Masturbation is forbidden for every Catholic

[Coito ergo sum]

Forgive me Father, for I have sinned. Hail Mary, Hail Mary, Hail Mary .

I can help with that, my child --

On your knees please -- If you do my penance, all will be well.

[Animavore]

Catholicism - Ironically sexy since Jesus got whipped.

[Kristie]

Forgive me Father, for I have sinned. Hail Mary, Hail Mary, Hail Mary .

Whoa, it's Hail Mary, full of grace you depraved heathen!

[Coito ergo sum]

Mary was a slut.

[Seth]

Sex during marriage for pleasure is technically against Catholic dogma. Sex should be for procreation, they say, and that to copulate for the pleasure of it is a debasement.

Not at all true. According to my sources, Catholic doctrine is that sex for pleasure between married partners is perfectly fine, so long as the couple remains open to the possibility that it may result in the creation of a new living human being with a soul. In other words, sex for pleasure in marriage is not proscribed, but sex for pleasure in marriage when using birth control of any kind is a sin. Pleasure is not forbidden, especially between husband and wife, and it is in fact an important sacrament in a Catholic marriage, it's just that it comes with the possibility of making a baby that must be accepted.

You're right about the last bit, but we can go a bit further and take the position that Catholic teaching is both wrong and injurious. The repressive sexual dogma of Catholicism has caused many hundreds of millions of people quite a lot of angst and guilt, because people react to their natural feelings of sexual attraction to others with self-blame and self-loathing. People have, for hundreds of years, been subject to the teachings of the Catholic church, which they were raised to believe was sanctified by some god, and have thought that there is something 'wrong" or "evil" or "sinful" about their desire to have sex for pleasure, and their urges to have sex for pleasure. There are exceptions, like Pope Gregory IV's expiation on sex between infertile married couples, but the sex always have to be for a unitive and procreative intent or purpose -- i.e. - sex for pleasure's sake is still sinful.

Nope. See above. And if you feel guilt about transgressing Catholic doctrine, well, that's the whole point of Catholic doctrine; to encourage you to live a life within the tenets of the Catholic church if you choose to be a Catholic.

Women pleasing their husbands orally -- sinful. Men doing the same for their wives - sinful. Wanking each other. Wanking oneself. Coitus interruptus. Foreplay. Anal sex. All that -- even in marriage - sinful.

Correct, because the purpose of sex in Catholicism is procreation and all those acts deliberately and intentionally corrupt and pervert Catholic doctrine. If you don't like Catholic doctrine, don't be a Catholic. And if you refuse to abide by Catholic doctrine, then don't call yourself a Catholic. Pretty simple really. It's a private club and its rules are not conditioned upon the approval of non-members.

Their rules are dopey. I, for one, won't limit myself to just not being Catholic, and then withholding all comment about it. If the topic comes up, I see no reason why I have to hold back my opinion on how silly I think their rules are.

It might help if you actually knew what you were talking about though, so you don't look quite so much the fool.

[Xamonas Chegwé]

Forgive me Father, for I have sinned. Hail Mary, Hail Mary, Hail Mary .

Whoa, it's Hail Mary, full of grace you depraved heathen!

Hairy Mary, full of grease?

[Coito ergo sum]

Sex during marriage for pleasure is technically against Catholic dogma. Sex should be for procreation, they say, and that to copulate for the pleasure of it is a debasement.

Not at all true. According to my sources, Catholic doctrine is that sex for pleasure between married partners is perfectly fine, so long as the couple remains open to the possibility that it may result in the creation of a new living human being with a soul. In other words, sex for pleasure in marriage is not proscribed, but sex for pleasure in marriage when using birth control of any kind is a sin. Pleasure is not forbidden, especially between husband and wife, and it is in fact an important sacrament in a Catholic marriage, it's just that it comes with the possibility of making a baby that must be accepted.

That's so much gobbledygook. Sex exclusively for pleasure is a sin -- that's why even the calendar method of birth control is a sin. The pleasure of sex is not a sin, if it's done for a reason other than procreation. I.e. if you fuck because it feels good, and try not to get pregnant -- like if you fuck, but then pull out before you come, then that's a sin. If you're going to put it in there, you have to ejaculate inside her.

You're right about the last bit, but we can go a bit further and take the position that Catholic teaching is both wrong and injurious. The repressive sexual dogma of Catholicism has caused many hundreds of millions of people quite a lot of angst and guilt, because people react to their natural feelings of sexual attraction to others with self-blame and self-loathing. People have, for hundreds of years, been subject to the teachings of the Catholic church, which they were raised to believe was sanctified by some god, and have thought that there is something 'wrong" or "evil" or "sinful" about their desire to have sex for pleasure, and their urges to have sex for pleasure. There are exceptions, like Pope Gregory IV's expiation on sex between infertile married couples, but the sex always have to be for a unitive and procreative intent or purpose -- i.e. - sex for pleasure's sake is still sinful.

Nope. See above. And if you feel guilt about transgressing Catholic doctrine, well, that's the whole point of Catholic doctrine; to encourage you to live a life within the tenets of the Catholic church if you choose to be a Catholic.

