Ebola is now running wild in America

[pErvinalia]

I just saw on the tele that Obama said that he kissed and hugged and shook hands with some of the nurses that treated this Liberian guy. If Prez gets it, there'll be some panic! (Well, the tea-tards will praise God).

[mistermack]

I just saw on the tele that Obama said that he kissed and hugged and shook hands with some of the nurses that treated this Liberian guy. If Prez gets it, there'll be some panic! (Well, the tea-tards will praise God).

Who's the vice-president?
I never took much notice.

edit:
Oh, that was back in August, so he's pretty safe. It was two missionaries that came back from Liberia that were treated there.
I bet they wouldn't have announced that, if he had been kissing the two nurses that have tested positive.

[pErvinalia]

OB won't get it, as he was the one who created ebola with his gay muslim terrorist brothers.

[cronus]

OB won't get it, as he was the one who created ebola with his gay muslim terrorist brothers.

...and the very difficult to make, very limited to 1% vaccine, is not gonna be denied the man.

[Seth]

I've often thought that it's a miracle you don't catch more stuff from toilets.
Especially men. If you sit and shit, your dick is banging about in exactly the same spot that someone else's dick did minutes before.
Women have got it easy.

I would be (and am) more concerned about surfaces like the flush button, the door lock and door handles. Going by the number of public toilets that don't appear to be flushed, others are pretty paranoid about the flush button. Public toilets would seem to me to be the place that a diarrhoea and vomit inducing contagious disease would spread. I'm keeping my distance from them from now on.

Women have perfected the "hover" for peeing that keeps them from touching the seat. Not very workable for taking a dump for men though. One of the benefits of the Turkish toilet (a hole in the ground with pads to squat on) is that you don't have to sit on anything, but it's tough with pants and it's made for Arab garb.

As for technique, I enter touching the door as little as possible with my little finger if I need to pull and with my shoulder if I need to push. Use the urinal or the toilet as required to pee, try not to crap ever, but if absolutely required, use paper to sit on. Do not touch the flush lever on the urinal. If they don't have an auto flush, tough luck for the next guy. Never touch the seat or handle on the toilet. Use foot or paper to flush if necessary. Touch only penis if possible and don't allow penis to touch anything else. Depending on the type of towel dispenser, let out a length and leave it hanging. Then turn on water, wet hands, soap up, scrub for 20 seconds minimum, rinse well, then tear off the paper and turn off the faucets using the paper. Use same paper to dispense more paper if it's not touchless, dry hands, use paper to open door if I have to pull and drop paper in waste bin which SHOULD be right next to the door. If there isn't a trash bin within reach with the door held open by a foot, drop paper on floor and exit, touching nothing.

Avoid handrails on stairs and escalators, push elevator buttons with either my key fob or a pen, always open pull doors by reaching for an unusual and perhaps difficult place to reach to minimize exposure to pathogens and don't touch face until hands have been washed or sanitizer is used.

Getting to the point where a P95 mask and disposable gloves are going to be required equipment. The Japanese have been wearing surgical masks in public for a long time now.

[pErvinalia]

Seth, you are one messed up paranoid. With Ebola scares, fair enough. Without a current epidemic scare, that's just bonkers. I definitely try to minimise my touching in public toilets, but a little bit of touch is ok. If you don't acclimatise yourself to various bacteria and virus's then when you get them, they get you hard. I haven't been sick in a very long time. I put that down to my less than anal hygiene.

[JimC]

Anal hygiene is very important.

[pErvinalia]

I don't know whether I misspelled that, or whether it is an unfortunate turn of phrase...

[Seth]

Seth, you are one messed up paranoid. With Ebola scares, fair enough. Without a current epidemic scare, that's just bonkers. I definitely try to minimise my touching in public toilets, but a little bit of touch is ok. If you don't acclimatise yourself to various bacteria and virus's then when you get them, they get you hard. I haven't been sick in a very long time. I put that down to my less than anal hygiene.

Dude, I'm 60 years old. I've been exposed to plenty of pathogens in my life and I have a reasonably healthy immune system. The steps I use were carefully thought out after a good deal of critical analysis of my public (and private) bathroom habits and I undertake them as a HABIT PATTERN carefully cultivated over years so that it is not in any way disruptive or time consuming. I do the same thing every single time because by doing so it leaves me with hands as clean as is possible coming out of a public bathroom. It sounds way more complex than it actually is. It's a set of "protocols" I learned in part when working in the ER, where I was exposed to every bodily fluid there is at one time or another.

Another example is showering. Start at the top with shampoo and face wash, work down to the feet and end up at the anus, washing it last so that you don't spread fecal bacteria to other parts of your body inadvertently, then wash hands thoroughly as the last act of showering. Don't use wash clothes or other items that can harbor bacteria while damp, use soap and hands only. I used to wash my body first, then hair, then face. Believe it or not, when I figured out the proper order my acne problems disappeared very quickly.

Built into a habit pattern it's no different than any other sequence except it minimizes the chances of contamination of mucous membranes or shower surfaces with fecal bacteria.

You just have to think about the order for a bit to see why its perfectly reasonable and rational to do it that way.

I'll bet you have never seriously pondered your toilet or shower habits.

For example, when you take a crap, after wiping do you flush with your wiping hand and do you use a square of paper to touch the lever/button? Do you reach down and pull your pants up, zip up and buckle your belt BEFORE shuffling to the washstand and washing your hands?

