Evolution from monkeys

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Re: Evolution from monkeys

Post by Blind groper » Mon Oct 20, 2014 4:05 am

Xamonas

I suspect I have a better and deeper understanding than you do. After all, I am not the one who clings to stupid ideas.

As I pointed out earlier, if you have two different birds, they will have at least one common ancestor that is also a bird. If you have two different monkeys, they will have at least one common ancestor that is a monkey.

Apes came off the lineage leading to old world monkeys. That lineage came off the lineage of new world monkeys. Guess what? When you have two monkey lineages, the common ancestor at closest point is also a monkey.

I really think you guys need your brains reamed out. Nor is it Ok to simply ignore the unambiguous statements of the anthropologists at Palomar University with an offhand comment. Those guys actually know what they are talking about.

You do not!

And rEvo.

How about posting data instead of bullshit?

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Re: Evolution from monkeys

Post by pErvinalia » Mon Oct 20, 2014 4:10 am

What data do you want?? You know as well as the rest of us that we evolved from simiiformes. I've explained this to you multiple times and you ignore it every time. Simiiformes is the rigorous taxonomic name of our common ancestor. NOT "monkeys". You are applying non-rigorous terms to a scientific discipline. It's pointless and non-elucidating.
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Re: Evolution from monkeys

Post by Hermit » Mon Oct 20, 2014 4:33 am

Blind groper wrote:We do not need a branching from apes to human, since humans are just one variety of ape.
...and each of those apes branched out from simians. Humans did not evolve from apes. They are one of the varieties that branched out from simians. That's what speciation is about.

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Re: Evolution from monkeys

Post by Blind groper » Mon Oct 20, 2014 4:49 am

A little in the way of word lessons. Yes, we did branch out from simions. The word 'simion' means monkey or ape. Duh!

Yes, we did come from simiiformes. That word means 'having the form of a monkey'. The word 'simiiforme' refers to the fact that this group looks like monkeys (even humans look like a tail-less and hair-less monkey). It gave rise to the old world and new world monkeys, and the most recent common ancestor of those two groups would not be either old world or new world monkey, but most definitely a monkey anyway. We could call it an old-type monkey.

Primate evolution gave rise to lemurs and lorises, and then later to tarsiers, and then to monkeys. The early monkeys were the ancestors of all later monkeys and apes.

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Re: Evolution from monkeys

Post by Xamonas Chegwé » Mon Oct 20, 2014 4:55 am

Blind groper wrote:Xamonas

I suspect I have a better and deeper understanding than you do. After all, I am not the one who clings to stupid ideas.

As I pointed out earlier, if you have two different birds, they will have at least one common ancestor that is also a bird. If you have two different monkeys, they will have at least one common ancestor that is a monkey.

Apes came off the lineage leading to old world monkeys. That lineage came off the lineage of new world monkeys. Guess what? When you have two monkey lineages, the common ancestor at closest point is also a monkey.

I really think you guys need your brains reamed out. Nor is it Ok to simply ignore the unambiguous statements of the anthropologists at Palomar University with an offhand comment. Those guys actually know what they are talking about.

You do not!

And rEvo.

How about posting data instead of bullshit?
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Now, I am not about to argue an appeal to authority here, but I would like to gain an insight into your qualifications? So far, the only authorities you seem to have cited are Collins dictionary and "as any 8 year old will tell you". :tea:
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Re: Evolution from monkeys

Post by rainbow » Mon Oct 20, 2014 6:54 am

Blind groper wrote: How about posting data instead of bullshit?
:ab:
...and completely ruin all original thought?

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Re: Evolution from monkeys

Post by pErvinalia » Mon Oct 20, 2014 6:58 am

Blind groper wrote:A little in the way of word lessons. Yes, we did branch out from simions. The word 'simion' means monkey or ape. Duh!

Yes, we did come from simiiformes. That word means 'having the form of a monkey'. The word 'simiiforme' refers to the fact that this group looks like monkeys (even humans look like a tail-less and hair-less monkey). It gave rise to the old world and new world monkeys, and the most recent common ancestor of those two groups would not be either old world or new world monkey, but most definitely a monkey anyway. We could call it an old-type monkey.

Primate evolution gave rise to lemurs and lorises, and then later to tarsiers, and then to monkeys. The early monkeys were the ancestors of all later monkeys and apes.
You're still missing the point.
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Re: Evolution from monkeys

Post by mistermack » Mon Oct 20, 2014 10:56 am

Blind groper wrote:A little in the way of word lessons. Yes, we did branch out from simions. The word 'simion' means monkey or ape. Duh!

