My Life as a Unitarian

[Tero]

No, I am not religious.

I have been to enough sermons, though, to know what church is in the USA. It is just like the one in Simpsons. Except for the Westborough and Baptist camps.

But it had to do with our children. We did not want to have them pick up religion on the street. The Unitarians have an excellent survey for 8th graders. Plus my son had a different issue, I will explain if needed.

So we spent a year or two with them. It was impossible not to like them. They are rational liberals. And the only arm twisting was for money. Very gentle.

So we spent a year or two. The sermons were more like Garrison Keillor monologues.

I gave some money once in a while for this and that cause. Plus a pledge check every two months. I do not think the money was wasted, though other causes were also available. Save the whales etc.

It was already in my second month I found all my answers about religion. We were carrying junk to the dumpster and I found Joseph McCabe booklets. Any lingering doubts....very few...about life, god universe etc. were there.
http://www.infidels.org/library/histori ... ought.html

I much prefer McCabe, another Brit, to Dawkins. I like Dawkins mostly for the biology.

I have been an agnostic since at lest the age of 16. My IQ is not so high that I would have figured it out prior to puberty. Though my kids are both in 120 to 130 IQ range. But you inherit that from mom.

Oh yes, mom, it was partly her idea. She was never baptized. Women and atheism/religion is explained here.
http://www.rationalia.com/forum/viewtop ... 48#p541348

She is the family oriented person. Most of our friends are church goers. She will not discuss God, god or philosophy.

The local outfit:
http://www.eliotchapel.org/

I may stay there a half year more. My daughter likes the youth group. Liberal kids, hard to find in suburbia.

recently fired their pastor. I liked him. He had an atheist physicist dad.

[Hermit]

I am glad that your family found a community of rational liberals to connect with.

[Tero]

They somehow remind me of Lutherans in their frugality.

But I get good shade grown coffee at their coffee fundraiser table when I go. Sometimes, often, I just skip the sermon and go buy the coffee and chat for 15 minutes.

We do have a sort of atheist temple as well here in town, LOL
http://www.ethicalstl.org/

How is the Ethical Society religious?

The Ethical Society serves as a religious congregation in which members can build a community of friends, find inspiration and purpose, provide moral education for their children, celebrate the seasons and life events, and clarify their world views. Professional Ethical Society Leaders fill the roles of religious clergy, including meeting the pastoral needs of members, performing ceremonies, and serving as spokespeople for the congregation in the community.

Do Ethical Societies have a creed?

No.

have been there once for some event. It might have been a concert.

[Ayaan]

That's not all that far from where Zilla and I live. Glad you've found a place you like, Tero.

[tattuchu]

If they're good people, and you like their company, then that's cool. Do these folks really believe in God, though? How can someone be rational and still believe in God? If the sermons are enjoyable, then you've certainly found an unusual church. I think I'd enjoy listening to them myself. Except when the subject of God comes up, as it inevitably does. That makes me wince, and it'd be kind of hard to take anything that was said in the sermon seriously at that point. It pretty much spoils the whole affair.

Why did you feel your kids needed a religion? They don't have to pick it up on the street. You could just talk to them about it. You say they're smart. How do they feel about this? Do they actually believe in God? Or is it more a case of enjoying the company of some decent people?

When I was a teenager, I walked out of a youth group meeting. I just couldn't stomach it anymore, couldn't live the lie. The pastor/teacher (whatever the hell he was) came out after me and asked me what was up. I told him I was an atheist, had always been an atheist, and was just never going to believe the things he was saying. He surprised me by telling me I didn't have to believe, that I could take from the lessons what I wanted, and that it was totally up to me. He just asked me politely if I'd give it a chance. So I did for a while. But it all seemed pointless. Eventually I refused to go to church altogether. My parents were displeased, to say the least (threatened to withhold Christmas presents, because of course it's all about Jesus, nevermind the constant focus on Santa Claus and tree decoration). They weren't as understanding as the pastor. I wonder, however if the pastor would have been quite so understanding if I hadn't gone back into the lessons and simply kept my mouth shut, as I did. How would he have reacted if I had questioned or challenged everything he was saying?
Anyway, that was a United Methodist church. As far as churches go, it wasn't bad at all. The people were nice enough there. They still seemed kinda creepy to me, though, in a Stepford Wives kind of way.

[maiforpeace]

They somehow remind me of Lutherans in their frugality.

But I get good shade grown coffee at their coffee fundraiser table when I go. Sometimes, often, I just skip the sermon and go buy the coffee and chat for 15 minutes.

We do have a sort of atheist temple as well here in town, LOL
http://www.ethicalstl.org/

How is the Ethical Society religious?

The Ethical Society serves as a religious congregation in which members can build a community of friends, find inspiration and purpose, provide moral education for their children, celebrate the seasons and life events, and clarify their world views. Professional Ethical Society Leaders fill the roles of religious clergy, including meeting the pastoral needs of members, performing ceremonies, and serving as spokespeople for the congregation in the community.

