Those who have come from Pz's blog, aka THAT thread

[rachelbean]

This is the thread you're probably looking for: http://rationalia.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=75&t=38220

And this is Pappa's apology:

To my fellow Rationalians, all Skepchicks and any people of the world who are interested.... I'm genuinely sorry for my lame attempt at humour that trivialised rape. I shall be more mindful of my words and how they can negatively affect others in future.

In particular, Gallstones, I'm sorry that my crassness caused you any hurt/anger/distress. I like you a lot and had no intention of being the source of any negativity in your life.

And these are our rules:
http://rationalia.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=3449

If you've read that and still want to discuss please do so. Please realize we're a diverse community of people and if you come in here telling us who we are, don't be surprised to be met with some opposition. That said, all are welcome who play by the very few rules.

Edited because I think some of PZ's comments need clarification:

1. Yes, Pappa is an admin (and co-founder of the site), unlike other forums that doesn't make him "the leader" or someone untouchable. He is the same as other admins and mods, and anybody who spends time here knows that our admins/mods are just members who mostly do janitorial work. Banning is extremely rare and usually very short, for the purpose of cooling off...this is not some position of great power. You can argue with him, tell him to fuck off, etc, without worrying about repercussions, and the members here do.

2. About the donations that are raised through his sig, they are NOT of a personal fund:

When the forum was founded I paid for the initial hosting. Later, when Rationalia Association was formed they became the owners of the site. The hosting has always been paid for through donations by members either via the Association's paypal account, occasionally via direct bank transfer to the Association's bank account and a couple of times in cash at a meet. All of the Association's finances are strictly in the Association's name. I have donated some money myself, but no more than about £25. I have never dipped into the finances for any reason, never borrowed or transferred any monies out of the accounts other than to pay for hosting and domains. On one occasion I accidentally bought something with the Rationalia Association paypal account because I mistakenly logged into the wrong account. It was about $38 and I paid it back the next day.

[Blind groper]

OK

I was not following that thread. I now have a little more understanding. Pappa was definitely wrong with his initial comments about rape, but he has made a gracious apology, which I think should be accepted.

[theophontes]

@ rachelbean

Those who have come from Pz's blog, aka THAT thread

I am here in my own capacity.

And this is Pappa's apology: ...

Thank you for posting that. I had not seen that before but I am most relieved that we are starting to move in the right direction.

/over and out

[SteveB]

Why is rape so taboo to joke about, but most other violence acts not?

I just think we can either make jokes about everything violent/horrible or we can't. There should be no special pleading for rape. And isn't that what feminism is truly about? Equality or what not?

[DaveDodo007]

This is the thread you're probably looking for: http://rationalia.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=75&t=38220

And this is Pappa's apology:

To my fellow Rationalians, all Skepchicks and any people of the world who are interested.... I'm genuinely sorry for my lame attempt at humour that trivialised rape. I shall be more mindful of my words and how they can negatively affect others in future.

In particular, Gallstones, I'm sorry that my crassness caused you any hurt/anger/distress. I like you a lot and had no intention of being the source of any negativity in your life.

And these are our rules:
http://rationalia.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=3449

If you've read that and still want to discuss please do so. Please realize we're a diverse community of people and if you come in here telling us who we are, don't be surprised to be met with some opposition. That said, all are welcome who play by the very few rules.

OK now please fuck off back to your cesspit, also porcupines as you seem to like them.

[rachelbean]

What I want to know is, what is the goal? Pappa is not a public figure and rationalia makes no claims to be any kind of beacon for skepticism, so why post the thread at all? Someone that nobody has any knowledge of before said something offensive somewhere on the internet so members of FTB are outraged go demand they apologize while accusing every member of the site of being rape apologists? Where does it end? I am not arguing about the quality of the post, I just don't get why the fuck it's anyone's concern outside of the forum. Are PZ's minions going to rid the world of all people on forums who say hurtful things? Not to mention the fact that there are a lot of sites with legitimately violent and sexist content that is not apologetic or meant to be humorous, so why not spend your time there? It seems like the focus has been on shaming other people in what they see as their community, and alienating a lot of good people in the process. Maybe we should invite Thunderf00t over.

[mozg]

Why is rape so taboo to joke about, but most other violence acts not?

Not only that, but it's very specifically rape of a female victim that's supposedly taboo. Look at all the jokes about prison rape that don't cause outrage. Hell, when it comes to that, people will abandon joking and start actually saying that certain criminals 'deserve' to be raped.

I just think we can either make jokes about everything violent/horrible or we can't. There should be no special pleading for rape. And isn't that what feminism is truly about? Equality or what not?

