The Thread of BREXIT

[pErvinalia]

In English?

[DaveDodo007]

Define "intelligence". The UK appears to be one of the most stupid countries getting around at the moment based on the extremists they've voted in twice now.

Lol, people who I disagree with must have low intelligence, you wouldn't happen to be a bit biased there old chum. We have all seen the height of the intelligence of the lefty/liberal delusional fuckwits and found it wanting. The people of the UK aren't buying what you are selling, 'need moar spin doctors' isn't going to solve the problem anytime soon either. I always find it laughable that lefty/liberals try to show how compassionate they are whilst spending other people's money, either spend your own money on being compassionate or fuck you. There is a global economy right now and people with the money can move where ever they want, so whose money are you socialists going to spend? Lol, socialism didn't work because reasons and keep telling yourselves that you ideological loons.

[pErvinalia]

I'm not a socialist.

Austerity during recessionary and low growth periods IS extreme. Adopting a social darwinistic approach to the disabled and disadvantaged in society IS extreme. This is the most amazing thing about neoliberalism - that it's "normalised" extreme policies.

[DaveDodo007]

I'm not a socialist.

Austerity during recessionary and low growth periods IS extreme. Adopting a social darwinistic approach to the disabled and disadvantaged in society IS extreme. This is the most amazing thing about neoliberalism - that it's "normalised" extreme policies.

It probably is extreme though how is borrowing more money going to help any country already in debt up to its eyeballs?

[pErvinalia]

By pump-priming the economy. This is simple stuff and it's why Australia didn't even go into recession during the GFC. This idiotic idea that borrowing money must be bad needs to be put to bed. Do the pinheads making this argument have no experience with investment?!?

[pErvinalia]

Further, borrowing money isn't the opposite of austerity. The real reason most western neoliberal countries are in deficit is because of the structural deficit that naturally results from neoliberalism. That is, cutting taxes reduces revenue, and despite claims to small government, most neoliberal governments spend like any other government.

So obviously, taxes need to be raised again. How to do that, who the fuck knows? It's essentially political poison. And then there is the concept of a race to the bottom. If you get out of the race before the end, then you potentially lose. But having said that, we all are going to lose the closer to the bottom we get. So getting out of the race is probably the most sensible approach as it could still result in a win. Completing the race will destroy the world economy.

[DaveDodo007]

By pump-priming the economy. This is simple stuff and it's why Australia didn't even go into recession during the GFC. This idiotic idea that borrowing money must be bad needs to be put to bed. Do the pinheads making this argument have no experience with investment?!?

Don't be so naive as Australia was an outlier in this case and only had a temporary reprieve as your economy is suffering now. If you where a member of the EU you would be Spain right now.

[pErvinalia]

Australia's economy is suffering?!? (the only aspect where we are struggling is the same as all neoliberal economies - structural deficit. But right at this moment we are having a national debate about this and both neolib majors are squirming around for tax increases they can enact without getting too hammered at the polls).

Don't respond. I'm sick of dealing with idiotic posts lately.

[tuco]

It might be better for some of the mainland European countries if the UK left, since our governments tend to be one the main voices in Europe for big money corporate establishment and anti-democracy and anti-environment. But I think it would be equally bad for us here if we left for the same reasons.

The main thing that worries me though is what would happen to the people who have moved country (in either direction) and set up lives in new places? I've made several good friends from other European countries, are they going to be made to move away?

That is surely(?) being debated during the public debate UK is having(?) over this. I would assume such people could/would be treated as other people who cant reside in the UK today. I was deported twice by UK customs before we joined in the EU in 2004.

There doesn't seem to be much public debate really, - just opposing sides. On one side a large number of UKIP types who say immigration is bad because there's too many foreigners and who seem to think that everything would be rosy without them and who won't hear or say anything to the contrary. And then the opposing side mostly either just saying that the UKIPs are small minded bigots or the pro-EU corporate Tories saying that we need cheap immigrant labour for our economy. I've heard very little detail about what the UK leaving the EU would actually mean for the people on the streets.

How come? This is arguably one of the most important decision UK citizens make in years, possibly decades. It would affect everyone. I mean what is more important? In democracy like the UK one, with long tradition, I would expect huge public debate with experts chipping in to educate citizens on issues etc. I hear, there are predictions for pound losing 20% upon exit. That is serious.

Though I do believe you, seeing how the debate goes here, I guess it would be naive to expect the UK general populace be any different.

[JimC]

The real problem is that it is difficult to predict the concrete effect of leaving. People on either side of the debate will present either an optimistic or pessimistic view of consequences, but no one really knows how it would actually play out...

[tuco]

If it difficult to predict, why there is talk about leaving?

Lets leave?
Why?
I dunno its difficult to predict ..
Lets leave!

this is UK democracy?

[Svartalf]

Because some people believe they will be better off out of Europe... of course, once out of the EU, the CIty will stop being the Bank of the Union, and the UK will lose its privileged status with what is currently its main trading partner, so it's mostly those who value ties to the US who will benefit from a brexit... I suspect the EU would be better without UK and its constantly obstreperous manners and demands.

[tuco]

They have no basis, its difficult to predict, yet they believe. And there is no robust public debate. Do I get it right? To me that is idiotic.

[pErvinalia]

To you everything is idiotic. Except your own babbling.

[Svartalf]

Stop being correct rEv, how can I argue with you in Seth's absence if you are correct?