a chance he could sober up but ,from how you put it his drinking has caused a whole heap of extra problems .As to what you should do ,only you can answer that . I wouldn't let him use your gun unless you are Certain about it .

[SpeedOfSound]

I wouldn't let him use your gun unless you are Certain about it .

Oh hell no! I'm taking precautions on that. I have so many levels of locks on my doors that it takes me an hour to get out.

[Robert_S]

The subject is suicide being noble?

I think it can be. It can also be a rational choice at times or at least seem so rational that I wouldn't judge anyone for doing it. I have a friend who is likely to kill himself in the next few weeks. He has himself boxed in so bad that his situation leaves everyone speechless.

We'll see how I feel if he actually does it. Unfortunately he has expressed and interest and a plan to steal my 45 to get the job done with.

I'm so sorry your friend is in such pain.

May I ask what why he is contemplating suicide?

Too complicated and personal to explain. He can't stay sober and his life is quickly evaporating. I'm trying to decide whether or not to 911 him this time. The thing is you hear them threaten so many times and not do it that you don't know when the cops busting in the door is the thing to do. He keeps getting in deeper and deeper and then sobering up for a month then back in deeper. Fuck. I have to figure out what to do.

The thing is if he killed himself now I wouldn't be pissed at him. I'd do it too if I were in his shoes.

Hey Speed! Nice to see you again.

Sorry to hear about your friend though, I hope he finds some peace somehow.

[Cunt]

I wouldn't let him use your gun unless you are Certain about it .

Oh hell no! I'm taking precautions on that. I have so many levels of locks on my doors that it takes me an hour to get out.

If you don't want him using your gun - be rid of it. (at least for now) It's the surest.

Handling guns may be different where you live, and I understand if you need it around. If you don't, though, it's a serious complication waiting to happen.

Find someone to lend it to and lock it up. All legal and proper, too.

At least that is my best suggestion. About the friend I have little to offer that wouldn't sound like meaningless platitudes.

I hope your friend gets some satisfaction.

I hope your friend finds reasons to live.

[kiki5711]

I went through a dark period in my life. Around 19 yrs of age. Lots of confusion, everything seemed out of reach. Love appeared to be just an illusion. Living like my parents, plain, racist, old world, seemed like psychotic, too much partying, exhausting, going to school, useless, the guys I liked were either gay or married or had girlfriends much prettier than me, basically hopeless feeling towards life...etc...

It was joining a church and turning my mind towards hope that made me change. It transformed me and I learned about myself in ways I never did before. Eventually I left the church but I left with new power inside. It was good for me and I never will regret going through that religious experience.

I'm not saying for anyone else it would be good, but it helped me.

[mistermack]

Most people would agree that we should prevent someone being murdered, if we can.
What about a schizophrenic? Where someone has a real split personality? Should we prevent the one who want's to end it all, to save the one that wants to live?

If so, aren't we all a little bit schizoid? We want on thing one minute, another the next. Especially if we are contemplating suicide. Shouldn't we protect the rational side from the suicidal side?
.

[kiki5711]

Most people would agree that we should prevent someone being murdered, if we can.
What about a schizophrenic? Where someone has a real split personality? Should we prevent the one who want's to end it all, to save the one that wants to live?

If so, aren't we all a little bit schizoid? We want on thing one minute, another the next. Especially if we are contemplating suicide. Shouldn't we protect the rational side from the suicidal side?
.

which side are you talking to?

[Cunt]

Most people would agree that we should prevent someone being murdered, if we can.
What about a schizophrenic? Where someone has a real split personality? Should we prevent the one who want's to end it all, to save the one that wants to live?

If so, aren't we all a little bit schizoid? We want on thing one minute, another the next. Especially if we are contemplating suicide. Shouldn't we protect the rational side from the suicidal side?
.

Who decides what is 'rational'?

It is fairly easy to medicate someone out of suicide ideation, but who decides when a suicide is the wrong answer?

Plus, I see you are back, does that mean you have decided to accept my answer and move forward?

[mistermack]

Who decides what is 'rational'?

You tell me. Or do you not care whether a person is rational or not?
Do you think that a person who appears clearly irrational to others should be allowed to commit suicide?

