Casual conversation about being pro-social and atheist at the same time

[camoguard]

Ok. So I spent some time being publicly atheist. That worked very well in Charlottesville VA and to find some online groups (including here). Then I transferred to one of the hubs of Christianity: Tennessee. There, I shifted a little to focusing on collaborative pro-social things and being more private about my lack of belief. But it's pretty annoying to always be asked to pray after donating my time to charities. Over time, I feel that I need to go more public in support of making it easier for people who can't safely be public about nonbelief to find their community.

So, I'm not asking for a great or complete answer. But we're probably all balancing expressing who we are and making something better. You're not obligated to make stuff better. I still think many of you share that interest.

I'm looking for thoughts and conversations about what do you think should be happening for the public face of atheism. On some groups, atheists want religious nutters in for debates because it can help the nutters. And at other times, I really want to be with a group of baseline non-believers and just deal with everything else. Dealing with everything else lacks a good marketing campaign. As a lazy person, any conversation on this thread is going to help me ruminate about discussing "once you're not religious, you actually live easy doing X, Y, and Z" with nutters.

Thanks in advance for your responses.

P.S. I use non-belief and atheism in a sloppy manner intended to be inclusive of the breadth of nonbelievers and unitarians and secular humanists kinds of people.

[Hermit]

Ok. So I spent some time being publicly atheist. That worked very well in Charlottesville VA and to find some online groups (including here). Then I transferred to one of the hubs of Christianity: Tennessee. There, I shifted a little to focusing on collaborative pro-social things and being more private about my lack of belief. But it's pretty annoying to always be asked to pray after donating my time to charities. Over time, I feel that I need to go more public in support of making it easier for people who can't safely be public about nonbelief to find their community.

So, I'm not asking for a great or complete answer. But we're probably all balancing expressing who we are and making something better. You're not obligated to make stuff better. I still think many of you share that interest.

I'm looking for thoughts and conversations about what do you think should be happening for the public face of atheism. On some groups, atheists want religious nutters in for debates because it can help the nutters. And at other times, I really want to be with a group of baseline non-believers and just deal with everything else. Dealing with everything else lacks a good marketing campaign. As a lazy person, any conversation on this thread is going to help me ruminate about discussing "once you're not religious, you actually live easy doing X, Y, and Z" with nutters.

Thanks in advance for your responses.

P.S. I use non-belief and atheism in a sloppy manner intended to be inclusive of the breadth of nonbelievers and unitarians and secular humanists kinds of people.

I'd like to help, but in Australia even religious people don't make an issue of religion. We don't so much have a Bible belt as a Bible button and even they are not in the habit to evangelise or even to casually suggest the person they interact with to pray. So I really don't know what I could suggest you do.

[laklak]

I don't pray, I'll just stand there. When they ask "what church do you go to?" (common question is some parts of the South) I say "I'm not a churchgoer".

[Seabass]

I'm more or less in a similar situation to Hermit. Being on the west coast of the US, I very rarely have to deal with religious weirdness. I have literally never had someone ask me what church I go to.

I did have to participate in grace a couple times back in my twenties. A buddy's parents would have some of us over for certain holidays—probably the 4th, I don't remember which exactly. Anyway, I'd hold hands and bow my head respectfully before pigging out on their food. They're a lovely couple, some of nicest people I've ever met, and I wouldn't dream of doing anything to hurt their feelings. And besides, if someone is nice enough to feed my ass delicious homemade BBQ when I'm in my twenties, I'm happy to go along with the pre-dinner ritual since it only last but five seconds.

But for the most part, there just aren't many religious people in my circle of family/friends/acquaintances/coworkers, and the few who are tend to be the very mild Xmas/Easter variety.

[laklak]

One small branch of my side of the extended family are North Carolina evangelicals. Nice enough, I suppose, but there's this Children of the Corn vibe about them. I don't see them unless forced by some event or another. They're only related by marriage (their daughter married my nephew), so the impending birth of said nephew/their daughter's sprog will certainly occasion another looooooong, droning grace and multiple prayers. I just sit there waiting for them to finish. Some day I'm going to ask to say The Blessing, and call on the Old Gods "Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn". One side of Mrs. Lak's extended are Jehovah's Witnesses. They are serious fucking whack-job cultists, that lot. I really can't tolerate them. Luckily they live in Joburg and we spend as little time as possible there.

[JimC]

On a related topic, I have in the past spoken to religious people who are wavering to a degree (for Catholics, it was often the horrendous child abuse issues and the cover-up that affected their faith). Often, they would be saying how they cannot understand how a loving god would allow such things to happen, and all the other tribulations of our species. They had sometimes heard convoluted theological rationales to explain this basic problem from priests and others. I would gently point out that the simplest solution is that there is no god at all...

[camoguard]

Australia definitely seems more chill than Tennessee. And the west coast experience sounds that way too.

In the US though, the religiosity isn't just the south. In the military, a lot of conventions are Christian oriented. And a fair amount of leaders don't even think about that. My experience there put me in a position to be the loud mouthed atheist, which ended up working out just fine. More importantly, some of my peers would later offload their own nonbelief opinions because they knew that somebody was there. Because of that, I've had the nagging opinion that I have to get back to being visible as a nonbeliever in my private life.

I hope one day there's no religion to counter with facts. I'll even settle for accepting fiction that has no consequences like the existence of Santa Claus if in trade we get all the nonsense that has consequences dropped.

[Scot Dutchy]

Here religion is seldom discussed and usually totally ignored and left to the freedom of the individual. We still have the remnants of the bible belt where one or two small towns still have working churches but they belong to extreme protestant church. In public life no reference is made to any religion. Any ceremonies are completely void of any aspect of religion. Our royal family are non-religious. No prayers in Parliament, law courts etc. Our king was installed in a non-religious ceremony.
I dont consider myself an atheist; I am just the default and it was the religious that gave us the atheist tab. They are the exception.

[Sean Hayden]

I run into it constantly. If the kids ask I say I was raised as a Christian, and if they ask if that means I believe in Jesus, I say I wouldn't take it that far.

I just let coworkers say what they're going to say. I'm no longer interested in "helping" people see the light.

[Scot Dutchy]

I never have that problem except once with a roommate who started playing reli-rock and this was in the days of pre-headphones so 30 years or more ago. He came from the bible belt but we had a typical Dutch polder discussion and reached an agreement. If I was not in the room he could play it. My office was on the edge of the bible belt back then and we had a few nutters but nothing serious. It petered out in a few years.

[rainbow]

P.S. I use non-belief and atheism in a sloppy manner intended to be inclusive of the breadth of nonbelievers and unitarians and secular humanists kinds of people.

I don't believe in Atheists.

[Scot Dutchy]

rainbow we have an agreement.

[Hermit]

I don't believe in Atheists.

Would you please expand on that?

[rainbow]

I don't believe in Atheists.

Would you please expand on that?

Secular Agnostics is what they are.

[Hermit]

I don't believe in Atheists.

Would you please expand on that?

Secular Agnostics is what they are.

Agnostic atheists?