kiki5711 wrote:Right, so someone's BEHAVIOR justifying the suspicion is not profiling. Exactly.
I just said that
it was profiling. What is your problem with understanding what I say?
If you think Martin was profiled then please explain what was the profile? You said you didn't think it was race. So, what was it?
You said it yourself that zimm thought he was a thief and looked like one, acting strange or something to that effect.....
Dear, THAT IS PROFILING.
No, it's suspect identification.
Your notion of "profiling" is asinine and ridiculous.
Besides, there's nothing wrong with profiling, which means to create a profile of a person for use in evaluating the required response based on observed characteristics or behavior.
Police profile every person they interact with. If you look like a crackhead junkie, they "profile" you and use the appropriate precautions and procedures for dealing with crackheads. If you look and act like a burglar, they "profile" you by observing your clothing, demeanor, movements, possessions, location, time, date, weather and a host of other characteristics or behavior that lead them to either obtain a reasonable suspicion to contact you or probable cause to arrest you.
Zimmerman did exactly that. He saw someone he believed was not a resident of the community under circumstances that raised in him a reasonable suspicion that the individual was a potential burglar casing the community. He first approached the individual to question him and when that individual ran, his suspicions were heightened by that action, which is not the action of a lawful resident or guest. So, he called 911, as he was supposed to do. Then he was attacked by the person he CORRECTLY profiled as a suspicious potential criminal and was forced to use deadly force to protect his life, just exactly as any police officer would have done.
What you're trying to imply is that the ONLY reason that Zimmerman was suspicious of Martin was that he was a black male, but the evidence does not support this interpretation. There were many other factors which Zimmerman related to the 911 dispatcher that, when combined with Martin's race, age, dress, demeanor, location and actions, gave rise to a reasonable belief that Martin did not belong there.
It may be "racial profiling" to use race as a component of profiling someone's potential criminal activities, but it's not necessarily or axiomatically wrong to do so, particularly in a place where it is unusual to see unknown teenage black males in hoodies wandering around between homes in the rain in a community where this is not a normal activity. Race in and of itself is not sufficient to establish either reasonable suspicion or probable cause for a police officer to detain or arrest someone, but it CAN BE one of several factors that, upon observation, support contacting the individual as a part of a voluntary contact where the individual is questioned but not detained in any way, which is evidently what Zimmerman did.
Although I despise and revile Tyrannical's overt racism (which is correctly defined as a belief that a person or race is either inherently better or worse than a person of a different race by virtue of race alone) and disagree utterly with his propositions, it nonetheless remains true in the United States that young black males are disproportionately involved in criminal activity, and that therefore their race, gender and age are legitimate factors in building a criminal profile WHEN COMBINED WITH OTHER ACTIONS. That race, age and gender may create heightened suspicion is, unfortunately, the fault of young black males as a demographic segment, although not necessarily as individuals. This is lamentable and unfortunate and it does create an atmosphere of distrust of young black males in society (even on the part of other blacks), but it's an understandable and not necessarily irrational distrust.
This would suggest that young black males who do not wish to have their race, gender and age affect the perceptions of others perhaps ought to go out of their way to disassociate themselves from the dress, style and activities that young black male thugs and hooligans engage in...such as wearing hoodies and wandering around in private gated communities and being belligerent towards people who attempt to determine whether they are legally authorized to be there.
When you lie down with pigs, you wake up smelling like a pig. If you don't want the police (or the neighborhood watchman) taking an interest in what you are doing, don't do things that the police (or the neighborhood watchman) find interesting. And if you find yourself being braced by someone who is suspicious of your activities and presence, for fuck's sake be polite and reasonable, don't jump them from behind and beat their head on the concrete, because you're likely to get shot that way.
"Seth is Grandmaster Zen Troll who trains his victims to troll themselves every time they think of him" Robert_S
"All that is required for the triumph of evil is that good men do nothing." Edmund Burke
"Those who support denying anyone the right to keep and bear arms for personal defense are fully complicit in every crime that might have been prevented had the victim been effectively armed." Seth
© 2013/2014/2015/2016 Seth, all rights reserved. No reuse, republication, duplication, or derivative work is authorized.
