Unarmed teen shooting: Is Florida law to blame?

[Coito ergo sum]

So, if you're a battered spouse just move to a 'stand your ground law' state like Florida...that'll take care of your problem.

I suppose that is at least as true as the statement, "So, if you're a battered spouse just move to a 'prove you tried to run away first' state...that'll take care of your problem."

[Jesus_of_Nazareth]

Zimmerman sounds a bit of a Jewish name. Probably shot the coon because he looked liked a Palestinian.

[Audley Strange]

Zimmerman sounds a bit of a Jewish name. Probably shot the coon because he looked liked a Palestinian.

Let's blame Hitler.

[Warren Dew]

Do we have enough information to draw a conclusion on his guilt, yet?

On the internet, you're always guilty until proven innocent.

[amok]

Zimmerman isn't the real problem, though, is he? Except, of course for the young man he killed.

The issue as I see it (from a foreign perspective), is more about the actions of the police department, which are still coming to light in dribs and drabs, but look really bad. Zimmerman, from the reports I've read so far, could just be a basic paranoid personality who committed a homicide.

The actions of the police department, however, are really scary. Remember, this is a department that took seven weeks to charge the son of one of its members for assault, even though he was seen on videotape sucker-punching a homeless black man on the street. This is a police department that TOLD a witness that no, no, no, you didn't hear the victim crying for help, that was the shooter. This is a police department that checked the body of the victim for drugs and alcohol, but not the shooter.

Barring further revelations, it's pretty obvious to me what happened. The police on the scene assumed the victim WAS a no-good, would-be burglar, so it was no big deal for him to be shot down in the street. What a disaster for the PD that he turned out to be an innocent, unarmed kid who was "allowed" in the neighbourhood. If it had turned out to be he was some loser kid thinking about burglarizing a house, we'd never had heard about it.

I don't even know what's worse. Unarmed innocent kid killed, or police thinking it's OK to kill a possible burglar, armed, not armed, whatever. And yes, I've been both assaulted and burgled. I still don't want to live in a world where I WOULDN'T be seriously challenged if I found myself in a situation of killing in true self-defence. I'd be angry and appalled if I wasn't, because it would mean any jerk could also kill me without a hint of challenge.

[Svartalf]

Both are problems.

A likely criminal who is not called to account for his deeds still is a problem.

a policed department that doesn't do its job is another magnitude, of course... looks like a lot of heads should fall.

[JimC]

Someone from outside the States has to say it...

You live in a society where private possession of handguns is widespread and accepted.

From that, flow consequences...

[FBM]

Zimmerman is to blame. He should've known to have another weapon to drop at the scene.

[mistermack]

You've got a country that's packed with morons, and a law that says they can carry guns, and kill people with them, so long as THEY, (the morons) feel threatened.

As you can't prove or disprove what a moron felt, (and morons' feelings are bound to be unpredictable), a moron can kill anyone anytime it feels threatened.

So technically the police were right.

If you argue that the law is not at fault, how come the PD could feel so confident in not arresting the guy? If the law was any good, that couldn't happen.

[FBM]

You can't shoot anybody just any ol' time you feel threatened and expect to get away with it. First of all, the other guy has to be black. Secondly, you have to have a gun. In some states, they even require evidence that you had reasonable cause to feel your life was in danger, but I'm not sure that new wrinkle in the law has made it to the South yet.

[maiforpeace]

What's always disturbing about a story like this is the real story that we continue to pretend doesn't exist...and that is that racism wasn't involved. It's so deeply involved, that denying it exists at all is racism to the darkest degree. Having to teach your young son how to walk carefully in the streets without being immediately viewed as suspect is so sad to me...as a parent, how would that make you feel, to have to teach your son this kind of crap?

Shame on us.

[laklak]

Of course racism was involved. The town it happened in, Sanford, has had a long history of racial tensions. Zimmerman wasn't "white", he's maybe half white and half hispanic (has a bearing later on). Sanford used to be a small, agrarian town, in an agrarian country (Seminole). Some of the first majority black towns in the state were incorporated there, because there were many black agricultural workers. As Orlando grew in the late 60s and 70s, Sanford also grew and is now pretty much a bedroom community for Orlando (as well as having the second "Orlando" airport). Sanford gobbled up many of the old black towns under some rather dodgy eminent domain claims, which pissed off many of the black residents, who felt like the rednecks were taking over. Now cue the Mexicans, who started moving in maybe 20 years ago and displaced the traditionally black agricultural workers. The Mexicans and blacks in the area have a long history of violence. So you've got a perfect storm of old, racist tensions, new economic (and racial) tensions, and a police force that really doesn't give a shit if some nigger kid stops a few stray bullets.

Zimmerman wasn't a "watch captain", there was no such position. He self-identified as such. He called 911 about 50 times in the last couple of years, and was told point-blank by the police dispatcher NOT to try to detain the kid. He did anyway, because is he is a cop wannabe who thought he was one tough dude (despite being turned down when he tried to become a cop).

It caused a bloody uproar all across Florida, it's all over the news and the public pressure on the cops has brought both the governor and FBI into it. So far from showing FLorida as some redneck Holy Land, it actually shows that even in a little, hick Southern town the cops cannot get away with this sort of shit any longer.

As far as the Stand Your Ground law goes, it has nothing, absolutely nothing to do with the situation. It does not, in any way, shape or form, legalize vigilante action (which this most assuredly is). It allows a person to protect themselves and others if a) there is a legitimate fear of death or serious bodily harm or b) to prevent the commission of a forcible felony like murder, kidnapping or rape.

[FBM]

This may be a little slanted, not sure, but it can be mined for more info: http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/0 ... 1995-2012/

[maiforpeace]

I didn't see anywhere it written that he was even investigated at any length. No drug or alcohol tests, nada. Maybe I watch too many cop shows, but doesn't a policeman get put on administrative leave (or whatever) and investigated if involved in a fatal shooting?

[Warren Dew]

I didn't see anywhere it written that he was even investigated at any length. No drug or alcohol tests, nada. Maybe I watch too many cop shows, but doesn't a policeman get put on administrative leave (or whatever) and investigated if involved in a fatal shooting?

He's not a policeman, so it's not like they can investigate whether they should fire him from a job with the police department, which is what those investigations are normally for.