Catholic Chruch won't let me leave.

[Cormac]

It has a material impact.

Over 95% of schools in Ireland are run by the Catholic Church.

These are 100% state funded, which means that my taxes are handed over to that church.

Those schools are permitted to deny my children entrance, on the basis that I am an atheist.

This position is shored up in a number of ways, but largely by reference to a spurious number of Catholics in this country.

It is changing, and changing quickly, but not quickly enough.

Dunno, the Christian Brothers school I worked at 25 years ago took in protestant kids, and I doubt they'd have refused atheist's kids.

They will, but can discriminate and select Catholic Children over mine.

But the exclusion is more subtle. They make it impossible for a child's parents to vindicate their right not to suffer proselytisation in school.

[Cormac]

It has a material impact.

Over 95% of schools in Ireland are run by the Catholic Church.

These are 100% state funded, which means that my taxes are handed over to that church.

Those schools are permitted to deny my children entrance, on the basis that I am an atheist.

This position is shored up in a number of ways, but largely by reference to a spurious number of Catholics in this country.

It is changing, and changing quickly, but not quickly enough.

Dunno, the Christian Brothers school I worked at 25 years ago took in protestant kids, and I doubt they'd have refused atheist's kids.

Oh, and apart from that, my money is still use to promote Catholicism, Anglicanism, Methodism, Islam, and some other religions. This is outrageous.

[Cormac]

Excommunication doesn't matter. Even when excommunicated, the church still considers you to be Catholic. You're just, temporarily out of God's grace, and so not allowed to take part in the sacraments.

But you'll still be in the numbers.

Not, if you go by the census that takes place every five years. I think those numbers are more important than the ones the catholic church may or may not assert. Unfortunately, 3.5 of the 3.9 million Irish declared themselves (and their children) to be of the catholic christian faith in the 2011 census. Of course most of them are perhaps only nominally catholic, but those are the figures the catatonic chruch can more or less rightfully cite.

All part of the same game.

There was a lot of protest about the structuring of the question about religion, and guaranteed a high response.

[Horwood Beer-Master]

Tell them you love the Archbishop of Canterbury and want to have his babies (and that these babies will be named "Martin", "Luther", "Ian" and "Paisley").

[Animavore]

Tell them you love the Archbishop of Canterbury and want to have his babies (and that these babies will be named "Martin", "Luther", "Ian" and "Paisley").

I prefer the names, "Breakfast", "Lunch", "Dinner" and "Supper".

[Seth]

It has a material impact.

Over 95% of schools in Ireland are run by the Catholic Church.

These are 100% state funded, which means that my taxes are handed over to that church.

Those schools are permitted to deny my children entrance, on the basis that I am an atheist.

This position is shored up in a number of ways, but largely by reference to a spurious number of Catholics in this country.

It is changing, and changing quickly, but not quickly enough.

Dunno, the Christian Brothers school I worked at 25 years ago took in protestant kids, and I doubt they'd have refused atheist's kids.

They will, but can discriminate and select Catholic Children over mine.

But the exclusion is more subtle. They make it impossible for a child's parents to vindicate their right not to suffer proselytisation in school.

As far as I know no parent has a "right" "not to suffer proselytiation" in a religious school. Nor do their children.

If you don't want your kids attending a religious school, then don't send them to one. Pretty simple really.

Oh, wait, I see what your complaint is: You want SOMEBODY ELSE to pay to educate your child and you ALSO want control over what they get taught using OPM.

All I can say to that is "move to the US," or keep your John Thomas in your pants and don't have kids.

[Seth]

It has a material impact.

Over 95% of schools in Ireland are run by the Catholic Church.

These are 100% state funded, which means that my taxes are handed over to that church.

Those schools are permitted to deny my children entrance, on the basis that I am an atheist.

This position is shored up in a number of ways, but largely by reference to a spurious number of Catholics in this country.

It is changing, and changing quickly, but not quickly enough.

Dunno, the Christian Brothers school I worked at 25 years ago took in protestant kids, and I doubt they'd have refused atheist's kids.

Oh, and apart from that, my money is still use to promote Catholicism, Anglicanism, Methodism, Islam, and some other religions. This is outrageous.

No it's not, it's DEMOCRACY, "good and hard."

[Svartalf]

Oh, and apart from that, my money is still use to promote Catholicism, Anglicanism, Methodism, Islam, and some other religions. This is outrageous.

I can get that

[mistermack]

Perhaps we can get our own back, by having a ritual that makes you an official atheist.

No need to get the consent of the person involved. That's never bothered the christians.