Yes, we did come from simiiformes. That word means 'having the form of a monkey'. The word 'simiiforme' refers to the fact that this group looks like monkeys (even humans look like a tail-less and hair-less monkey). It gave rise to the old world and new world monkeys, and the most recent common ancestor of those two groups would not be either old world or new world monkey, but most definitely a monkey anyway. We could call it an old-type monkey.

Primate evolution gave rise to lemurs and lorises, and then later to tarsiers, and then to monkeys. The early monkeys were the ancestors of all later monkeys and apes.
That's pretty blatant bollox, so I fixed it for you :
Blind groper wrote:A little in the way of word lessons. Yes, we did branch out from simions. The word 'simion' means monkey or ape. Duh!


Yes, we did come from simiiformes. That word means 'having the form of a monkey 'or ape. The word 'simiiforme' refers to the fact that this group looks like monkeys or apes (even humans look like a tail-less and hair-less monkey or ape). It gave rise to the old world and new world monkeys or ape, and the most recent common ancestor of those two groups would not be either old world or new world simiiforme, but most definitely a simiiforme anyway. We could call it an old-type simiiforme.
Basically, your effort to change the word simiiform into meaning having the form of a monkey is shown to be bollox by your own post.
It means having the form of the whole group, and always did.
In fact the original latin word would probably have included lemurs as well, if they were encountered.
The romans didn't know about South America, so simia referred to any old world animal that had characteristics in common with the entire group.
Simiiforme simply means having a form that includes you in that group. It doesn't mean having the form of a monkey. And it never did.
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Re: Evolution from monkeys

Post by tattuchu » Mon Oct 20, 2014 12:34 pm

Hermit wrote:
Blind groper wrote:We do not need a branching from apes to human, since humans are just one variety of ape.
...and each of those apes branched out from simians. Humans did not evolve from apes. They are one of the varieties that branched out from simians. That's what speciation is about.

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Re: Evolution from monkeys

Post by Blind groper » Mon Oct 20, 2014 7:06 pm

To Xamonas

My degree is in zoology. Yes, it included studies of primate evolution.

To Mistermack

Feel free to add the words "or ape" to definitions of simiiforme or simion. The only reason I did not was keeping it simple. That addition does not alter the argument.

I have still to see a single argument against the idea that apes and humans had monkey ancestors, that is actually valid. Lots of bullshit, but nothing of any scientific merit.

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Re: Evolution from monkeys

Post by Xamonas Chegwé » Mon Oct 20, 2014 7:37 pm

Blind groper wrote:To Xamonas

My degree is in zoology. Yes, it included studies of primate evolution.
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Re: Evolution from monkeys

Post by Blind groper » Mon Oct 20, 2014 9:09 pm

Xamonas

You do not know me, but I can assure you that I do not tell lies. My degree, is indeed, in zoology, no matter how inconvenient that fact is to you.

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Re: Evolution from monkeys

Post by Xamonas Chegwé » Mon Oct 20, 2014 9:33 pm

Blind groper wrote:Xamonas

You do not know me, but I can assure you that I do not tell lies.
You have a point. No liar would ever say that, now would they?
My degree, is indeed, in zoology, no matter how inconvenient that fact is to you.
Odd that you appear to have no understanding of your subject, in that case. Perhaps you slept through the lectures that explained the difference between "Paraphyletic" and "Your own arsehole". :tea:
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Re: Evolution from monkeys

Post by Blind groper » Mon Oct 20, 2014 10:23 pm

And you, Xamonas, continue to ignore the simple fact that you are wrong, wrong, wrong!!

The old world and new world monkeys evolved from an older monkey, that was still a monkey - not a lemur, tarsier, loris or ape. You are simply trying to cover up this simple truth.

Not only that, but the ape lineage came from an earlier old world monkey. In both senses, apes and therefore humans (since we are apes) evolved from monkeys.

We even have a fossil (Aegyptopithecus) of a monkey that would be on, or close to, the old world monkey lineage that split off to become apes.

There is an old saying. "If you cannot convince them with science, baffle them with bullshit!"

I am trying the former. You are doing the latter.

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Re: Evolution from monkeys

Post by Blind groper » Mon Oct 20, 2014 10:33 pm

http://en.m.wikinews.org/wiki/Researche ... nd_monkeys

Of course, Aegyptopithecus is not the only fossil close to the common ancestor of apes and old world monkeys. The reference above shows a partial skull of a primate that is on or near to the lineage that gave rise to both apes and modern old world monkeys.

Again, this reference confirms that apes evolved from earlier old world monkeys. Therefore apes and humans evolved from monkeys.

I think, in time, non scientific Xamonas, I will drown you in good science that will confirm beyond any doubt that apes evolved from monkeys. Not that it will convince you. You will continue to rationalise your way around good science and into total unmitigated bullshit.

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