Announcement about RDF Part 2.

[Reverend Blair]

In fact, Peter, your blog could serve as the basis for a movie on the rise and fall of RDF. Now who could play that snake Josh?

Perhaps Tom Waits could revive his Renfield character. http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x2ouzv ... shortfilms

[riddlemethis]

I think I need to play Devil's Advocate here, and I don't mean that pinball machine from a certain Simpsons episode.

I am with you in that I am frustrated and disappointed in what has happened. But the fact is, we don't know just WHAT happened. I was thinking a little, and I strongly suspect this is a legal issue. I seriously doubt that Josh-- or anybody-- would make such a drastic move for the sake of going on a power trip. I would guess that the Foundation was likely given some kind of ultimatum, something that would take their status away as a charity and tax exempt. I'm not defending the decisions made, but when something like this happens, there has to be a reason. I wouldn't be surprised if Josh was instructed by lawyers to delete anybody who fought back, to defriend RDFers on Facebook that he didn't know, and so forth.

It makes me think of when Ren and Stimpy was hijacked from John Kricfalusi, the show's creator. I was twelve years old when I first learned about that, and as I understood it, it was all about Nickelodeon execs wanting to censor material. Years later, in animation school, I learned the real story: John K and his team were missing deadlines and were constantly going over budget.

The moral is this: It's horribly frustrating, but it's never as simple as you think. I'm not saying to just sit back and say, "Oh fiddlesticks," but at the same time don't be so quick to judge and to disown yourself from the forum. I will continue to go there.

And as for not contacting Richard Dawkins himself... of course you wouldn't do that! I'm sure the man's busy enough without getting bombarded with emails from people about something that he has little control over. Guys, whether it's through PM or through his email account (if you have it; I don't, of course), just leave him alone.

Julie

Julie, I definitely think there is more to it too - but not in any way that paints any of them in a good light, RD included.

Let's say you are right, and the decision was made to dispense with the forum. There is no reason why RD could not have made a personal announcement to the membership base, with an explanation of the decision taken & the reasoning behind it, express his regret & give people time to find a solution for migrating the forum to a new home that was not under the auspices of his foundations name. But that didn't happen.

I'm donning my foil hat here & am going to say that there is something official/political running in the background of this, which means RD has chosen to distance himself from the commentary of the community in order to pursue some ambition which he thinks better serves his profile/mission. In a political or corporate sense there is loads of stuff that could be used in spin campaigns against him by simple virtue of the fact that the forum carries his name, irrespective of the rational position that if he isn't responsible for the opinions of anonymous internet users. Under such circumstances I can see why he would send someone else in to do a hatchet job - b/c to handle it properly himself would also be able to be used against him, especially any remorse expressed.

So, I wonder if it's a knighthood coming his way (without the potential for a shit storm that would embarrass her maj) or something else.

[hotshoe]

He is up against the internets biggest community of gobshites, and we will not go quietly into that goodnight.

The cold calm that I have clung to for the last 24 hours is leaving me now, and I am thoroughly fucking pissed off, as are others, and with every right to be so.

I think it bears repeating that Josh Timonen owns/runs Upper Branch Productions, "a full service production/distribution company specializing in documentary and Science/eductional programs".

It doesn't look like he has too many clients other than Dawkins. {edit}

And for possible leverage against Timonen's continued employment by Dawkins, we have the collective hundreds of bloggers etc saying "don't buy copies of any of the DVDs Timonen already shot"; down-rate his clips on Youtube and explain it's because of the taint of Timonen. Etc.

That forum's dead. Nothing will bring it back from the dead. But there's no excuse why that goddamned Timonen should continue to draw a paycheck for his "services".

{edit to remove extra inflammatory comment about Timonen}

[SpokesGay]

Another refugee here. I never posted even 200 times in the forum, but I was an avid reader. This is simply unbelievable, and I'm hoping fervently Richard didn't approve of how Josh Timonen handled this.

Respect to moderators Topsy (Flora on this forum), MrSamsa, Gallstones, and all the rest. You did a thankless job with aplomb, and you were treated terribly.

[Reverend Blair]

Julie, I definitely think there is more to it too - but not in any way that paints any of them in a good light, RD included.

Yeah, there's always more to it. Nobody hides the positive/reasonable things though.

Great points, riddlemethis.


I do think somebody owes us an explanation though, and I don't think anybody but Dawkins himself can give that explanation.

[HughMcB]

Personally, I'm waiting to see what transpires. If I'm not satisfied I'll post protests on the main sites until they ban me too.

Yip, I think I'm going to go on this suicide mission too.

I'll give it a few days to see what RD officially says about the whole thing, but if its not good then its a shot of sake, put on my katana and rising sun headband, and then board one last flight into the battle.

Call me when you need a wingman viphren?!

[Ilovelucy]

I don't know what aspire1670 has done but s/he's been deleted.