Just start a thread, with a yes or no question attached, with the question :

'' do you want xxx to be a confirmed atheist '' and if you get ten yeses, that's it, they're officially an atheist.

[Cormac]

It has a material impact.

Over 95% of schools in Ireland are run by the Catholic Church.

These are 100% state funded, which means that my taxes are handed over to that church.

Those schools are permitted to deny my children entrance, on the basis that I am an atheist.

This position is shored up in a number of ways, but largely by reference to a spurious number of Catholics in this country.

It is changing, and changing quickly, but not quickly enough.

Dunno, the Christian Brothers school I worked at 25 years ago took in protestant kids, and I doubt they'd have refused atheist's kids.

They will, but can discriminate and select Catholic Children over mine.

But the exclusion is more subtle. They make it impossible for a child's parents to vindicate their right not to suffer proselytisation in school.

As far as I know no parent has a "right" "not to suffer proselytiation" in a religious school. Nor do their children.

If you don't want your kids attending a religious school, then don't send them to one. Pretty simple really.

Oh, wait, I see what your complaint is: You want SOMEBODY ELSE to pay to educate your child and you ALSO want control over what they get taught using OPM.

All I can say to that is "move to the US," or keep your John Thomas in your pants and don't have kids.

Nope.

Our constitution guarantees that right. It also bars our state from endowing ANY religion, yet our state funds religious education in 99.5% of schoos, and fails to provide a mechanism to vindicate the constitutional protection against proselytisation.

Also, it isn't a question of me wanting someone else to pay for my children's education. I pay taxes here, and those taxes contribute to the education budget which FULLY funds those schools, and those schools have a constitutional obligation to provide my children with a religion free education, if that is my preference, are yet allowed under the law to ignore my preferences and proselytise anyway. I pay the tax and the state reneges on its part of the deal.

As it happens, I am one of the lucky ones. We have an Educate Together school about 7 miles away, and we bring our older boy there. In these schools children of all faiths and none are welcome. They teach about all religions, agnosticism, and atheism, and the schools deliberately do not value one over the other. But having this close by is very lucky in Ireland. These schools are over subscribed in a big way, and there aren't many of them. We pass three other primary schools on the way, and indeed, in a five mile radius of our house there are about seven other tax funded schools. Most of them are on my wife's road to work. I work 75km the other direction.

All schools in Ireland should be Educate Together, for two main reasons. The first is that we have limited resources, and it is moronic and discriminatory to pretend that the state can facilitate everyone's favourite ethos in state funded schools because we can't afford it, apart from it being a flat contradiction of the constitution.

Edit: Oops. Sorry. The second reason is that we have an ignoble history of sectarianism in this country, and sectarian schooling only serves to sustain such stupidity. When kids grow and learn together, they've a better chance of not turning out like sectarian or racist asshole.

[Cormac]

It has a material impact.

Over 95% of schools in Ireland are run by the Catholic Church.

These are 100% state funded, which means that my taxes are handed over to that church.

Those schools are permitted to deny my children entrance, on the basis that I am an atheist.

This position is shored up in a number of ways, but largely by reference to a spurious number of Catholics in this country.

It is changing, and changing quickly, but not quickly enough.

Dunno, the Christian Brothers school I worked at 25 years ago took in protestant kids, and I doubt they'd have refused atheist's kids.

Oh, and apart from that, my money is still use to promote Catholicism, Anglicanism, Methodism, Islam, and some other religions. This is outrageous.

No it's not, it's DEMOCRACY, "good and hard."

Nope, it is a constiutional breach, plain and simple.

[Seth]

It has a material impact.

Over 95% of schools in Ireland are run by the Catholic Church.

These are 100% state funded, which means that my taxes are handed over to that church.

Those schools are permitted to deny my children entrance, on the basis that I am an atheist.

This position is shored up in a number of ways, but largely by reference to a spurious number of Catholics in this country.

It is changing, and changing quickly, but not quickly enough.

Dunno, the Christian Brothers school I worked at 25 years ago took in protestant kids, and I doubt they'd have refused atheist's kids.

They will, but can discriminate and select Catholic Children over mine.

But the exclusion is more subtle. They make it impossible for a child's parents to vindicate their right not to suffer proselytisation in school.

As far as I know no parent has a "right" "not to suffer proselytiation" in a religious school. Nor do their children.

If you don't want your kids attending a religious school, then don't send them to one. Pretty simple really.

Oh, wait, I see what your complaint is: You want SOMEBODY ELSE to pay to educate your child and you ALSO want control over what they get taught using OPM.

All I can say to that is "move to the US," or keep your John Thomas in your pants and don't have kids.

Nope.

Our constitution guarantees that right.

