Is Islam inherently homophobic?

[Forty Two]

Well, sure, but I can't say as I've ever heard anyone say that Muslims should be rounded up into camps or anthraxed. The usual refrain is that someone who advocates in favor of vetting systems for refugees from Muslim countries is an Islamophobe.

[Seth]

There is no mention of homophobia anywhere there. Can you even read?

Mendacious pettifoggery. The modifier "phobia" controls the definition of "homophobia" as you well know. You're just trolling.

And you're engaged in the genetic fallacy as it has to do with the word's meaning. 'Phobia' isn't a modifier. English is not an agglutinitive language; combinations of words create new words, not conglomerates of their roots.

Nonsense. "Phobia" is from the Latin/Greek, meaning "fear."

phobia
[foh-bee-uh]

noun
1.
a persistent, irrational fear of a specific object, activity, or situation that leads to a compelling desire to avoid it.
Origin of phobia
1780-1790
1780-90; extracted from nouns ending in -phobia
Synonyms
See more synonyms on Thesaurus.com
aversion, hatred.
-phobia
1.
a combining form meaning “fear,” occurring in loanwords from Greek ( hydrophobia); on this model, used in the names of mental disorders that have the general sense “dread of, aversion toward” that specified by the initial element:
agoraphobia.
Origin
< Latin < Greek, equivalent to -phob (os) -phobe + -ia -ia
Dictionary.com Unabridged
Based on the Random House Dictionary, © Random House, Inc. 2016.

It's a combining form for compound words that has a well-understood meaning, to the point that it's part of the DSM V and has a universally (except by people trying to politically redefine language for their own ends) accepted meaning both alone and when combined with the likewise Latin/Greek word "homo" which also has a well-understood common and universally accepted definition.

Homo
[hoh-moh]
noun
1.
(italics) the genus of bipedal primates that includes modern humans and several extinct forms, distinguished by their large brains and a dependence upon tools.
Compare archaic Homo.
2.
Informal. (sometimes lowercase)

a member of the genus Homo.
the species Homo sapiens or one of its members.

Origin
1590-1600; < Latin homō man; OL hemō the earthly one (see humus ); akin to Latin hūmānus human; cognate with Old English guma, Old Irish duine, Welsh dyn man, Lithuanian žmónės men
homo-
1.
a combining form appearing in loanwords from Greek, where it meant “same” ( homology); on this model, used in the formation of compound words ( homomorphic).
Also, especially before a vowel, hom-.
Origin
< Greek, combining form of homós one and the same; akin to Sanskrit sama-; see same

Your resistance to logic, reason and lexicology demonstrates exactly the agenda that I've described. You want "homophobia" to apply to anyone who doesn't care for homosexuals or shows a dislike or distaste for homosexuals and/or homosexual activity precisely BECAUSE of it's common, ordinary and well-established meaning and connotation, which is that of an irrational and unreasonable fear of and objection to gays. You wish to use it in a pejorative sense exactly in order to demean, disparage and pillory those who refuse to bow to the radical homosexual agenda of forcible social normalization by de-normalizing distaste for homosexuality through the expedient of lying about how people feel about homosexuals in order to marginalize them using the very pejorative definition and connotation that you deny applies. There's no use denying it, it's perfectly obvious.

Once again, aversion to homosexuality is not in and of itself a phobia and therefore dislike of homosexuals or homosexuality is not "homophobia," no matter how much you want it to be.

Which is not to say that I don't think it's necessary or desirable for people to inquire at all about anyone's sexual orientation or their otherwise lawful sexual activities.

[rasetsu]

Me thinkee you no speakee the English.

[rasetsu]

Your resistance to logic, reason and lexicology demonstrates exactly the agenda that I've described. You want "homophobia" to apply to anyone who doesn't care for homosexuals or shows a dislike or distaste for homosexuals and/or homosexual activity precisely BECAUSE of it's common, ordinary and well-established meaning and connotation, which is that of an irrational and unreasonable fear of and objection to gays. You wish to use it in a pejorative sense exactly in order to demean, disparage and pillory those who refuse to bow to the radical homosexual agenda of forcible social normalization by de-normalizing distaste for homosexuality through the expedient of lying about how people feel about homosexuals in order to marginalize them using the very pejorative definition and connotation that you deny applies. There's no use denying it, it's perfectly obvious.

