Far-left, Anti-Austerity Party Triumphs in Greek Election.

[Seth]

Yeah, expect that's not how economies work. Demand drives economies, not supply.

Demand only drives economies when there is a profit potential for the supplier, or didn't you learn anything from the USSR's debacle.

If there's no profit to be made, nobody with any sense is going to invest their capital in the facilities and employees needed to satisfy the demand.

So, in reality, profit drives economies, demand and supply are merely the vehicles for producing profit. Remove profit and it all comes crashing down.

Are YOU going to labor "according to your ability" in return for what someone else (like a Marxist bureaucrat) decides is to be given to you "according to your need?"

No? Didn't think so.

More strawmen. You really are a master. No one is talking about removing profit.

Of course you are. That's what socialism does. That's it's entire premise. The haves must be fleeced for their profits to pay (according to Jonno) to bribe the have-nots not to riot and kill them.

Well, when the haves are fed up with being fleeced, they decide to quit producing and become have-nots so they too can get something for nothing, and that inevitably leads to social and economic collapse.

[Seth]

A lot of the best Greeks have fled austerity and unemployment, who gives a shit about taxes if you aren't working.

Let's face it only the wealthy really worry about taxes as only for the wealthy does taxes really make that much difference to the quality of their life.

And you don't think the wealthy have fled high taxation? Are you stupid or something? I've already told you, capital flows away from taxes like water flows downhill. Especially with today's international economy, the wealthy simply move their capital to a nation that provides a better and more favorable tax structure from one which seeks confiscatory taxation for redistribution of wealth purposes.

Bullshit. If that was the case, there would be no businesses operating in Scandinavia.

Does George Soros reside in Scandinavia?

Nope.

Scandinavia is a thinly-populated pissant icebox that happens to have lots of OPM available, and yes, capital flees taxation there just like it does everywhere else.

[Seth]

Let's face it only the wealthy really worry about taxes as only for the wealthy does taxes really make that much difference to the quality of their life.

Huh?? Taxes affect the working poor more than the rich. The poor have less to live on. That was a strange comment even by your standards, Jonno.

The poor don't pay income taxes, or had that fact escaped you entirely?

Of course they do? If you work, you pay taxes. Or had that fact escaped you.

Um, that's what we call the "productive class." The "poor" are the 50% of the population who don't make enough income to be taxed on it. In fact, most of them get negative taxation, meaning that they profit from the government to the tune of about $25,000 each per year in aggregate government benefits paid for by the productive class.

[Xamonas Chegwé]

Does George Soros reside in Scandinavia?

Nope.

I am sure that the Scandinavians are very happy about the fact that that crook chooses to live out his pustulant life elsewhere. He's a convicted insider trader and a ruthless currency speculator with no evidence of a shred of concern for the effects of his money-grabbing antics. A cunt, in short.

[Seth]

Does George Soros reside in Scandinavia?

Nope.

I am sure that the Scandinavians are very happy about the fact that that crook chooses to live out his pustulant life elsewhere. He's a convicted insider trader and a ruthless currency speculator with no evidence of a shred of concern for the effects of his money-grabbing antics. A cunt, in short.

Isn't he just! A dangerous cunt at that.

But, the point remains.

[Xamonas Chegwé]

Does George Soros reside in Scandinavia?

Nope.

I am sure that the Scandinavians are very happy about the fact that that crook chooses to live out his pustulant life elsewhere. He's a convicted insider trader and a ruthless currency speculator with no evidence of a shred of concern for the effects of his money-grabbing antics. A cunt, in short.

Isn't he just! A dangerous cunt at that.

But, the point remains.

The point remains that you are welcome to him. In fact, why not prove the humanitarian benefits of your gun-ownership and put the rest of us out of his misery.

[MrJonno]

On a middle class income taxes rising or falling by a few % either way make relatively little different to my life compared to say house prices, whether I actually have a job or in fact my general salary.

If you on lower wages taxes are even less important, the general cost of living is infinitely more important (and lets face most benefits go to top up wages of the lower , my wife for example was at one point earning £12000 a year and getting £6000 in benefits. You seriously think she gave a shit about income tax or whether her tax allowance was £6000 or £10000).

I repeat its only the wealthy who should worry about taxes as it effects them far more financially (not necessary on quality of life through but that's subjective)

[Seth]

Does George Soros reside in Scandinavia?

Nope.

I am sure that the Scandinavians are very happy about the fact that that crook chooses to live out his pustulant life elsewhere. He's a convicted insider trader and a ruthless currency speculator with no evidence of a shred of concern for the effects of his money-grabbing antics. A cunt, in short.

Isn't he just! A dangerous cunt at that.

But, the point remains.

The point remains that you are welcome to him. In fact, why not prove the humanitarian benefits of your gun-ownership and put the rest of us out of his misery.

All I can say is he's so rich he's got better security than the President of the United States. I'm not a magician or a Ninja.

[Seth]

On a middle class income taxes rising or falling by a few % either way make relatively little different to my life compared to say house prices, whether I actually have a job or in fact my general salary.

If you on lower wages taxes are even less important, the general cost of living is infinitely more important (and lets face most benefits go to top up wages of the lower , my wife for example was at one point earning £12000 a year and getting £6000 in benefits. You seriously think she gave a shit about income tax or whether her tax allowance was £6000 or £10000).

I repeat its only the wealthy who should worry about taxes as it effects them far more financially (not necessary on quality of life through but that's subjective)

Actually, who worries about taxes the most is the middle class and the small business owners, for whom a few percentage points of profits take by taxes means the difference between holding on and going bankrupt.

[Xamonas Chegwé]

Does George Soros reside in Scandinavia?

Nope.

