Big Data

[pErvinalia]

Gambling is basically legalised robbery. They try to dress it up as "entertainment", because it gives people a buzz. But you could say the same about cocaine.

I've just had this debate with a mate of mine who manages a club. He loves the pokies, as they are an important revenue stream for the club. But in all other instances he's a lefty type (and former scientist) like me. So he's being contradictory to his normal ideals.

[laklak]

They'll get my Happy Hour when they pry the beer from my cold, dead hands!

Puritans were really big on banning shit, because they figured people weren't responsible enough to make their own decisions. Middle Eastern muzzie countries do the same thing. Unfortunately we're heading down the same road. Because some percentage of numbnut morons can't handle their liquor, or weed, or slot machines, or guns, the bluestocking busybodies ban or seriously restrict those of us who don't have a problem. Fuck them and the fascist horses they rode in on. I don't care what they advertise - ciggies, beer, casinos, prescription drugs, doesn't matter, if I don't want or need it I won't buy it. The fact that some actor pretends to like Budweiser is NOT going to convince me to buy that shite, no matter how much money they spend on their commercials.

[Hermit]

That they're stupid? Probably a combination of stupid parents, poor upbringing, and McDonalds. But at the end of the day everyone is responsible for their own actions and decisions, blaming "Big Data" for their poor choices is like blaming Ted Bundy's mum for his penchant for chewing on coeds.

If advertising did not have agency nobody would bother with it. It just does not make sense to ignore this agency and shift the blame for bad decisions on the person who succumbs to it even if we postulate the existence of free will.

[mistermack]

I don't blame him, or bookmakers. They don't make the rules.
There are lots of things that I would take advantage of myself, given the chance, but would vote against on a national scale.

If the punters didn't bet on your friend's machines, they would bet on someone else's.

It's governments who allow it all to happen, and are happy to see people suffer, because they get a cut.
They are the ones who are supposedly working to make things better. They have the power to change things, so they get the blame from me.

In some ways I benefit too, from gambling. The taxes on gambling keep mine lower. And I watch free tv that's paid for by gambling ads.
But I would still ban it, if I had the chance.

[laklak]

They seriously restrict gambling, in fact, even having a poker night at home is technically illegal in this state. But - they run the biggest fucking gambling scam on the planet, the Lotto, which is actually a tax on people who failed elementary probability. I see them queuing up at the corner store, buying ticket after ticket. It's not people in business suits walking out with 50 tickets, either. As far as I'm concerned, their moral and ethical justification for banning anything is utter bullshit as long as they're running a numbers racket.

[pErvinalia]

If the punters didn't bet on your friend's machines, they would bet on someone else's.

It's governments who allow it all to happen, and are happy to see people suffer, because they get a cut.

This is true, and it's why I'm not really that hard on him. I just gently point out the dissonance.

In some ways I benefit too, from gambling. The taxes on gambling keep mine lower. And I watch free tv that's paid for by gambling ads.
But I would still ban it, if I had the chance.

There's no doubt those of us who don't gamble much definitely benefit from the addiction of others. But it really is wrong. I'd prefer to raise that tax money from greedy and immoral corporations/rich-people than from the addicted and vulnerable.

[pErvinalia]

They seriously restrict gambling, in fact, even having a poker night at home is technically illegal in this state. But - they run the biggest fucking gambling scam on the planet, the Lotto, which is actually a tax on people who failed elementary probability. I see them queuing up at the corner store, buying ticket after ticket. It's not people in business suits walking out with 50 tickets, either. As far as I'm concerned, their moral and ethical justification for banning anything is utter bullshit as long as they're running a numbers racket.

Yeah, the Lotto is the pinnacle of hypocrisy. It really is just bread and circuses raised to the power of immorality. It would be one thing if it was just bread and circuses, but the government is making money on it too.

[laklak]

It's always "do as I say, not as I do" with those fuckers. It's all just a big fucking Mafia style protection/extortion racket.

[JimC]

Gambling is basically legalised robbery. They try to dress it up as "entertainment", because it gives people a buzz. But you could say the same about cocaine.

If I was dictator, I would ban all forms of bookmaking and lotteries, with massive penalties for illegals.

If I was just Prime Minister, I would insist that the education of kids included a full understanding of how gambling rips off the punters, and how punters can never win, with bookmakers setting the odds.