If so (as I used to) you run the risk of contaminating your pants zipper, button, belt and waistband. It's a very minor change in habit patterns that takes just a little while to ingrain to avoid this potential contamination.

It's the little things that will kill you with Ebola, like touching your face without even knowing you did so.

Don't mock what you don't understand. I'm trying to do you a favor by giving you information that might save your life and will probably help keep you healthier anyway.

There are many things we touch that we cannot avoid touching (like the steering wheel of your car...which I disinfect, along with all door handles every day), so why not change how you do things where you can to minimize potential exposures. It's not like putting on a Level 4 biohazard suit with SCBA after all.

[pErvinalia]

Seth, I hate to break it to you, but you aren't as smart as you think. The only difference between you and most of us here is you operate under a heightened state of paranoia about the world around you. In an extreme event, it's true, you will probably fare better than most. But it's a bit like the trade off between security and freedom in a nation context. Societies trade off a bit of security for freedom. The same with us. We accept that should an extreme event hit, we will probably die. We could implement all sorts of protocols to reduce that probability, but the hit to our freedom and mental health isn't worth it. You live under constant fear. Most of us live reasonably free mental lives. That's a choice we all make. Most of us think you are nuts for choosing to be so focused on potential negative outcomes. As you say repeatedly, we all die someday. Don't spend your life fighting death, Seth. Live a little.

[pErvinalia]

By the way, I "ponder" everything. That's part of my neurosis. Learning to let things go has been a real relief to me. Try it.

[mistermack]

It's getting too complicated to have a shit now. You need a laptop with pdf reader for the instructions.

In the old days, it went like this :

'' If you use this noble hall, use the paper, not the wall.
If by chance there is no paper, 'neath the seat you'll find the scraper.
If the scraper can't be found, drag your ass along the ground''.

Simples.

[pErvinalia]

Honestly, I'm sick of disgusting fucks like Seth who don't flush, and even take it a step further and don't touch the seat when they shit. I'm sick of going into a toilet with shit all over the seat, floor and walls. Selfish wankers. If everyone does a clean job, ,then the risk of transmission of nasties is much reduced.

[Seth]

Seth, I hate to break it to you, but you aren't as smart as you think. The only difference between you and most of us here is you operate under a heightened state of paranoia about the world around you.

Paranoia is defined as an irrational fear. My fear is perfectly rational and I understand that in a crisis, you will revert to your training, and if you fail to train, in a crisis you will do nothing. Therefore, building habit patterns that mitigate exposure to pathogens is not paranoid, it's proper planning and training.

In an extreme event, it's true, you will probably fare better than most.

Damned right I will. And I have fewer ordinary illnesses right now because of those practices.

But it's a bit like the trade of between security and freedom in a nation context. You trade off a bit of security for freedom.

What "freedom" am I trading off, pray tell? The freedom to wipe my nose with a shit-bacteria contaminated hand? The freedom to lie in bed moaning and groaning with the flu or a common cold because I didn't bother to think about not touching my face with dirty hands?

Get real. I forfeit no freedom whatsoever. It's second nature to me. A set of habit patterns that were consciously created to make it completely transparent to my daily life.

The same with us. We accept that should an extreme event hit, we will probably die. We could implement all sorts of protocols to reduce that probability, but the hit to our freedom and mental health isn't worth it.

You think that not thinking about disease transmission is "freedom?" How stupid is that? Pretty fucking stupid when the procedures for minimizing exposure are easy, simple and cause no disruption to anyone's lifestyle.

You live under constant fear.

No, I don't. Situational awareness and habitual safety protocols keep me from living in fear.

Most of us live reasonably free mental lives. That's a choice we all make. Most of us think you are nuts for choosing to be so focused on potential negative outcomes.

I don't think about negative outcomes with respect to public hygiene precisely BECAUSE I have thought critically about it in the past and made a conscious decision to ingrain habit patterns that minimize the risks without any thought at all. Sure, I had to think about it while forming the habit patterns, but now I don't give such things much thought at all. When I do, it's because I have recognized a transmission vector that needs to be addressed, like the seats, door handles and other interior surfaces my clients always touch. It take some extra effort to start the day off with some Clorox wipes, but not much more than it takes to make sure the exterior of the Benz is bright and shiny and doesn't have greasy fingerprint smudges on the door handles.

Is it worth it? Yes. I spend 10 hours a day in that car being exposed to many different people. While I cannot necessarily prevent pathogen transmission from a sick passenger while he's in the car, there's no excuse for exposing other passengers to that risk, much less sit in a contaminated car for a whole day without taking 5 minutes to wipe things down if someone exhibits symptoms of illness while in the car.

As you say repeatedly, we all die someday. Don't spend your life fighting death, Seth. Live a little.

I live a lot. I just do it with a clear understanding of the risks and a conscious decision to either mitigate or tolerate those risks rather than blithe ignorance and stupidity.

Your mileage may vary.

[Seth]

Honestly, I'm sick of disgusting fucks like Seth who don't flush, and even take it a step further and don't touch the seat when they shit. I'm sick of going into a toilet with shit all over the seat, floor and walls. Selfish wankers. If everyone does a clean job, ,then the risk of transmission of nasties is much reduced.

Not touching the seat doesn't mean making a mess, and I flush the toilet, but I use my foot or a square of paper to touch the lever. As for the urinal, if its not self-flushing, it should be. Talk to the proprietor if you're offended. I ain't touching that handle. I know what's on the end of my dick. I don't know what's on the end of YOUR dick that you just smeared on the handle with your dick-holding hand.