It is fairly easy to medicate someone out of suicide ideation, but who decides when a suicide is the wrong answer?

If chemicals can change suicidal intentions, then they can also cause them. This is well documented, it's been shown over and over again in double blind trials, and warnings are printed on many medications saying that the patient should immediatly stop taking it, if they experience thoughts of suicide. I've read it myself on something I was taking, that was nothing to do with mental health or moods.

If chemicals you ingest can cause this, then so can chemicals that your body produces. I think I mentioned before that my mother went through hell, before a hysterectomy changed her life.

My nephew also had a terrible time, in his late teens, and my sister was terrified he would end it all. It disappeared when he stopped taking an acne treatment. But that treatment was apparently responsible for many deaths.

Do you think suicide can ever be the right answer, if the thoughts are due to chemical imbalance?

Plus, I see you are back, does that mean you have decided to accept my answer

I didn't know you had one.

and move forward?

Not in the direction you're pointing.

What's your answer to the schizophrenic question. Should you stop someone, if only one side wants to end it all?
.

[camoguard]

Who decides what is 'rational'?

You tell me. Or do you not care whether a person is rational or not?
Do you think that a person who appears clearly irrational to others should be allowed to commit suicide?

It is fairly easy to medicate someone out of suicide ideation, but who decides when a suicide is the wrong answer?

If chemicals can change suicidal intentions, then they can also cause them. This is well documented, it's been shown over and over again in double blind trials, and warnings are printed on many medications saying that the patient should immediatly stop taking it, if they experience thoughts of suicide. I've read it myself on something I was taking, that was nothing to do with mental health or moods.

If chemicals you ingest can cause this, then so can chemicals that your body produces. I think I mentioned before that my mother went through hell, before a hysterectomy changed her life.

My nephew also had a terrible time, in his late teens, and my sister was terrified he would end it all. It disappeared when he stopped taking an acne treatment. But that treatment was apparently responsible for many deaths.

Do you think suicide can ever be the right answer, if the thoughts are due to chemical imbalance?

Plus, I see you are back, does that mean you have decided to accept my answer

I didn't know you had one.

and move forward?

Not in the direction you're pointing.

What's your answer to the schizophrenic question. Should you stop someone, if only one side wants to end it all?
.

If we have perfect data, then we can make a better decision sure. But we don't. It's neither an individual's job nor in his/her means to run the battery of tests that might give us those answers. Also, it's not our job to make them want to live. Intervention is well intentioned but if your chemicals are out of whack it is reasonable to go "my machine self is fucked up, I quit."

[Trolldor]

With all due respect, thinking that someone who wants to commit suicide is capable of making that decision rationally is just fucking ignorant.
Unless you're terminally ill, suicide is not a logical decision.

[Gallstones]

The subject is suicide being noble?

I think it can be. It can also be a rational choice at times or at least seem so rational that I wouldn't judge anyone for doing it. I have a friend who is likely to kill himself in the next few weeks. He has himself boxed in so bad that his situation leaves everyone speechless.

We'll see how I feel if he actually does it. Unfortunately he has expressed and interest and a plan to steal my 45 to get the job done with.

I'm so sorry your friend is in such pain.

May I ask what why he is contemplating suicide?

Too complicated and personal to explain. He can't stay sober and his life is quickly evaporating. I'm trying to decide whether or not to 911 him this time. The thing is you hear them threaten so many times and not do it that you don't know when the cops busting in the door is the thing to do. He keeps getting in deeper and deeper and then sobering up for a month then back in deeper. Fuck. I have to figure out what to do.

The thing is if he killed himself now I wouldn't be pissed at him. I'd do it too if I were in his shoes.

Voicing the plan, and not doing it right away, then voicing it again, does not mean that they don't mean it. It means the time is coming but has not yet arrived quite.

[Gallstones]

Which comes first, intoxicants then suicide ideation, or distress then intoxication?

Using alcohol/drugs is probably a regular thing for people who are in the I-don't-want-to-live-anymore state of mind. The alcohol/drugs are the temporary death, the hope being that they can cut enough of the top off the distress to make existing bearable for another day. I highly doubt that being drunk is itself enough to be the cause of a suicide that would never have been considered while sober.