Poll about the impact of the purge

[I'm With Stupid]

The statements they made at that time showed little evidence that they understood that, RDF esp OT was bigger ,and more important than them .
The recent changes ,they thought could be implemented without to much trouble because they had got away with it before. They did not think that a large number of prominent forum members and most of the Mods they depended on would actually take the brave stand they did .When they realised the outrage they had caused could not be put down as easily as last time they started to panic .When Ratz started leaping in and offering to rescue everyone they were left with no choice but to pull the plug . They will not cry too much about the exodus because you ALL have been labelled as trouble makers they will be vigilant that all of this is buried and say to themselves "So we lost a couple of Hundred members ,and they were the headstrong ones, we still have thousands "

Of course the reason that we left was precisely because whether we stayed or not, they would face a huge drop in participation. The forum in its current format (or yesterday's format anyway), was precisely the reason why everyone kept coming back every day. They won't do that for pre-moderated discussions purely on topics relating to reason and science. It'll effectively become like the BBC message boards or the comments section of any national newspapers. But maybe they were getting a bit jealous that far more people were coming to read what ordinary members had to say, rather than the crap littering the rest of the poorly-designed site?

[AshtonBlack]

And it had full stops and everything.

Missed a few comma's

Comma's what?

[Feck]

And it had full stops and everything.

Missed a few comma's

And apostrophe,s.

[ED209]

The statements they made at that time showed little evidence that they understood that, RDF esp OT was bigger ,and more important than them .
The recent changes ,they thought could be implemented without to much trouble because they had got away with it before. They did not think that a large number of prominent forum members and most of the Mods they depended on would actually take the brave stand they did .When they realised the outrage they had caused could not be put down as easily as last time they started to panic .When Ratz started leaping in and offering to rescue everyone they were left with no choice but to pull the plug . They will not cry too much about the exodus because you ALL have been labelled as trouble makers they will be vigilant that all of this is buried and say to themselves "So we lost a couple of Hundred members ,and they were the headstrong ones, we still have thousands "

Of course the reason that we left was precisely because whether we stayed or not, they would face a huge drop in participation. The forum in its current format (or yesterday's format anyway), was precisely the reason why everyone kept coming back every day. They won't do that for pre-moderated discussions purely on topics relating to reason and science. It'll effectively become like the BBC message boards or the comments section of any national newspapers. But maybe they were getting a bit jealous that far more people were coming to read what ordinary members had to say, rather than the crap littering the rest of the poorly-designed site?

Nail, head.

(I just spent 10 mins looking through the smiley repository for a hammer/nail smiley. Fucking hell how good are the smilies over here?)

And how much of a dog's dinner was the other site? Front page looked like fucking Ryannair.

[I'm With Stupid]

And how much of a dog's dinner was the other site? Front page looked like fucking Ryannair.

Lol, I've just been onto Ryanair to check, and that's a pretty good comparison.

[Robert_S]

As far as I can tell, RD did want the forums changed, but over a period of 30 days.

30 days would have probably given us all enough time to come to terms with the decision, wrap up current threads, look for a new place to have off-topic discussions, and adjust to the new RDF order.

I'm not happy about it, but I would have dealt with it.

The shutdown that happened was, as far as I can tell, the result of some kid named Josh being an immature kid. I don't see how that reflects badly on Richard, except that maybe he gave too much responsibility to someone who shouldn't have had it.

[Dr. Kwaltz]

I think currently the ONLY option I can possibly chose, is "Cheese and/or Bacon"

I prefer to wait and see what comes out from Dawkins himself before I revise any opinion of the good doctor.

[Randydeluxe]

I voted with the largest portion of us: "A little bit. He is still one of my favorite atheist leaders, but I feel somewhat let down."

It doesn't really matter what happens next. I'll still feel let down.

[num1cubfn]

This whole thing reeks like something out of Nabokov.

I was thinking more like Kafka.

You mean like when Josh woke up and realized he was a fucking cockroach? No, make that a "cuntroach". From the sniveling weasely way this was done it's obvious he doesn't have either a cock or balls.

I'm an RN, a doctor at the hospital I was working at told me a story about a homeless lady who was complaining of abdominal pain and itching... well, let's just say that word you made up could have been used twice.

[my_wan]

I'm not responding to the pole yet. I think Josh may have a lot more to hide from RD than we know. His draconian actions certainly indicate he does. So I'm waiting to hear RD's reaction. Still don't think I'd ever go back though. The destruction was too severe.

[Mr.Samsa]

This whole thing reeks like something out of Nabokov.

I was thinking more like Kafka.

You mean like when Josh woke up and realized he was a fucking cockroach? No, make that a "cuntroach". From the sniveling weasely way this was done it's obvious he doesn't have either a cock or balls.