I'm guessing it's front page posting. By the way, there seems to be a lot of misinformation blossoming at the moment. As far as I know, no-one is being banned for emailing Richard, but that one's doing the rounds. Peter's blog is the most concise summation out there at the moment.

[rachelbean]

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Julie

Julie, I definitely think there is more to it too - but not in any way that paints any of them in a good light, RD included.

Let's say you are right, and the decision was made to dispense with the forum. There is no reason why RD could not have made a personal announcement to the membership base, with an explanation of the decision taken & the reasoning behind it, express his regret & give people time to find a solution for migrating the forum to a new home that was not under the auspices of his foundations name. But that didn't happen.

I'm donning my foil hat here & am going to say that there is something official/political running in the background of this, which means RD has chosen to distance himself from the commentary of the community in order to pursue some ambition which he thinks better serves his profile/mission. In a political or corporate sense there is loads of stuff that could be used in spin campaigns against him by simple virtue of the fact that the forum carries his name, irrespective of the rational position that if he isn't responsible for the opinions of anonymous internet users. Under such circumstances I can see why he would send someone else in to do a hatchet job - b/c to handle it properly himself would also be able to be used against him, especially any remorse expressed.

So, I wonder if it's a knighthood coming his way (without the potential for a shit storm that would embarrass her maj) or something else.

This. And even with all of that, there is NO reason to have disabled PM rights or to have banned people from discussing other communities and definitely not to have deleted accounts and posts after saying they would be up for 30 days. Even if there was total justification for shutting the boards down, the way it was done is not justifiable, no matter the circumstances.

[InYourFaceNewYorker]

Didn't someone say Richard is on a book tour in New Zealand or something? If he is going to announce or clarify something, I would imagine it would be when he gets back to England.

And guys, let's keep our heads about this. Let's be rational and not emotional. Let's wait a few days and see if we learn anything else before jumping off the deep end.

Julie

[hackenslash]

Only thing is, Richard was actually on the forum last night. It would have been a simple matter for him to make some sort of announcement, and he was clearly in touch with Josh throughout.

[riddlemethis]

Didn't someone say Richard is on a book tour in New Zealand or something? If he is going to announce or clarify something, I would imagine it would be when he gets back to England.

And guys, let's keep our heads about this. Let's be rational and not emotional. Let's wait a few days and see if we learn anything else before jumping off the deep end.

Julie

Umm why? Teh interweebz works just fine down here. . .

[RPizzle]

Didn't someone say Richard is on a book tour in New Zealand or something? If he is going to announce or clarify something, I would imagine it would be when he gets back to England.

And guys, let's keep our heads about this. Let's be rational and not emotional. Let's wait a few days and see if we learn anything else before jumping off the deep end.

Julie

[num1cubfn]

Benefit of the doubt most definitely not given in this case. The fact is that we absolutely know what happened last night, because some of us were actually there when it all went down. There was no justification, even in the face of dissent, for deleting 30,000+ posts from 5 prolific posters. That is absolutely unforgivable, IMO. Further, it is clear that the forum was to be left open until a few people voiced their disappointment, and not even in any terms that violated the FUA. Josh's actions were designed with only one purpose in mind, namely a quiet life for Josh.

Just the fact that he 'forbade' (yeah, fucking right) any attempt to contact people and give them the means to gather away from the forum, like he has any fucking say over what people do with regard to the fellowship they've built up. This clearly demonstrates that he has no idea whatsoever about people.

Problem, though. He is up against the internets biggest community of gobshites, and we will not go quietly into that goodnight.

The cold calm that I have clung to for the last 24 hours is leaving me now, and I am thoroughly fucking pissed off, as are others, and with every right to be so.

OMG Hackenslash, Julie, HughMcB, I thought I was never gonna see you guys again! I MISSED YOU ALL! (I even saw a post from caliliasseiaeieassiea, and I almost fainted I was so happy!)

It boggles my mind why the forum was closed. Yes, I understand that they did really stupid things like deleting posts and stuff, but what exactly HAPPENED to start the site's downfall?

[virphen]

[
Yip, I think I'm going to go on this suicide mission too.

I'll give it a few days to see what RD officially says about the whole thing, but if its not good then its a shot of sake, put on my katana and rising sun headband, and then board one last flight into the battle.

Call me when you need a wingman viphren?!

It makes sense to co-ordinate it with like-winded others if there are any, so I'm happy to do that if it becomes necessary. Note for my part I don't want to be needlessly disruptive, nor in any way uncivil - just to make my displeasure obvious while retaining what dignity a self-respecting ass-raping space lizard possesses.

[Ayaan]

Only thing is, Richard was actually on the forum last night. It would have been a simple matter for him to make some sort of announcement, and he was clearly in touch with Josh throughout.

By the time RD logged on, all the posts expressing discontent with the new "discussion area" had been removed. There's no telling what Josh told him about the matter.