Do Ethical Societies have a creed?

No.

have been there once for some event. It might have been a concert.

I'm a member of Ethical Culture. I love the community - it's warm and caring, and I really feel I have grown and learned a lot being a member of it. Most importantly, for me, I get to do work in the community with like minded people - too often volunteer work has a religious bent.

In fact, today I'm getting ready to frost some carrot cake cupcakes to support our youth group for a bake sale to raise money for kids in Haiti.http://www.ethicalsiliconvalley.org/special-events.html

The St. Louis society is the largest society in the country - and has a fabulous leader, Kate Lovelady. Say hi to her for me if you visit.

[Tero]

Why did you feel your kids needed a religion? They don't have to pick it up on the street. You could just talk to them about it. You say they're smart. How do they feel about this? Do they actually believe in God? Or is it more a case of enjoying the company of some decent people?

Some Unitarian groups are more Christianity oriented than others. The point was not to serve religion and then have them pick one, but just to teach them what religions are. So they can relate to religious people.

I think some of our congregation are a bit too new agey for me.

Others just are not able to function alone, need a support group. I do not think there is an atheist group, but you never know. A few are mixed religion families, Jew and some other for instance.

[Tero]

I'm a member of Ethical Culture. I love the community - it's warm and caring, and I really feel I have grown and learned a lot being a member of it. Most importantly, for me, I get to do work in the community with like minded people - too often volunteer work has a religious bent.

In fact, today I'm getting ready to frost some carrot cake cupcakes to support our youth group for a bake sale to raise money for kids in Haiti.http://www.ethicalsiliconvalley.org/special-events.html

The St. Louis society is the largest society in the country - and has a fabulous leader, Kate Lovelady. Say hi to her for me if you visit.

OK, thanks. I try to pretty much stay back, though. I will do some work once in a while. Cleaned all the church rain gutters one year.

[charlou]

Tero, it's interesting to learn a bit more about you and your family.

They still seemed kinda creepy to me, though, in a Stepford Wives kind of way.

I got that impression of many church goers as a child too .. though of course the Stepford Wives analog comes with hindsight from my perspective: it fits.

[Rum]

Thanks for your post Tero. From this side of the Atlantic it confirms what I have sometimes thought about Churches in America - that people often join or remain with them because of the benefits of being part of a community which has a cohesion and perhaps offers a social framework too for some. Given how un-dogmatic I know Unitarian churches can be - to the point pretty much of accommodating agnosticism, I guess that must be the attraction.

No harm in that of course!

[hiyymer]

Thanks for your post Tero. From this side of the Atlantic it confirms what I have sometimes thought about Churches in America - that people often join or remain with them because of the benefits of being part of a community which has a cohesion and perhaps offers a social framework too for some. Given how un-dogmatic I know Unitarian churches can be - to the point pretty much of accommodating agnosticism, I guess that must be the attraction.

No harm in that of course!

The traditional Unitarian church that I grew up in was a specific deistic theology. Christ was viewed as a great prophet, not divine. God was the great watch maker who set it all in motion and then took a vacation. The Sunday sermons were about the bible and Christ, but taken as entirely mythological and metaphorical. The perfect "Christian religion" for a rationalist. It was called Unitarian because it rejected the trinity.

Unitarianism, partly by merging with the Universalists, has drifted away from it's theistic Christian roots and now means more the Universalist thing of avoiding any dogma at all. Probably an improvement.

I should add that Unitarianism of all ilks has always had a strong social activism bent to it.

[Tero]

I may not hang in there all that long, but they can eventually do my funeral, where-ever that may be. It was good enough for Kurt Vonnegut, its good enough for me.

The function is mainly about the kids. Unitarians are also widely known as Atheists With Kids. I only regret not doing it earlier, because by age 15 they are done with religion. We started at 13 and 16, this time would have been better.

[Tero]

I was on the verge of dropping the Unitarians, but my daughter is still somehow attached. She may end up marrying some theis* some day, so maybe she needs tools to deal with it.

*they are everywhere, even some atheists are closet theists.

[Tero]

Have come to an agreement that we will stop attending by March when the pledge period ends. That's right. Touchy feely Unitarians...well, slightly more so than Lutherans...also need money.

[Tero]

My daughter still likes to hang out with the youth group. If she has these spriritual issues later in life, she can seek out Unitarians. Also a good place for gender issues.

Due to the fact we were attending, I had to go through a personal search the past 3 or 4 years. I was always an agnostic up to then, finally I did all this research:


and discovered there are no answers, but most of dogma is wrong. The big pile of paper on to of the binder is going to be used to print on the back of. I kept 20 pages of Joseph McCabe. God Delusion went to the Unitarian book sale. I still have a King James Bible for reference and entertainment but the search is over. Spirituality may be a group event and some may enjoy the community and charity.