I would also insist on kids learning about the value of money, and how to make it go as far as possible, and how not to get taken in by advertising of anything, but to examine for themselves the true value of rip-offs like replica shirts of Manchester United first team, etc etc etc.

Luckily, you have as much chance of becoming dictator (of anywhere) as I have of winning the Nobel Prize... (for anything...)

However, I agree to an extent, particularly about students being inoculated against the rip-off merchants. Realistically, though, you will never ban gambling, but perhaps a more achievable goal would be to at least ban gambling advertising...

[JimC]

They seriously restrict gambling, in fact, even having a poker night at home is technically illegal in this state. But - they run the biggest fucking gambling scam on the planet, the Lotto, which is actually a tax on people who failed elementary probability. I see them queuing up at the corner store, buying ticket after ticket. It's not people in business suits walking out with 50 tickets, either. As far as I'm concerned, their moral and ethical justification for banning anything is utter bullshit as long as they're running a numbers racket.

Yeah, the Lotto is the pinnacle of hypocrisy. It really is just bread and circuses raised to the power of immorality. It would be one thing if it was just bread and circuses, but the government is making money on it too.

I have a weekly Lotto ticket. For a relatively small outlay, I can indulge in fantasies...

[pErvinalia]

If you've got the spare income then it can be a fun game. As long as you realise the odds, which I have no doubt you do. If you didn't, then it would be a miracle how you managed to get a job as a maths teacher..

[JimC]

I've always thought that taking a single lotto ticket each week is a fairly safe form of gambling - it is a modest, knowable outlay, and, unlike other forms of gambling, there is little temptation to increase it again and again...

[rainbow]

[Galaxian]

If, as some conspiracy theorists believe, governments or evil corporate conglomerates were using chemicals or drugs in the water or sprayed in the air from planes – to make people suggestable, addicted to certain products, to control their behaviours and make them into compliant workers and consumers etc. it would be considered utterly abhorrent.

Yet with advertising, and particularly the way it’s now going with big data, AI, personally targeted ads, that’s pretty much where we are. The only difference is that, rather than using drugs, the manipulations enter our minds from the screens that are constantly around us.

But you rarely see the likes of Galaxian ranting about advertising because the control has been so effective that they’ve normalised it. Most people rarely stop to think how odd it is that they allow themselves to be psychologically bombarded potentially thousands of times a day from screens they can hardly bear to put down.

That's right. But, in my case at least, it's not due to being bamboozled by advertising, but rather, the topic has not been up for serious discussion that I've seen.... you know that I'm rarely here, and anyway don't get involved in subjects that are ho-hum.

Since long before Edwards Bernays (Fraud's nephew), advertising has been used by the rich & powerful to sway the masses.

Consider too, the purpose of forums such as this. Is it not to distract & occupy hours upon hours of our time & energy, so that we don't have any to spare to rebel or actively resist oppression? Then also, how many 'members' here are fake? Either AI web=bots or paid or unpaid operatives here to deliberately mislead and influence the rest (a form of advertising). I mentioned this years ago on RDS & RatSkep, and was ridiculed. But now sites in India offer discounts for large scale spamming on Twitter & such, and the USA has inquiries into Russian bot interference in their elections. (Ironic, since the USA is the foremost operator of industrial scale deception & election fraud).

In conclusion, yes, Galaxian is well aware of advertising shenanigans. But we only have 17 years to go, and there's NOTHING we can do about it. So I don't care. Most will be asleep anyway when they are terminated.

[mistermack]

They seriously restrict gambling, in fact, even having a poker night at home is technically illegal in this state. But - they run the biggest fucking gambling scam on the planet, the Lotto, which is actually a tax on people who failed elementary probability. I see them queuing up at the corner store, buying ticket after ticket. It's not people in business suits walking out with 50 tickets, either. As far as I'm concerned, their moral and ethical justification for banning anything is utter bullshit as long as they're running a numbers racket.

That's the big problem though, with gambling, and other harmful activities that people are addicted to.
If you ban it, the criminals move in, like the original numbers racketeers.
As a government, you only have a choice of a greater or lesser evil.

That's why only a dictator could ban it. As a dictator, you could make the mafiosi disappear without trace. No trial or evidence needed.
That's the only way you could actually stop organised gambling.

That's why I would include it heavily in the education curriculum.
It would easily fit into Maths teaching and actually might be more interesting than an ordinary maths lesson.
Same with marketing and advertising. I would educate kids to be ready for what's thrown at them.
To be cynical and sceptical and well informed, when spending their money.