Yesssiree $100k gonna cover ANY medical expense...

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Yesssiree $100k gonna cover ANY medical expense...

Post by macdoc » Tue Jun 17, 2014 10:54 pm

This is so wrong on so many levels.
Monday, June 16, 2014
THE COSTS OF CANCER
18
$3 Million for 7 Weeks
By Amanda Yaggy | June 16, 2014

Three weeks after my partner Randy died of metastatic cancer, I called the oncology resident who had been his on-call doctor. I remember exactly how long it took me to make that call because I was in a place of noticing how long things took, with mild interest, like: when will I feel hungry? When will the best part of every day stop being when I’m asleep?

It took me three weeks to work up to hearing Randy’s doctor’s voice on the phone and simultaneously make words in English.There was something I wanted to ask her or, more accurately, something I wanted to make her say.

“If you’d known how much time he had left,” I said, standing on our tiny back deck, looking over the early-spring woods, “would you still have given him chemo?”

What I remember is that she paused very briefly, and then she sounded choked up. That satisfied me, as if she were my enemy showing overdue weakness. “No.” she said, “Not if I’d known how long he had, no.”

“Thank you.” I said. We exchanged some version of “Nice working with you” and then hung up. I had wanted exactly what I got: an admission, maybe of having fucked up, maybe of the possibility that she’d act differently in the future. That next time she would acknowledge what she couldn’t fix. Show some respect, next time, for the monster: a rare and unbeatable cancer, the oncoming death of a still-young man.

Not long after that, the hospital called me. They were inquiring after the outstanding 10% of his bill not covered by his insurance, the first job benefits he’d ever had. That 10% of the bill for seven weeks of cancer treatment came to $300,000 and change. Randy had had a very rare cancer, a carcinoma of unknown primary origin: the original tumor had been shrunk to nothing by his immune system, but not before the cancer cells mutated and slipped into his bloodstream. So “poorly defined” cancer cells were spread throughout his body, with no point of origin, no tumor to be cut out or site to be irradiated.

In Randy’s case, by the time he was diagnosed he had cancer in his blood and in his bone marrow.

I don’t know why Randy agreed to the chemotherapy. I wasn’t in the room for that discussion. Randy never asked me what I thought he should do with his diagnosis, which had a five-year survival rate of zero. My turn at decision-making came later, when he was admitted for the second time, to Palliative Care. That day I only heard the word “palliative” by eavesdropping at a nurse’s station. By then Randy weighed 128 pounds at 6’2. He needed oxygen because the cancer had blocked some of his bronchial tubes, trapping an infection. They could have removed those particular tumors, but the lead oncologist explained, “You’ll be back here in a month. And you could die on the table.” I don’t remember Randy speaking, just leaning back into the pillows and shaking his head.
Randy had given me medical power of attorney, luckily. He was drifting in and out of lucidity. One of his oldest friends, a general contractor and a robust guy, threatened to fireman’s-carry him out of the hospital so he could die at home, but my father’s connections at another hospital allowed us to get Randy into hospice.

He spent one more night in the hospital, with the agreement that we would be leaving in the morning. I remember sleeping next to him and waking up and looking at the clock at 5:30. It was softly gray and he was sleeping peacefully and I lay there soaking up the closeness and the quiet, knowing that the hospital would be coming to life around us soon and there would be a lot to do.

Then it was the morning, and there were pieces of paper to be signed and the terrible waiting around for the paperwork to be done and the ambulance to be available and someone important from hospice was there to help expedite for some reason, because she was a friend of my father’s maybe. She was wearing a suit and pearls and was very nice but when she said, “I don’t know how you’re being so strong” I snapped at her, I don’t know why, and said, “I think that when people say that they mean ‘so glad it’s not me.’” I’m sure she was used to people needing to be angry; I hope she took it in stride.

The hurry went on as Randy’s breathing got more ragged and he closed his eyes more often, and the adjustable bed and the morphine pump were located and assembled and then we brought him home. He rode in an ambulance with a DNR order I’d signed, and I think maybe someone else drove my car home and I rode with him, but my memory here is patchy. I remember that my brother, bless him, and another old friend of Randy’s went to Kmart to get sheets that would fit, which seemed strange to me.