The political use of the term is an entirely separate matter from its documented actual usage. In the latter you are simply wrong, as your repeated attempts to defend your interpretation by dissecting the word rather than simply quoting a relevant dictionary amply shows.

Once again, aversion to homosexuality is not in and of itself a phobia

Straw man argument.

and therefore dislike of homosexuals or homosexuality is not "homophobia," no matter how much you want it to be.

Multiple dictionaries say otherwise.

[Brian Peacock]

Photophobia is not an irrational fear of sunlight - as previously noted - so the claim that this is all it can ever mean doesn't hold. Seth is merely setting himself up as de Grande Validator Lexicographique in order to parse the claim that discriminating, hateful bigotry towards LGBT people is 'logical and rational'.

[pErvinalia]

There is no mention of homophobia anywhere there. Can you even read?

Mendacious pettifoggery. The modifier "phobia" controls the definition of "homophobia" as you well know. You're just trolling.

No it doesn't. Words have meaning, Seth. Look up homophobia in a dictionary. It doesn't mean what you claim (in this thread, at least; you agree with the dictionary definition in another thread; so who's trolling you say? )

[pErvinalia]

There is no mention of homophobia anywhere there. Can you even read?

Mendacious pettifoggery. The modifier "phobia" controls the definition of "homophobia" as you well know. You're just trolling.

And you're engaged in the genetic fallacy as it has to do with the word's meaning. 'Phobia' isn't a modifier. English is not an agglutinitive language; combinations of words create new words, not conglomerates of their roots.

[pErvinalia]

There is no mention of homophobia anywhere there. Can you even read?

Mendacious pettifoggery. The modifier "phobia" controls the definition of "homophobia" as you well know. You're just trolling.

And you're engaged in the genetic fallacy as it has to do with the word's meaning. 'Phobia' isn't a modifier. English is not an agglutinitive language; combinations of words create new words, not conglomerates of their roots.

Nonsense. "Phobia" is from the Latin/Greek, meaning "fear."

phobia
[foh-bee-uh]

noun
1.
a persistent, irrational fear of a specific object, activity, or situation that leads to a compelling desire to avoid it.
Origin of phobia
1780-1790
1780-90; extracted from nouns ending in -phobia
Synonyms
See more synonyms on Thesaurus.com
aversion, hatred.
-phobia
1.
a combining form meaning “fear,” occurring in loanwords from Greek ( hydrophobia); on this model, used in the names of mental disorders that have the general sense “dread of, aversion toward” that specified by the initial element:
agoraphobia.
Origin
< Latin < Greek, equivalent to -phob (os) -phobe + -ia -ia
Dictionary.com Unabridged
Based on the Random House Dictionary, [COPYRIGHT SIGN] Random House, Inc. 2016.

It's a combining form for compound words that has a well-understood meaning, to the point that it's part of the DSM V and has a universally (except by people trying to politically redefine language for their own ends) accepted meaning both alone and when combined with the likewise Latin/Greek word "homo" which also has a well-understood common and universally accepted definition.

Homo
[hoh-moh]
noun
1.
(italics) the genus of bipedal primates that includes modern humans and several extinct forms, distinguished by their large brains and a dependence upon tools.
Compare archaic Homo.
2.
Informal. (sometimes lowercase)

a member of the genus Homo.
the species Homo sapiens or one of its members.

Origin
1590-1600; < Latin homō man; OL hemō the earthly one (see humus ); akin to Latin hūmānus human; cognate with Old English guma, Old Irish duine, Welsh dyn man, Lithuanian žmónės men
homo-
1.
a combining form appearing in loanwords from Greek, where it meant “same” ( homology); on this model, used in the formation of compound words ( homomorphic).
Also, especially before a vowel, hom-.
Origin
< Greek, combining form of homós one and the same; akin to Sanskrit sama-; see same

Your resistance to logic, reason and lexicology demonstrates exactly the agenda that I've described.