Yup.

But, saying 'that's the whole point of Catholic doctrine" doesn't change the fact that I think Catholic doctrine is ill-advised, and stupid, and harmful. We all know we can all "choose to be Muslim" or "choose to be Catholic"or "choose to be Scientologist." That's a completely different issue than stating one's view that Catholicism is stupid.

Women pleasing their husbands orally -- sinful. Men doing the same for their wives - sinful. Wanking each other. Wanking oneself. Coitus interruptus. Foreplay. Anal sex. All that -- even in marriage - sinful.

Correct, because the purpose of sex in Catholicism is procreation and all those acts deliberately and intentionally corrupt and pervert Catholic doctrine. If you don't like Catholic doctrine, don't be a Catholic. And if you refuse to abide by Catholic doctrine, then don't call yourself a Catholic. Pretty simple really. It's a private club and its rules are not conditioned upon the approval of non-members.

I won't be Catholic. But, I'll also speak out against Catholicism, because it is a bunch of hogwash.

And, the rules of civil discourse do not prohibit speaking out against private clubs. WE all know they're allowed to do what they want. That doesn't mean we have to agree with them, or keep our mouths shut about them. They don't keep their mouths shut about what non-Catholics do. So why must I keep my mouth shut about what they do?

Their rules are dopey. I, for one, won't limit myself to just not being Catholic, and then withholding all comment about it. If the topic comes up, I see no reason why I have to hold back my opinion on how silly I think their rules are.

It might help if you actually knew what you were talking about though, so you don't look quite so much the fool.

Fuck off, Seth.

I do know what I'm talking about. Sex in marriage must be unitive AND procreative. Pleasure is allowed, but only in sex that is unitive and procreation. Pleasure in sex is not sinful per se, but sex even in marriage exclusively for pleasure is, in fact, sinful according to Catholic dogma.

Damn, you're impossible. Can't you ever be a human being?

When it comes to religious views and groups, you routinely make this argument -- "if you don't agree with them, then don't join their group," etc. - like you're making here with respect to Catholics. Why don't you hold yourself to the same standard? If you don't agree with atheists or atheism, shut your fucking hole and don't be an atheist, eh? We're also a "private club" and we can make our own rules. Yet you don't ever shut your festering gob about what you think about atheists and atheism, do you? No, you don't. And, of course you have every right to speak out against atheism and atheists, even though you've never let your overwhelming ignorance and almost purposeful misconstruction of atheism stop you.

Christ on a bicycle man. I tell you what -- I'll agree to not comment on Catholic dogma, if you agree never to utter another word about atheists or atheism. Deal?

[Ian]

Mary was a slut.

This is my favorite pet theory to explain the advent of Christianity, by the way. Mary realized she was pregnant, but she and Joseph had not yet gotten jiggy, so she had to make up a tall tale lest she wind up in mortal danger as an adultress. Voila - a virgin birth.

This was also a question that got me in trouble with my Sunday School teachers as a kid. "But how do we know she was a virgin?" They did not appreciate questioning. And, thankfully, there was no discussion of a hymen inspection in class.

[Ian]

Dammnit! We could figure out how many parts of the body we can sin with....it would be like a game!

DC in July

[Animavore]

Mary was a slut.

This is my favorite pet theory to explain the advent of Christianity, by the way. Mary realized was pregnant, but she and Joseph had not yet gotten jiggy, so she had to make up a tall tale lest she wind up in mortal danger as an adultress. Voila - a virgin birth.

This was also a question that got me in trouble with my Sunday School teachers as a kid. "But how do we know she was a virgin?" They did not appreciate questioning. And, thankfully, there was no discussion of a hymen inspection in class.

Or, alternatively, it was made up well after the fact to fulfil an Old Testament prophecy (Isiah something). We don't see it in the earliest gospel, Mark, or in the early writings of Paul. In fact in Mark Mary doesn't seem to know who Jesus is (ie. the son of God) and at one stage she and Jesus' brothers, thinking he'd gone mad, try to take him out of public view.
It's only in Matthew and Luke he's said to be born of virgin and only Luke she's told who he is.

[Animavore]

Oops! Did can adz seriousness?

I meant she was a whore who done Roman legionaires behind Joseph's back. Right, Pantera?

[JimC]

Forgive me Father, for I have sinned. Hail Mary, Hail Mary, Hail Mary .

I can help with that, my child --

On your knees please -- If you do my penance, all will be well.

Blessed are those who come in the name of the lord...

[Seabass]

I've always wanted to get excommunicated. I wonder if I can achieve excommunication by telling my local priest I am a crazed, unrepentant masturbator?

[Kristie]

Forgive me Father, for I have sinned. Hail Mary, Hail Mary, Hail Mary .

I can help with that, my child --

On your knees please -- If you do my penance, all will be well.

Blessed are those who come in the name of the lord...

[Svartalf]

I've always wanted to get excommunicated. I wonder if I can achieve excommunication by telling my local priest I am a crazed, unrepentant masturbator?

better tell him things about doctrine, like Jesus being only a man and not divine, or the eucharist being purely symbolic.