“This will not take that long,” I thought, watching them make the bed. “It won’t matter if the sheets don’t fit.”

I was right; Randy died around 8:00 that night. The only worthwhile treatment of the $3,000,000 of medicine administered by the hospital was a high dose of morphine, invented in 1804 and with a co-pay of $10 for, as it turned out, more than we needed (the fancy patented patches hadn’t been strong enough). From the beginning, from his diagnosis, when they said that his best-case scenario was an extra year, he lived for seven weeks.

Still a year would have been nice with nothing but $10 morphine and chicken soup. Five or six months even, without the nausea and the starving and the poisoning. It was Randy’s decision, and the doctors’ decision, and it’s hard for doctors to say, “We can’t help you.” That’s not their job: it’s not what they pictured themselves doing in medical school.

But chemotherapy made Randy’s remaining life shorter and worse. With his diagnosis, it’s hard to see how a doctor could have thought it was the right course of action. UNC is a teaching hospital; maybe he was a useful study. Maybe it always seems better to spend $3,000,000 than $10.
http://thehairpin.com/2014/06/3-million-for-7-weeks/

My biggest concern about my chemo and radiation and spinal chemo was how much for parking.
What a fucked up system in the US....predator heaven.
And some fools think they can self insure......

One of our constant discussions on the motorcycle forums is what insurance company we can trust to cover us in the US. Too many horror stories to risk it.
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Re: Yesssiree $100k gonna cover ANY medical expense...

Post by pErvinalia » Wed Jun 18, 2014 2:21 am

Seth gets Libbo discounts. Cancer only costs libbos $100K
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Re: Yesssiree $100k gonna cover ANY medical expense...

Post by FBM » Wed Jun 18, 2014 2:35 am

"A philosopher is a blind man in a dark room looking for a black cat that isn't there. A theologian is the man who finds it." ~ H. L. Mencken

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Re: Yesssiree $100k gonna cover ANY medical expense...

Post by Warren Dew » Wed Jun 18, 2014 6:00 am

I don't pay for "equity". I'd rather have a 50% chance of living to 80 than a certainty of dying at 70, even though the latter ranks higher on the medical equity scale.

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Re: Yesssiree $100k gonna cover ANY medical expense...

Post by PsychoSerenity » Wed Jun 18, 2014 11:16 am

Warren Dew wrote:I don't pay for "equity". I'd rather have a 50% chance of living to 80 than a certainty of dying at 70, even though the latter ranks higher on the medical equity scale.
Would that not also give you a 50% chance of dying by 60? Or are you saying other people can die younger so that you can die older? :think:
[Disclaimer - if this is comes across like I think I know what I'm talking about, I want to make it clear that I don't. I'm just trying to get my thoughts down]

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Re: Yesssiree $100k gonna cover ANY medical expense...

Post by MrJonno » Wed Jun 18, 2014 11:41 am

I generally in most things in life I consider myself to be 'average' and worry more about things going downhill than improving.

So on the whole I'm definitely more interested in average figures for anything because on average they are likely to apply to me
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Re: Yesssiree $100k gonna cover ANY medical expense...

Post by Warren Dew » Wed Jun 18, 2014 3:43 pm

PsychoSerenity wrote:
Warren Dew wrote:I don't pay for "equity". I'd rather have a 50% chance of living to 80 than a certainty of dying at 70, even though the latter ranks higher on the medical equity scale.
Would that not also give you a 50% chance of dying by 60? Or are you saying other people can die younger so that you can die older? :think:
A 50% chance of dying at 70 and a 50% chance of dying at 80 is considered "less equitable" in these studies than a 100% chance of dying at 70. In this case, I prefer the "less equitable" solution.

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Re: Yesssiree $100k gonna cover ANY medical expense...

