The case against guns

[Blind groper]

I do not feel aggrieved at being called a small pussy of a man. It is, after all, impossible to insult someone against his or her will. I feel no insult unless the person doing the insult is someone I respect. In that case it can hurt. But not here.

I was also called someone who should not own a gun, since I felt a surge of power when holding a loaded hand gun. That may even be true. Just as well I lack the sick desire to own a murder weapon.

However, if I fit that class, there will be many millions of Americans who also fit that class. None of them should own a gun for the same reason. Better to ban hand guns.

Seth, who claims I have not addressed the issue of "rights". I have addressed it more times than I can count. The answer is always the same. There are no divinely given "rights" because there is no divinity.

Nor are there any "natural rights", since nature, via evolution has no such concept.

"Rights"are, and always have been, just that which people in power condescendingly permit the people to have, and only then grudgingly and from political expedience.

[Collector1337]

I was also called someone who should not own a gun, since I felt a surge of power when holding a loaded hand gun. That may even be true. Just as well I lack the sick desire to own a murder weapon.

Murder weapon? Seriously? It's not a murder weapon unless you murder someone with it.

However, if I fit that class, there will be many millions of Americans who also fit that class. None of them should own a gun for the same reason. Better to ban hand guns.

So just hand guns, but I AR-15s are okay?

Seth, who claims I have not addressed the issue of "rights". I have addressed it more times than I can count. The answer is always the same. There are no divinely given "rights" because there is no divinity.

Nor are there any "natural rights", since nature, via evolution has no such concept.

Evolution has given us the intelligence to create tools and since we are just like any other animal, we have a right to defend our survival, just like any other animal would attack if scared or provoked.

"Rights"are, and always have been, just that which people in power condescendingly permit the people to have, and only then grudgingly and from political expedience.

I don't really care what the people in power permit or not.



Could you help me out?

Why do you think when I hold a gun I do not feel the, "surge of power" that you feel? I don't get the feeling at all. It's completely absent.

[rainbow]

Evolution has given us the intelligence to create tools and since we are just like any other animal, we have a right to defend our survival, just like any other animal would attack if scared or provoked.

Evolution has given me the intelligence to build a nail bomb. This could be used to defend my house and property from armed invaders.
Should I be allowed to do so?

[Blind groper]

To Collector.

Re the AR15.
I am not sure I want to make a blanket statement to the effect that they are OK. However, they kill, as far as I know, very few people. The statistics show that hand guns are the most used murder weapons in the USA, and this is why they are the main target for any rational person wanting to save lives.

On your claim you feel no sense of power while holding a gun, the most obvious explanation (which I admit does not necessarily make it the correct explanation) is that you are acclimated, or hardened to it, after many years of playing with your lethal toys. That does not necessarily make you less dangerous. Being so acclimated to wielding tools designed to kill people may just make you more likely to use them in a situation where you should not.

[MrJonno]

So, you're a small... small, pussy of a "man," who when he holds a pistol feels

Anyone who calls someone a pussy shouldn't be let near a firearm (or anything else). It's the whole being a real man bollocks we don't need in society anymore and haven't needed since we stopped hunting.

Muscles beyond those you need to type,walk and speak aren't needed much any more, the brain is used instead

So no one does physical labor anymore?

It's not really valued anymore and is something most people will try to avoid if they can, reality there is nothing a man can do that a woman can't they actually has much respect in society and there are things women can do that men do that are valued (99.999% of the reproduction work is by a woman).

Technology and civilization has made traditional masculinity obsolete, it hasnt made men obsolete but there are a few dinosaurs who havent adapted to the new reality

[Blind groper]

One of the things that I have been saying, and Seth has been denying, is that most Americans want better gun control regulations. Here is another NEJM reference to back up my statements.


http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMp1300512

Turns out that not only most Americans, but most American gun owners, and even most NRA members want better regulations, such as background checks on each and every gun sale, and a limited to the size of gun magazines.

[Collector1337]

To Collector.

