Racism about islam can't exist: islam isn't a race: Poll

[Exi5tentialist]

No, it's fear of "outsiders", whether that is physical or cultural.

Well whatever subtly nuanced variation on the usual understanding of xenophobia you want to use to support your apologetics for islamophobic racism, feel free. I have a hot date with my pillow.

[Exi5tentialist]

Ok, so you agree your opinion on racism is formed from bias (i.e. irrationality) and not reasoning. Glad we cleared that up.

No.

Night.

[pErvinalia]

No, it's fear of "outsiders", whether that is physical or cultural.

Well whatever subtly nuanced variation on the usual understanding of xenophobia you want to use to support your apologetics for islamophobic racism, feel free. I have a hot date with my pillow.

You are still "Begging the question". You haven't provided a single piece of evidence that suggests people who hate Islam the religion are necessarily racist.

[pErvinalia]

Ok, so you agree your opinion on racism is formed from bias (i.e. irrationality) and not reasoning. Glad we cleared that up.

No.

Actually yes. That's exactly what you stated.

[Hermit]

The abaya is a common garment worn by women in certain regions of Africa. How does it being muslim dress, or muslims existing in indonesia, stop that being a fact?

Nobody disputes that the abaya is a common garment worn by women in certain regions of Africa. What you have yet to establish, though, is that a reference to the abaya is a reference to race rather than to culture.

[JimC]

The abaya is a common garment worn by women in certain regions of Africa. How does it being muslim dress, or muslims existing in indonesia, stop that being a fact?

Nobody disputes that the abaya is a common garment worn by women in certain regions of Africa. What you have yet to establish, though, is that a reference to the abaya is a reference to race rather than to culture.

And those in the West who express distaste for it (at one end of the spectrum), or yell abuse at those wearing it (at the other) will do so for a mixture of motives. It will often include racism, of course, but that would be no different to people abusing Sikhs, or West Indians, or any other clearly distinctive group. Your contention that any example of islamophobia is automatically racist remains illogical, even if there are many occasions where the two are conflated by particular groups or individuals. Racism is more deeply ingrained than islamophobia, which, in the West at least, is a relatively recent phenomenon.

It is sadly amusing when red-necked racists abuse turban-wearing Sikhs, thinking them to be muslim - the Sikhs, of course, have a long and bitter feud of their own with muslims...

[piscator]

It is sadly amusing when red-necked racists abuse turban-wearing Sikhs, thinking them to be muslim - the Sikhs, of course, have a long and bitter feud of their own with muslims...

[piscator]

The abaya is a common garment worn by women in certain regions of Africa. How does it being muslim dress, or muslims existing in indonesia, stop that being a fact?

Nobody disputes that the abaya is a common garment worn by women in certain regions of Africa. What you have yet to establish, though, is that a reference to the abaya is a reference to race rather than to culture.

And those in the West who express distaste for it (at one end of the spectrum), or yell abuse at those wearing it (at the other) will do so for a mixture of motives. It will often include racism, of course, but that would be no different to people abusing Sikhs, or West Indians, or any other clearly distinctive group. Your contention that any example of islamophobia is automatically racist remains illogical, even if there are many occasions where the two are conflated by particular groups or individuals. Racism is more deeply ingrained than islamophobia, which, in the West at least, is a relatively recent phenomenon.

Yeah, the term has only recently been minted.

At the end of the day though, Islam is a set of ideas and the Ummah is likely incompatible with the Australian Constitution, another set of ideas.

[pErvinalia]

And it's at least debatable whether Dawkins is actually islamophobic. There's a big difference between an atheist like Dawkins who hates all religion (including Islam), and your average bogan who hates Muslims simply because they are different and scare their tiny brains.

[pErvinalia]

But still, Dawkins is a cock. His pronouncements on feminism, and Islam, are usually highly inflammatory and often quite stupid.

[Brian Peacock]

It can be prejudice, but not racism that is why.

Isn't it about usage? Richard Dawkins says a woman wearing an abaya is in a bin liner. He's a racist.

Mhhh. Clothing as an indicator of race? I thought it was genes.

Geography is an indicator of race. Cultural norms around clothing are an indicator of race. Food recipes are an indicator of race. Linguistic accents are an indicator of race. Indicators of race can be used as indicators of racism. And yet, you still don't need the concept of race to understand what racism is.

If geography is a race determining factor then what determines the geograpical boundary between one race and the next?

How exactly do dietary or fashion preferences or norms determine race-group membership, and what foodstuffs, culinary practices, clothing items, or fabrics mark people out as belonging to one race rather than another?

If accent is a race determining factor are regional dialects also race-group indicators, and what are the appropriate levels of distinguishing variance? Do all people with a speech impediment belong in the same race-group for example, or are soprano, alto, tenor, and baritone voice-types indicators of race-group membership?

I ask because it isn't quite clear what you mean by 'race' here. You seem to be confusing nominal sets based on arbitrary identifiers with 'races' (discrete, bounded entities) and then mistaking bigotry and hypocrisy towards, or criticism of, these sets for 'racism'.

Perhaps it would help if you clarrified your fundamental definition of what a 'race' is, and what distinguishes a 'race' from a mere 'grouo' or arbitrary 'set'.

[laklak]

Is Salt Water Redneck a race? If so that's me.

[pErvinalia]

I'm dropout loser surfy bum race.

[Brian Peacock]

Personally I always had you down more as a three-thirty-from-Wincanton type.

[pErvinalia]

Sometimes I'm angry cyberspace keyboard warrior race..