So please explain to us under your "logic", "reason" and "lexicology" how oil "fears" water (i.e. is hydrophobic).

[JimC]

In some ways, all that matters is how the words are typically used by the majority of people who use them. Both words under discussion are used in quite different ways to conditions with clinical definitions, such as arachnophobia. Both are used in an overtly political context, and often used in a perjorative and exaggerated way to serve certain agendas. I am not implying anything negative, or anything political when I label someone as arachnophobic after observing their behaviour.

[Forty Two]

It's less clear than that. It's not about a "majority" as there is no vote count. It's about usages, and being clear about what usage is being used at the time. Homophobic can mean what Seth means it to mean, and it can mean what eRv means it to mean. The resolution to this debate is to simply clarify how one is using the word. There is no inherent meaning or officially codified correct meaning. There are only arguments as to applicable meaning, and some arguments are stronger than others.

It's a weak argument to say that homophobia means love of record albums. That is likely a usage used by nobody. It's a stronger argument to say that homophobia means the clinical psychiatric condition wherein a person has a fear of or anxiety regarding homosexuals. It's also a strong argument that it's common English usage in the non-clinical setting means dislike or prejudice against gay people. The latter definition is not "wrong."

[laklak]

I'm not Islamophobic, I'm Islamocareful. I keep a close eye on those buggers. If they start their Allah Akbaring I GTFO.

[Svartalf]

I'm not islamophobic, I'm misislamic, not quite the same thing

[Seth]

Me thinkee you no speakee the English.

Several dictionaries and reason prove otherwise.

[Seth]

The political use of the term is an entirely separate matter from its documented actual usage.

Exactly. As I've been saying, the use of "homophobia" as applied to anyone who resists the radical gay agenda of forcible homosexual societal normalization is entirely and completely a political use of the term that has the specific intents and purposes I've outlined, which makes such usage nothing more or less than pure unadulterated mendacious political propaganda.

[Seth]

Photophobia is not an irrational fear of sunlight - as previously noted - so the claim that this is all it can ever mean doesn't hold. Seth is merely setting himself up as de Grande Validator Lexicographique in order to parse the claim that discriminating, hateful bigotry towards LGBT people is 'logical and rational'.

Except that's never a claim I made, so you tell a lie. Discriminating, hateful bigotry towards LGBT people may merely be discriminating, hateful bigotry towards LGBT people. It's not a "phobia" unless you can show that a particular individual engages in such actions because he or she displays the symptoms of a phobia as defined in the DSM V. Unless you can do so, you are misusing the word deliberately, for political reasons...in other words you're lying in order to advance a particular political agenda of your own, just as the person engaging in discriminating, hateful bigotry may be advancing a political agenda of their own. There's nothing preventing you from doing so, but neither is there anything preventing others from exposing your unethical behavior.

It is also important to point out that discrimination is a civil right, even hateful discrimination, and bigotry is not a crime. Even labeling something as "bigotry" can, and very often is, an entirely subjective matter of personal opinion. A rapist may define social opprobrium towards his (or her) acts as "discriminating, hateful bigotry," but that doesn't mean it is. People have a right to discriminate and be bigots, it's an essential component of individual liberty and the consequences of empowering government to suppress such personal opinions and actions are demonstrably horrific, tyrannical and deadly, as every regime in history that has done so proves, from Pharaoh to Hitler.

The question therefore becomes whether or not the discrimination, hate and bigotry is merely an expression of personal opinion or takes the form of government-authorized or supported discrimination in law that is without a rational moral and ethical basis and which violates the rights of those it's used against. If it's personal opinion, it's that person's right to hold that opinion, and its your right to criticize them for doing so, but it is not (or should not be) within government's power to sanction that opinion or its expression. If it's expressed as government policy however, and is without rational moral and ethical basis and harms the rights of anyone, then it is reasonable, rational and necessary to change that policy so that all person are treated equally under the law.