So they keep telling everyone.

[Audley Strange]

What I want to know is, what is the goal?

The eradication of masculinity even as a concept.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

What I want to know is, what is the goal?

The eradication of masculinity even as a concept.

At least by those most frightened by the concept. RATIONAL folks realize there's no need to be so extreme in anything.

[JimC]

What I want to know is, what is the goal?

The eradication of masculinity even as a concept.

But butch is still OK...

[Bella Fortuna]

What I want to know is, what is the goal?

This has been asked and ignored several times. At this point, after it's all been dissected ad nauseum, and been apologised for twice, one can only assume it's purely to torment and bully people.

[Coito ergo sum]

Why is rape so taboo to joke about, but most other violence acts not?

I just think we can either make jokes about everything violent/horrible or we can't. There should be no special pleading for rape. And isn't that what feminism is truly about? Equality or what not?

It is a very common theme in the world of humor.

Irreverent, tasteless and/or impertinent jokes are fine, as long as they're not about one's own sacred cow. It's a difficult thing to overcome, and many folks never do. Among skeptics and atheists, we see a common example in relation to religion. Religious people have no right to claim offense and have that offense respected. The hurt most of us mete out to religious people is reveled in. Hardly anyone gives a fuck.

The Skepchicks and Myers are all about ridicule and humorous mocking as a tool against certain people. However, if someone makes a joke about their sacred cow, THAT crosses the line.

[JimC]

Why is rape so taboo to joke about, but most other violence acts not?

I just think we can either make jokes about everything violent/horrible or we can't. There should be no special pleading for rape. And isn't that what feminism is truly about? Equality or what not?

It is a very common theme in the world of humor.

Irreverent, tasteless and/or impertinent jokes are fine, as long as they're not about one's own sacred cow. It's a difficult thing to overcome, and many folks never do. Among skeptics and atheists, we see a common example in relation to religion. Religious people have no right to claim offense and have that offense respected. The hurt most of us mete out to religious people is reveled in. Hardly anyone gives a fuck.

The Skepchicks and Myers are all about ridicule and humorous mocking as a tool against certain people. However, if someone makes a joke about their sacred cow, THAT crosses the line.

[Brian Peacock]

Why is rape so taboo to joke about, but most other violence acts not?

It might not be strictly taboo, but it is problematic when is taken to, or is seen to, trivialise the experience of others or somehow legitimise an act. As a subject matter for humour it is not unique in this respect.

[Coito ergo sum]

What I want to know is, what is the goal? Pappa is not a public figure and rationalia makes no claims to be any kind of beacon for skepticism, so why post the thread at all? Someone that nobody has any knowledge of before said something offensive somewhere on the internet so members of FTB are outraged go demand they apologize while accusing every member of the site of being rape apologists? Where does it end? I am not arguing about the quality of the post, I just don't get why the fuck it's anyone's concern outside of the forum. Are PZ's minions going to rid the world of all people on forums who say hurtful things? Not to mention the fact that there are a lot of sites with legitimately violent and sexist content that is not apologetic or meant to be humorous, so why not spend your time there? It seems like the focus has been on shaming other people in what they see as their community, and alienating a lot of good people in the process. Maybe we should invite Thunderf00t over.

It's just that Rationalia finally came into the Skepchick/Myers crosshairs. We've seen a host of other people get attacked by these folks. Dawkins, Klein, Krauss, Dunning, Althouse, DJ Grothe, Thunderf00t...you name it. They're whole point is to see who is saying stuff they don't like and force them to shut up.

There is a common thread to what they do -- it's always about making people think a certain way and say certain things, or refrain from saying certain things. It's not about freethinking at all. It's about badgering, finger pointing, namecalling and berating until they achieve compliance.

Why not spend more time on other sites? Because they go where pickins are easier. Those other sites you refer to would be too scary for them to get involved in. It's precisely because they KNOW that rationalia is NOT serious about what they allegate against ratiionalia that their assault is here. They attacked Brian Dunning of Skeptoid because they know he is an easy target. They know Lawrence Krauss is just a kind, normal physicist, so they had no qualms about setting him up as an example.

Same thing with Thunderf00t -- he is good guy. He didn't personally attack anyone in his arguments. He just adopted a contrary position, suggesting that the issue of sexual harassment at these conferences (by liberal, freethinking, atheists and skeptics) is blown out of proportion. Instead of tackling his arguments head on, they ban hammer him, and then they attack him personally, and sully his name.

It's what they think they're supposed to do, apparently. "We're freethinkinkers! And, if you don't think what we think, we'll run you out of town on a rail!"