Malaysia jet crashes in east Ukraine conflict zone

[JimC]

It'n going to be the same Russian made missile no matter what party had it. I suspect Russia, still.

It creates massive public relations issues for Russia, so I still think the most likely answer is a separatist group with poor aircraft identification skills who thought they were shooting down a Ukraine transport plane with the missiles they had been given by Russia...

Everybody will deny it, of course, and try to heap the blame on the other parties.

These old ethnic hatreds in Europe will never die...

[Tero]

wiki

According to The Wall Street Journal the U.S. agencies are divided over whether the plane was downed by the Russian military or by pro-Russia separatists, who may lack the expertise required. Still they insist that "All roads lead to the Russians to some degree"

[JimC]

wiki

According to The Wall Street Journal the U.S. agencies are divided over whether the plane was downed by the Russian military or by pro-Russia separatists, who may lack the expertise required. Still they insist that "All roads lead to the Russians to some degree"

Perhaps Russian technical advisors with each separatist group with missiles?

But I would still argue that it was not a deliberate act by Russia, because it is a public relations nightmare...

[laklak]

I can't imagine it was a deliberate act, like Jim said it would be a nightmare for Putin, who is already not he most popular man in Europe. If I were a betting man I'd take odds it was mistaken identity, since the separatists had downed a Ukrainian transport the day before and were probably all pumped up, hoorah and all that. I'd also imagine that if there was a Russian adviser with them he's shitting enormous motherfucking bricks and waiting to be called back to Moscow to explain himself. I would not want to face Vlad under those circumstances.

[JimC]

I can't imagine it was a deliberate act, like Jim said it would be a nightmare for Putin, who is already not he most popular man in Europe. If I were a betting man I'd take odds it was mistaken identity, since the separatists had downed a Ukrainian transport the day before and were probably all pumped up, hoorah and all that. I'd also imagine that if there was a Russian adviser with them he's shitting enormous motherfucking bricks and waiting to be called back to Moscow to explain himself. I would not want to face Vlad under those circumstances.

[pErvinalia]

I wonder if it will turn out that there were some Americans on board. I bet Putin is really hoping there weren't.

[JimC]

I wonder if it will turn out that there were some Americans on board. I bet Putin is really hoping there weren't.

27 Aussies...

No Americans, as far as I'm aware...

[MiM]

The USA claims they will be able to track the shooting position, that should give another piece in the puzzle.

[Svartalf]

I can't imagine it was a deliberate act, like Jim said it would be a nightmare for Putin, who is already not he most popular man in Europe. If I were a betting man I'd take odds it was mistaken identity, since the separatists had downed a Ukrainian transport the day before and were probably all pumped up, hoorah and all that. I'd also imagine that if there was a Russian adviser with them he's shitting enormous motherfucking bricks and waiting to be called back to Moscow to explain himself. I would not want to face Vlad under those circumstances.

There's been talk of some rebels boasting about downing an inexistent Antonov 26 military transport right when the 777 was shot down.

[mistermack]

It'n going to be the same Russian made missile no matter what party had it. I suspect Russia, still.

This is from the article Jim linked :

But a message on the official Twitter account of the Donetsk People's Republic had announced hours earlier that insurgents had seized a series of Russian-made Buk systems capable of soaring to that height.
"@dnrpress: self-propelled Buk surface-to-air missile systems have been seized by the DNR from (Ukrainian) surface-to-air missile regiment A1402," said the post.
That tweet was later deleted as well.

It could well be what happened. Give a moron a gun, or a bomb, or a missile, and he's going to be itching to set it off. Whatever side he's on. And civil strife nearly always seems to put the loonies and wankers into power.

[Clinton Huxley]

It was shot down by Ukranian govt forces, according to Russia Today.

[Svartalf]

It was shot down by Ukranian govt forces, according to Russia Today.

and likely actually shot down by the Russkies themselves just so they could shift the blame.

[JimC]

Malaysia should declare war on Russia...

[Svartalf]

Lol, does the mosquito declare war on humans?

[Tero]

I no longer have a globe, but the map here shows what a string over a globe would show. Routes to Europe from Asia used to go over Ukraine, many now over Turkey. Flights to Finland go over Russia but only recently went over Ukraine.
http://www.cnn.com/interactive/2014/07/ ... ?hpt=hp_t1