Feminism and Dating

[Forty Two]

Here we go again. You're like a broken record.

What does any of that have to do with feminism? And MGTOW? Well, at least you've finally outed yourself..

Feminism relates to the legal, economic, social, and cultural equality of the genders. This is an aspect of western culture and society which is decidedly unequal.

the question was, what do the videos (and links and commentary) in your post have to do with feminism? Random people taking the piss says nothing at all about feminism.

The issue relates to feminism. The videos are of people expressing viewpoints. If you have videos where feminists (or anyone) are declaring that dates should be split 50-50 or in proportion to each person's food and drink order, then have at it. Let's see if you can find one.

[laklak]

Damn it's a minefield out there, I say a minefield. One wrong move and BOOM you're plastered all over social media as a pervert and sexist and chauvinist. All I did was put on a hand puppet of Tarzan and make it wrestle with the python. Hell, mom LOVED that routine, cracked her up every time. Women today have no sense of humor.

[Forty Two]

I think you live in a totally different world to the rest of us here.

LOL -- stop pretending you fit in with "the rest of us here" - you're a fucking whackjob. There's something wrong with you.

It's perfectly normal for the bill to be split (either evenly, or by cost). No one thinks anything weird about it. As Rachel said, if someone has a problem with that, then they are probably a bit deficient in character.

The data says otherwise.

http://www.eharmony.com/dating-advice/d ... good-idea/

.... “How long do men generally pay for dates if the relationship continues?” The responses varied on this question but the most common response was that men paid for dates for about 2-3 months before the bills were more evenly if not equally split. A few had relationships where men paid for almost all of the dates.

http://www.thedatingtruth.com/2011/02/dont-be-a-fool/

There may be different issues at play, but the prevailing custom is that men pay -- http://www.telegraph.co.uk/women/womens ... -date.html

[Scot Dutchy]

My wife and I always go 50/50.

[rachelbean]

Well, the guys get offended at the idea because it's taken as a sign that the date isn't going well, or that it's not really a romantic date at all because people don't go halfsies when it's a "date date." They're used to women never offering to pay, or only half-heartedly sort of "alligator-arming" it without a serious expectation to be taken up on it.

And yet, lots of guys have no problem with it and have not made it weird or personal. I like those guys.

And, "offering" is not the same as paying. When someone "offers" to pay, it kicks the issue back to the man, as if he is in control over whether he pays the whole thing or not. The there is that the default is that the man is to pay, but the woman is "offering" to pay half. Maybe the bill should come, and the man should "offer" to pay half.

No, I say offering because guys tend to be given the check, and/or reach for it right away. I say offer, because saying "should we split it down the middle" is the same thing I say when I go out with a friend. It is a polite way to let people know I'd rather not haggle over the tiny differences and us pull out our calculators. I have paid the whole bill both with friends and dates plenty of times. So yes, I have had guys offer to pay half when I picked up the bill. Again, that's really not weird to me.

That would actually be funny. I wish my wife would give me a pass to go on a date and try that out. Just for the Lulz I'd like to get the check at a restaurant, and then when the waiter sets the bill down on the table, I'll say "Oh, here's the bill -- can I cover half of this?" I have a feeling the woman would think she's been set up on a gag television show or something.

Probably, as I imagine the kind of woman you go for would have particular expectations

[Scot Dutchy]

Well being a super macho what type of woman would you expect; Trump's daughter.

[Forty Two]

Well, the guys get offended at the idea because it's taken as a sign that the date isn't going well, or that it's not really a romantic date at all because people don't go halfsies when it's a "date date." They're used to women never offering to pay, or only half-heartedly sort of "alligator-arming" it without a serious expectation to be taken up on it.

And yet, lots of guys have no problem with it and have not made it weird or personal. I like those guys.

Well, there are, of course, different strokes, and just because something is the prevailing custom doesn't mean everyone follows that custom. But, it's pretty clear here from the evidence provided that the custom is for men to pay, and women to at most "offer," and that it is a big negative for a man to accept that offer.