Re the AR15.
I am not sure I want to make a blanket statement to the effect that they are OK. However, they kill, as far as I know, very few people. The statistics show that hand guns are the most used murder weapons in the USA, and this is why they are the main target for any rational person wanting to save lives.

On your claim you feel no sense of power while holding a gun, the most obvious explanation (which I admit does not necessarily make it the correct explanation) is that you are acclimated, or hardened to it, after many years of playing with your lethal toys. That does not necessarily make you less dangerous. Being so acclimated to wielding tools designed to kill people may just make you more likely to use them in a situation where you should not.

Firearms are not toys.

You want to know why I don't feel the "surge of power" that you feel?

Because I know I'm not going to kill anyone, so there is no power to have.

[Hermit]

Does anybody else get the impression that Gallstones has availed herself to a sock-puppet account?

[Blind groper]

To Collector, who thinks firearms are not toys.

That is only true for firearms with a legitimate use, such as hunting rifles and shot guns. Hand guns are most definitely toys. Very dangerous toys. They have no legitimate use, and are bought by people who want to play at pretending to be "Dirty Harry."

The excuse of 'self defense' is shown to be incorrect, when the hard data proves that owning a hand guns increases, not decreases, your risk of getting murdered.

[JimC]

To Collector, who thinks firearms are not toys.

That is only true for firearms with a legitimate use, such as hunting rifles and shot guns. Hand guns are most definitely toys. Very dangerous toys. They have no legitimate use, and are bought by people who want to play at pretending to be "Dirty Harry."

The excuse of 'self defense' is shown to be incorrect, when the hard data proves that owning a hand guns increases, not decreases, your risk of getting murdered.

For civilians, sure.

But they are legitimate tools in law enforcement (albeit used sparingly, one hopes) and the military.

[Collector1337]

To Collector, who thinks firearms are not toys.

That is only true for firearms with a legitimate use, such as hunting rifles and shot guns. Hand guns are most definitely toys. Very dangerous toys. They have no legitimate use, and are bought by people who want to play at pretending to be "Dirty Harry."

The excuse of 'self defense' is shown to be incorrect, when the hard data proves that owning a hand guns increases, not decreases, your risk of getting murdered.

You think people don't hunt with pistols? Ignorant much?

You don't think self defense is legitimate? Tell that to anyone who carries a gun for a living or anyone like me who has used a pistol in self defense.

Oh wait. You are.

You are an ignorant fool who doesn't have the foggiest idea what you're talking about. My personal experience far outweighs your lack of experience and bullshit.

You don't live your life based on fucking statistics. If you did, you'd never step foot inside a car or go anywhere near a street or highway. You also wouldn't live in a big city surrounded by people, touching the same door knobs as thousands of people whom you might catch something from and possibly die.

Agoraphobia might be right up your alley it seems.

[JimC]

You got one thing right in the above post.

A lack of bullshit from BG...

[Collector1337]

You got one thing right in the above post.

A lack of bullshit from BG...

[Blind groper]

Collector

There are people who hunt with hand guns, certainly. They would be the first to tell you how much harder that is compared to hunting with a rifle. A hand gun is much inferior as a hunting weapon.

Hand guns are designed to kill people, as their number 1 and prime function. They work at close range, meaning when one person is interacting with another, such as during an argument, or in the same room. Those uses are called murder. So I have no hesitation in describing hand guns as first and foremost as tools for murder.

Keeping a hand gun for "self defense" is self defeating since, as I have shown, having a hand gun increases (2 to 4 times according to NEJM), not reduces, your risk of being killed. It also drastically (2 to 10 fold according to NEJM) increases the odds of a member of your family killing him or herself.

As to my so called ignorance. No. Not so. As witnessed by the firm references I post. True ignorance comes from those people who rely on anecdotes and unsupported opinion.

[Tyrannical]

One of my workmates just came back from vacation, with a brand new AR-15 he picked up. He got a hell of a deal at only $600.