Translation Please

[eXcommunicate]

... but he knew he would be resurrected.

Another thing to think about is the whole supposed "sacrifice" of Jesus. I don't think it was much of a sacrifice if he KNEW he was going to be resurrected and going to Heaven. It would have been much more of a sacrifice if he had to dwell in Hell for eternity in order to pay for all our continual sins. But no, he's rockin the robe up in Heaven for the past 2000-odd years. I am sure there are some apologetics for this.

[CTC]

How can God have doubts about himself?

Himself, no. But since he's, you know, Sky Pops, he clearly doesn't believe he was created by a higher power and is therefore an atheist. And you know what giant skeptics we all are.

[T. Kari]

I think it's pretty obvious, actually. To wit: "Jesus AKA Son of God AKA God had doubts about his divinity and so on and so forth, yet he saved us all (well, those who pass certain qualifications anyway). So you, as a mere Christian sinner, can absolutely have doubts about the veracity of the teaching of the church and indeed about the very existence of the divine itself and remain a Christian, and be saved at the end of the day".

[Sisifo]

It is very well explained here.

[Faust5]

The whole "Jesus doubting himself" thing really depends on what gospel you read.

The Christian view of Jesus' death as a willing self-sacrifice comes from John. For example, in Matthew and Mark Jesus exclaims "My god! My god! why hast thou forsaken me?" and then dies. In Luke, he tells dad that he's comin up, and in John just says "It is finished."

Here's a good site with side-by-side accounts of the crucifixion: The Crucifixion

I learned this, and so much more, from my Bible class last semester. I strongly recommend taking such a course, especially if the professor happens to be skeptical too: mine focused on canonization, and how believing in such a God might have helped ancient Israelites survive. Kind of a group-evolutionary take on it.

[week15]

Don't dismiss the ninth hour plea: "My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?" Seems a pretty strange thing for a being with perfect foreknowledge and assurance of his own divinity to bother asking. Sounds more like multiple personality disorder on the part of the omnipotent or some guy that just realized that his innocent, little joke about being the son of God had gone way, way too far.

[Faust5]

Hmm, I'm sure that's true- if it was me up on a cross, I'm sure I would say worse than that. I was simply pointing out the inconsistencies- four supposedly divinely-inspired accounts of the most significant act in their religion differ greatly, from deep despair to supposedly divine self-sacrifice.

[week15]

Hmm, I'm sure that's true- if it was me up on a cross, I'm sure I would say worse than that. I was simply pointing out the inconsistencies- four supposedly divinely-inspired accounts of the most significant act in their religion differ greatly, from deep despair to supposedly divine self-sacrifice.

Sorry, my response was actually a back-track to the original thread (didn't see you sneak in-- I type slow). Yes, absolutely fair to point out the inconsistencies. My father spent twelve years in religious education (Calvinist), and seemed to have no knowledge of the problem. Have you read The Mythmaker: Paul and the Invention of Christianity by Hyam Maccoby? He takes a historical look at those inconsistencies-- and vilifies Paul, as the title suggests.

[FBM]

I can see jeebus sneaking off to Gethsemane, hiding behind a bush, looking up and saying, "You want me to do what?!"

[Faust5]

@Week15- that's alright, I was worried my biblical discussion cast me as a believer, and wanted to allay that misconception. No, I haven't read that book unfortunately- I'll put it on the list, after some Hitchens, Dennet, Harris, and a re-read of Dawkins. Oh, and Ingersoll. That book sounds very informative though- plenty to criticize about Paul!

[Apogee]

'eh... It's actually something that discussed a lot among church groups.

Essentially, it's clear Jesus did not doubt his divinity, he also did not doubt "the father". He could have been said to have doubt about the current practices. But his faith was "perfect" so to say. He was, however, constantly tempted. It could be doubts about whether he could overcome those temptations, although him having "perfect faith" would seem to say not... but he knew he would be resurrected.



Maybe the person who wrote that question(which is very poorly worded) forgot to add "seriously? Anyone? I don't know the answer!"

Really, it's all just bullshit, and they don't really know what they are talking about. But the above is what a christian reply might look like.

But it makes absolutely zero sense! :/ I cannot possibly believe that anyone can find this credulous in any way. But somehow they do, I don't get it.

It really doesn't, which is why the bible requires so much deliberation and discussion and translation. It's to get around all the contradictions. Christians like to claim that they aren't contradictions, it's just that the word of god is very complex, and the contradictions are really just meant to be interpreted.