I'm an RN, a doctor at the hospital I was working at told me a story about a homeless lady who was complaining of abdominal pain and itching... well, let's just say that word you made up could have been used twice.

Firstly I am saddened that my persona has been likened to Josh (although "cuntroach" appears to be a perfectly apt description of him), and secondly, I just threw up a little. Thanks num1cubfn, I didn't need that food in my stomach anyway!

[Fact-Man]

I would be surprised if Richard was fully aware of precisely what went on last night, and I also suspect that he's been led by Josh and the other techs to at least soome degree. I'll reserve judgement until I hear what he has to say himself.

I tend to agree with this assessment. Prof. Dawkins is engaged in a very busy life, I can't imagine he's ever thought much about the foundation's website, let alone the forum, which he assumed was in good hands. Josh may have purposefully misled him into even more complacency than one might expect. And Josh did take the site down when Dawkins was away on a speaking tour, which does not speak well. An anouncement as momentous as this one was should have come from Dawkins himself, not Josh.

Josh failed utterly to think about the RDF community which had grown up around the forum and its utter destruction seemed to make no difference to him, callous disregard of common human values. And that's what represents the blow this means for Prof. Dawkins, It's like napalming a Vietnamese ville. You may not be the pilot flying the plane but you're his squadron Commander and you are responsible for his behavior and his conduct and his actions.

And maltreatment of everyone aside, Dawkins will have to answer for the highly unethical treatment of members who are/were professional scientists, guys like Made of Glass and others, who'd body of posts represent a scienctific resource of great value to the public. Dawkins allowed Josh to gobsmack his ethics. His best response to that would be to fire Josh poste haste.

When I started at Northrop Aircraft in 1952 there were 8,000 employees ... and Jack Northrop. then still the President of the company, was commonly seen out ambling about the plant, shirtsleeves rolled up, talking to his employees, looking at things, feeling the hum of the place, his ear to the ground. A good leader pays attention to his field commanders and his troopers, he conducts inspections. Dawkins let this slide or was misled by Josh, or both.

And for that he will pay some kind of price, which will almost have include the issuance of a formal apology to all concerned.

I'd advise him to have no forum at all in Josh's new rendition of the site, not until he can sort this all out and figure the best way ahead forum-wise. He faces an enormous repair job.

[Spearthrower]

Until RD makes some kind of announcement about this episode, I won't comment on him. I will say that no matter his fore-knowledge or not, this episode has damaged the RD Foundation, and that is his responsibility, at the end of the day.

[heyjude]

I'm reading Carl Sagan's Demon Haunted World at the moment. I'm sure most of you have read it. It reminds me to think twice before I make decisions about something like this. All I know is what I have read about the recent events, and none of that explains what Richard Dawkin's true involvement is. All I know is that he was travelling and may have had discussions with Josh and Andrew.

I don't know the size of his staff or company, and how much he has to deal with, but I would imagine (trying to make an educated guess, but not one I am going out on a limb on) that he is very busy with travel, public appearances and publicity for his books, and his own work. Perhaps the site and forum is something that chugs along on its own, with him trusting his employees almost completely, as many managers do. Whether that was good in this case.. well.. that's another matter.

I think until he returns, or has a break in his travel, and realises the enormous SHITE that just went down, we won't know what he may think of it. Perhaps his reaction to it and how he addresses the matter is what matters. Even then, he may be fed a very different version of the truth, than what really occurred.

Whatever - this is not a good day for his Foundation, that's for sure. And it's going to bring bad publicity. Very hard to recover from, if possible at all. I would say the site is going to be a pale shadow after this...

But, in short, my emotions about being let down, which I definitely have, can't rationally be aimed at him. Need more evidence...

[heyjude]

And maltreatment of everyone aside, Dawkins will have to answer for the highly unethical treatment of members who are/were professional scientists, guys like Made of Glass and others, who'd body of posts represent a scienctific resource of great value to the public. Dawkins allowed Josh to gobsmack his ethics. His best response to that would be to fire Josh poste haste.

Absolutely! The wealth of knowledge that is going to be lost is .... tragic. Not to mention the dedication that went into writing it all by such amazing members. I agree - it's a little like a politician who screwed the pooch - time to go!

When I started at Northrop Aircraft in 1952 there were 8,000 employees ... and Jack Northrop. then still the President of the company, was commonly seen out ambling about the plant, shirtsleeves rolled up, talking to his employees, looking at things, feeling the hum of the place, his ear to the ground. A good leader pays attention to his field commanders and his troopers, he conducts inspections. Dawkins let this slide or was misled by Josh, or both.

That is what you hope for from any head of a company, and also rare. It makes a big difference. Who knows if Dawkins is even around enough to be able to do this.... if he only gets to drop in once in a while it could be pretty easy to pull the wool over his eyes and do what you want... 'while the cats away...' I have no idea. We may never find out either.