I am sure that the Scandinavians are very happy about the fact that that crook chooses to live out his pustulant life elsewhere. He's a convicted insider trader and a ruthless currency speculator with no evidence of a shred of concern for the effects of his money-grabbing antics. A cunt, in short.

Isn't he just! A dangerous cunt at that.

But, the point remains.

The point remains that you are welcome to him. In fact, why not prove the humanitarian benefits of your gun-ownership and put the rest of us out of his misery.

All I can say is he's so rich he's got better security than the President of the United States. I'm not a magician or a Ninja.

The saddest thing is that while old-age will soon see him out of the door, his money will (through legal intricacies that persist long after he does) pass to an equally avaricious cunt and the cycle will not only begin again, but intensify!

This is the true curse of capitalism - INHERITANCE.

A system where those that have contributed NOTHING pick up a vast swathe of the nation's wealth through accident of birth can NEVER be considered fair by any but the parents of the cunts in question.

I completely agree with you that those that make wealth and provide jobs should be commended and rewarded for that effort. Sadly, this appears to go hand-in-hand with the naïve notion that the sucklings of that entrepreneur should get a huge slice of the proceeds of their efforts.

Inheritance and nepotism is the curse that turns everything good about free-enterprise into shit! Because there is NOT a free market when the sons and daughters of the previous generation of the best are given a head-start above the shoulders of the rest!

By all means, let them pay for the schooling and upbringing of their kids. But, upon death, let the bulk of their wealth be handed to the state. There is no such thing as economically good genes!

[pErvinalia]

Yeah, expect that's not how economies work. Demand drives economies, not supply.

Demand only drives economies when there is a profit potential for the supplier, or didn't you learn anything from the USSR's debacle.

If there's no profit to be made, nobody with any sense is going to invest their capital in the facilities and employees needed to satisfy the demand.

So, in reality, profit drives economies, demand and supply are merely the vehicles for producing profit. Remove profit and it all comes crashing down.

Are YOU going to labor "according to your ability" in return for what someone else (like a Marxist bureaucrat) decides is to be given to you "according to your need?"

No? Didn't think so.

More strawmen. You really are a master. No one is talking about removing profit.

Of course you are. That's what socialism does. That's it's entire premise. The haves must be fleeced for their profits to pay (according to Jonno) to bribe the have-nots not to riot and kill them.

Well, when the haves are fed up with being fleeced, they decide to quit producing and become have-nots so they too can get something for nothing, and that inevitably leads to social and economic collapse.

Why are you so fucking atrocious at reading the words others have written??

[pErvinalia]

A lot of the best Greeks have fled austerity and unemployment, who gives a shit about taxes if you aren't working.

Let's face it only the wealthy really worry about taxes as only for the wealthy does taxes really make that much difference to the quality of their life.

And you don't think the wealthy have fled high taxation? Are you stupid or something? I've already told you, capital flows away from taxes like water flows downhill. Especially with today's international economy, the wealthy simply move their capital to a nation that provides a better and more favorable tax structure from one which seeks confiscatory taxation for redistribution of wealth purposes.

Bullshit. If that was the case, there would be no businesses operating in Scandinavia.

Does George Soros reside in Scandinavia?

Nope.

Scandinavia is a thinly-populated pissant icebox that happens to have lots of OPM available, and yes, capital flees taxation there just like it does everywhere else.

Bullshit. There's masses of capital in Scandinavia, including great Merkan companies like McDonalds who pay higher wages and taxes there than in Merka.

[pErvinalia]

Let's face it only the wealthy really worry about taxes as only for the wealthy does taxes really make that much difference to the quality of their life.

Huh?? Taxes affect the working poor more than the rich. The poor have less to live on. That was a strange comment even by your standards, Jonno.

The poor don't pay income taxes, or had that fact escaped you entirely?

Of course they do? If you work, you pay taxes. Or had that fact escaped you.

Um, that's what we call the "productive class." The "poor" are the 50% of the population who don't make enough income to be taxed on it. In fact, most of them get negative taxation, meaning that they profit from the government to the tune of about $25,000 each per year in aggregate government benefits paid for by the productive class.

As usual, you fail to realise there is a world outside the US.

And regardless of whatever the stats are for the US, the working poor do pay income tax, so if they are raised (and if consumption taxes are raised), then they affect the poor more than the rich. This is basic stuff. I'm not surprised you and Jonno find agreement on this point. You two are two of the most illogical people on these boards.

[pErvinalia]

Does George Soros reside in Scandinavia?

Nope.

I am sure that the Scandinavians are very happy about the fact that that crook chooses to live out his pustulant life elsewhere. He's a convicted insider trader and a ruthless currency speculator with no evidence of a shred of concern for the effects of his money-grabbing antics. A cunt, in short.

Isn't he just! A dangerous cunt at that.

But, the point remains.

WHAT POINT, you clown?! The fact that Soros doesn't reside in Scandinavia doesn't prove that there is no business in Scandinavia as the capital has fled their high tax regimes. You are an embarrassment to rationality.

[pErvinalia]

On a middle class income taxes rising or falling by a few % either way make relatively little different to my life compared to say house prices, whether I actually have a job or in fact my general salary.

If you on lower wages taxes are even less important, the general cost of living is infinitely more important (and lets face most benefits go to top up wages of the lower , my wife for example was at one point earning £12000 a year and getting £6000 in benefits. You seriously think she gave a shit about income tax or whether her tax allowance was £6000 or £10000).

I repeat its only the wealthy who should worry about taxes as it effects them far more financially (not necessary on quality of life through but that's subjective)

You really must have failed logic at school. When you are living on the edge of survivability any change in income is critical. When you burn $100 notes in your fireplace, a change in tax makes no difference at all to your wellbeing.

Fuck, is it too much to ask for some intelligent debate around here?!?