Boy, don't you just fucking HATE it when your government ignores the very founding documents that give it (and don't give it) authority to govern?

I sure do. I mean really, my Constitution guarantees my right to keep and bear arms and it flatly forbids Congress (or any other sub-level government thanks to the 14th Amendment) from "infringing' on that right. And yet it does so all the time. And fuckwits on the Interwebz keep nattering on about how that's a good thing, and that constitutions are pieces of paper (parchment actually) written by old dead guys that don't mean anything and must be adapted or ignored consistent with the needs and desires of....wait for it....the collective.

But it seems that some of them get all pissy and hypocritical when THEY get THEIR ox gored by their own government ignoring THEIR rights (which some other Marxist fuckwits on the Interwebz don't even agree exist at all) and doing as the collective pleases.

I like to call that "rank hypocrisy."

It also bars our state from endowing ANY religion, yet our state funds religious education in 99.5% of schoos, and fails to provide a mechanism to vindicate the constitutional protection against proselytisation.

Dang socialists, ignoring pieces of paper written by old dead white guys. What the fuck is up with that anyway??

Also, it isn't a question of me wanting someone else to pay for my children's education.

Of course it is. Otherwise you'd pay for a private school education for your kids.

I pay taxes here, and those taxes contribute to the education budget which FULLY funds those schools, and those schools have a constitutional obligation to provide my children with a religion free education,

Fuck man, there's those old dead white guys groping up your skirt from the grave. Seems the collective disagrees with them, and you, and have decided what's best for your kids. That you don't like that means fuck-all because your kids don't belong to you, they are effectively wards of the state, to be raised as the collective deigns suitable. Fucking sucks, doesn't it?

if that is my preference, are yet allowed under the law to ignore my preferences and proselytise anyway. I pay the tax and the state reneges on its part of the deal.

Wow. That really sucks man...or it would if rank hypocrisy weren't involved. As it is, I can only say that you're getting exactly what you deserve, good and hard. Pity about your kids though.

As it happens, I am one of the lucky ones. We have an Educate Together school about 7 miles away, and we bring our older boy there. In these schools children of all faiths and none are welcome. They teach about all religions, agnosticism, and atheism, and the schools deliberately do not value one over the other. But having this close by is very lucky in Ireland. These schools are over subscribed in a big way, and there aren't many of them. We pass three other primary schools on the way, and indeed, in a five mile radius of our house there are about seven other tax funded schools. Most of them are on my wife's road to work. I work 75km the other direction.

Sucks being part of a marginalized "minority" doesn't it? Nobody wants to listen to your complaints. They just say "Shut the fuck up Comrade or we'll re-educate you into proper Marxist obedience." Go figure.

All schools in Ireland should be Educate Together, for two main reasons. The first is that we have limited resources, and it is moronic and discriminatory to pretend that the state can facilitate everyone's favourite ethos in state funded schools because we can't afford it, apart from it being a flat contradiction of the constitution.

Well, now all you have to do is convince everybody else, or at least a majority of them, and get them to vote for change...before some bureaucratic minion decides that you're a pain in his bureaucratic ass and decides to have you liquidated. Welcome to Democracy my friend...good, hard Democracy.

Edit: Oops. Sorry. The second reason is that we have an ignoble history of sectarianism in this country, and sectarian schooling only serves to sustain such stupidity. When kids grow and learn together, they've a better chance of not turning out like sectarian or racist asshole.

Evidently the consensus is that atheists are the assholes and the collective is determined not to let children be raised up as atheistic assholes. Or so it seems anyway.

Don't know what to tell you man...well, except perhaps it's time to take up arms against the sectarian tyranny you suffer under.

Oh, wait, you don't have any arms to take up, do you?

Damn. You're just completely and totally fucked dude.

How's that petard feel between your knees?

[Xamonas Chegwé]

What crawled up your arse today, Seth? Go take a happy pill.

[Seth]

What crawled up your arse today, Seth? Go take a happy pill.

Been there, done that. I'm feeling acerbic today. And I'm intensely enjoying pointing out the rank hypocrisy of a socialist complaining about pure unadulterated democratic decision-making that just happens to gore his ox.

[Xamonas Chegwé]

What crawled up your arse today, Seth? Go take a happy pill.

Been there, done that. I'm feeling acerbic today. And I'm intensely enjoying pointing out the rank hypocrisy of a socialist complaining about pure unadulterated democratic decision-making that just happens to gore his ox.

No. That's just what you think you're doing. What you're really doing is , at least as far as everyone else is concerned. Nobody likes you enough, or values your opinions enough, to actually read what you write.

Maybe that's their loss. I wouldn't know. I don't read it either.