Post by PsychoSerenity » Wed Jun 18, 2014 4:04 pm

Warren Dew wrote:
PsychoSerenity wrote:
Warren Dew wrote:I don't pay for "equity". I'd rather have a 50% chance of living to 80 than a certainty of dying at 70, even though the latter ranks higher on the medical equity scale.
Would that not also give you a 50% chance of dying by 60? Or are you saying other people can die younger so that you can die older? :think:
A 50% chance of dying at 70 and a 50% chance of dying at 80 is considered "less equitable" in these studies than a 100% chance of dying at 70. In this case, I prefer the "less equitable" solution.
:what: Well that's because you've again shifted the average life expectancy in your favour. I could do exactly the same and offer you 50% chance of living to 70, 50% chance of dying at 40, vs a more equitable 100% chance of living to 70.
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Re: Yesssiree $100k gonna cover ANY medical expense...

Post by Strontium Dog » Wed Jun 18, 2014 6:57 pm

$3m for a few chemicals. Incomprehensible.
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Re: Yesssiree $100k gonna cover ANY medical expense...

Post by MiM » Wed Jun 18, 2014 7:08 pm

Strontium Dog wrote:$3m for a few chemicals. Incomprehensible.
Its not only for a few chemicals, its also for expensive equipment, for a highly trained doctors ridiculously high salary, but especially for the doctors and hospitals liability/malpractice insurance fees, which (if I have understood correctly) are astronomical... so in the end most of that money ends up with insurance companies and lawyers, all as it should be...
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Re: Yesssiree $100k gonna cover ANY medical expense...

Post by Warren Dew » Wed Jun 18, 2014 8:30 pm

PsychoSerenity wrote:
Warren Dew wrote:
PsychoSerenity wrote:
Warren Dew wrote:I don't pay for "equity". I'd rather have a 50% chance of living to 80 than a certainty of dying at 70, even though the latter ranks higher on the medical equity scale.
Would that not also give you a 50% chance of dying by 60? Or are you saying other people can die younger so that you can die older? :think:
A 50% chance of dying at 70 and a 50% chance of dying at 80 is considered "less equitable" in these studies than a 100% chance of dying at 70. In this case, I prefer the "less equitable" solution.
:what: Well that's because you've again shifted the average life expectancy in your favour.
That's exactly the point. What should matter is expected life expectancy, not "equitability".

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Re: Yesssiree $100k gonna cover ANY medical expense...

Post by PsychoSerenity » Wed Jun 18, 2014 9:31 pm

Warren Dew wrote:
PsychoSerenity wrote:
Warren Dew wrote:
PsychoSerenity wrote:
Warren Dew wrote:I don't pay for "equity". I'd rather have a 50% chance of living to 80 than a certainty of dying at 70, even though the latter ranks higher on the medical equity scale.
Would that not also give you a 50% chance of dying by 60? Or are you saying other people can die younger so that you can die older? :think:
A 50% chance of dying at 70 and a 50% chance of dying at 80 is considered "less equitable" in these studies than a 100% chance of dying at 70. In this case, I prefer the "less equitable" solution.
:what: Well that's because you've again shifted the average life expectancy in your favour.
That's exactly the point. What should matter is expected life expectancy, not "equitability".
Ok, well the U.S. also comes last at that:

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Re: Yesssiree $100k gonna cover ANY medical expense...

Post by Warren Dew » Wed Jun 18, 2014 10:57 pm

Life expectancy is not in your graphic. And frankly, any ranking which puts the UK at #1 overall is very highly questionable.

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Re: Yesssiree $100k gonna cover ANY medical expense...

Post by Hermit » Wed Jun 18, 2014 11:31 pm

Indeed, it's not, but of the countries mentioned the US still ranks last.

Switzerland 82.39
Australia 82.07
Sweden 81.89
Canada 81.67
France 81.66
Norway 81.60
Netherlands 81.12
New Zealand 80.93
Germany 80.44
United Kingdom 80.42
USA 79.56
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Re: Yesssiree $100k gonna cover ANY medical expense...

Post by MrJonno » Thu Jun 19, 2014 10:46 am

Quite a lot of variation in the type of health care (ie private/public) in that list but that all have one thing in comment except the US. In all of them the state/society has the responsibility of at least ensuring everyone has healthcare even if its to force people to pay for it via a private company and just pick up the bill when they can't
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