Men and women are both part of the prevailing culture, so when there is a prevailing norm it applies pressure to both sexes, not just women.

And, "offering" is not the same as paying. When someone "offers" to pay, it kicks the issue back to the man, as if he is in control over whether he pays the whole thing or not. The there is that the default is that the man is to pay, but the woman is "offering" to pay half. Maybe the bill should come, and the man should "offer" to pay half.

No, I say offering because guys tend to be given the check,

Exactly -- the cultural norm is for the guy to pay, so the wait staff is following the cultural norm. If the prevailing view was, in fact, to split the check, then that wouldn't be the case. The wait staff would bring two checks, or put it in the middle.

and/or reach for it right away.

Why aren't women reaching for it right away?

I say offer, because saying "should we split it down the middle" is the same thing I say when I go out with a friend. It is a polite way to let people know I'd rather not haggle over the tiny differences and us pull out our calculators. I have paid the whole bill both with friends and dates plenty of times. So yes, I have had guys offer to pay half when I picked up the bill. Again, that's really not weird to me.

I'm not calling anything "weird." I'm pointing out the prevailing cultural norm, and this is an area where it is unequal toward men. Women are privileged in this respect, under the same logic used by those who identify other cultural privileges.

That would actually be funny. I wish my wife would give me a pass to go on a date and try that out. Just for the Lulz I'd like to get the check at a restaurant, and then when the waiter sets the bill down on the table, I'll say "Oh, here's the bill -- can I cover half of this?" I have a feeling the woman would think she's been set up on a gag television show or something.

Probably, as I imagine the kind of woman you go for would have particular expectations

LOL. :-)

Indeed, quite possibly over 20+ years of dating, it was just me who happened to be attracted to that small minority of women with these expectations.

When I was in my dating life, it was pretty much consistently expected that I would pay on a date. I mean, the topic wasn't even one that actually came up on dates. The check came, I paid, that's it. So, it's possible that in my life this was a self-imposed thing.

I would get the occasional offer to pay the gratuity, or on rarer occasions an offer to split the bill. But, when someone tosses that kind of "offer" back at me, it's proper etiquette to refuse that offer. I never begrudged it, because it's how I was raised -- the guy pays, the guy opens doors, offer the jacket if it's cold, walk closer to the street than your date, take the initiative with a plan on the date. Etc. Etc. Never in an overt way -- just did it without thinking. That was the cultural norm.

I'm not sure you could know the kind of woman I go for, but typically I was all over the map, mostly college educated with good careers. My wife, of course, is my dream girl, educated, professional, etc. We met at a time when both of us could afford our own stuff, but she would even say to this day that the guy pays on dates. She's not some antiquated, out-of-touch hayseed. This is normal. That's why it's the topic of tons of blogs, videos and articles - it's still an issue -- and a lot of people are asking whether it's appropriate in an age of male-female equality.

[Forty Two]

Well being a super macho what type of woman would you expect; Trump's daughter.

Indeed, she's Trump's daughter. That must, to you, mean she's awful. LOL. I love you guys.

[JimC]

My wife and I always go 50/50.

My wife always pays the bill...

After all, she is the Treasurer to my Prime Minister...

[laklak]

What's to split? All our money is in joint accounts, matters not a jot whose card is used.

[JimC]

We have a joint account, sure, but I'm not allowed to use it...

Which is probably a good thing...

[laklak]

I have a joint account, more properly a bit of cash, that I use to buy the raw materials for joints.

[Hermit]

My wife and I always go 50/50.

We call that "going Dutch". Coincidence?

[JimC]

I do have a secret stash for gin purchases...

[pErvinalia]

Here we go again. You're like a broken record.

What does any of that have to do with feminism? And MGTOW? Well, at least you've finally outed yourself..

Feminism relates to the legal, economic, social, and cultural equality of the genders. This is an aspect of western culture and society which is decidedly unequal.

the question was, what do the videos (and links and commentary) in your post have to do with feminism? Random people taking the piss says nothing at all about feminism.

The issue relates to feminism.

It also relates to quantum physics.