75% of Americans Too Fat or Dumb to Join Army

[Thumpalumpacus]

Aside from everything else, I feel the physical benefit of avoiding processed foods (the only canned foods I buy are for my earthquake kit, and tomato sauce for Italian food). Eating fresh is pretty affordable, actually, and I can feel the difference in my energy levels throughout the day.

[Seabass]

Yup. I don't understand where this notion comes from, ...

From Science.

You appear to have responded to something you think I said, rather than what I actually said.

Do you dispute the claim that you can eat healthier and cheaper by buying groceries and preparing your own meals than you can by eating fast food?


I know there tends to be a correlation between obesity and low income, but clearly cost isn't the only factor at work here. Your article also mentions convenience, education, and taste.

[Gawd]

Aside from everything else, I feel the physical benefit of avoiding processed foods (the only canned foods I buy are for my earthquake kit, and tomato sauce for Italian food). Eating fresh is pretty affordable, actually, and I can feel the difference in my energy levels throughout the day.

There is nothing wrong with processed foods. You are on the placebo effect thinking that the stuff you eat and process are somehow inherently superior.

[Thumpalumpacus]

Aside from everything else, I feel the physical benefit of avoiding processed foods (the only canned foods I buy are for my earthquake kit, and tomato sauce for Italian food). Eating fresh is pretty affordable, actually, and I can feel the difference in my energy levels throughout the day.

There is nothing wrong with processed foods. You are on the placebo effect thinking that the stuff you eat and process are somehow inherently superior.

You'll notice I said nothing about them being "superior". What I did was report my subjective sensations about my own body.

As far as your claim about "nothing wrong with processed foods", do some research about the pathology of food additives. You might wish to start first with the nitrates and nitrites present in processed meats. Perhaps you wish to look at the salt content of, say, canned vegetables, versus their unprocessed counterparts. Yes, salt is a food-processing chemical. You'll probably want to check out the differential rates of food-borne diseases between pre-packaged ground-beef and on-site fresh-ground beef.

It's a lot of work, and I'm going to bet that you'd rather spend your time hanging out in an Internet forum acting like you know jack-shit about complete strangers, probably because that gives you a better return on the emotional investment you clearly have in behaving as if you know that which you don't.

[Gawd]

Aside from everything else, I feel the physical benefit of avoiding processed foods (the only canned foods I buy are for my earthquake kit, and tomato sauce for Italian food). Eating fresh is pretty affordable, actually, and I can feel the difference in my energy levels throughout the day.

There is nothing wrong with processed foods. You are on the placebo effect thinking that the stuff you eat and process are somehow inherently superior.

You'll notice I said nothing about them being "superior". What I did was report my subjective sensations about my own body.

As far as your claim about "nothing wrong with processed foods", do some research about the pathology of food additives. You might wish to start first with the nitrates and nitrites present in processed meats. Perhaps you wish to look at the salt content of, say, canned vegetables, versus their unprocessed counterparts. Yes, salt is a food-processing chemical. You'll probably want to check out the differential rates of food-borne diseases between pre-packaged ground-beef and on-site fresh-ground beef.

It's a lot of work, and I'm going to bet that you'd rather spend your time hanging out in an Internet forum acting like you know jack-shit about complete strangers, probably because that gives you a better return on the emotional investment you clearly have in behaving as if you know that which you don't.

Bollocks.

[PsychoSerenity]

Yup. I don't understand where this notion comes from, ...

From Science.

You appear to have responded to something you think I said, rather than what I actually said.

Do you dispute the claim that you can eat healthier and cheaper by buying groceries and preparing your own meals than you can by eating fast food?


I know there tends to be a correlation between obesity and low income, but clearly cost isn't the only factor at work here. Your article also mentions convenience, education, and taste.

I wasn't responding just to you really, but to the general attitude of personal anecdotes in the thread, about how brilliant we all are at buying cheep healthy food, with the underlying implication that all these poor obese people must be bringing it on themselves by eating too much and therefore deserve what they get (I'm not claiming you think that.). Of course cost isn't the only factor, but it is one of the factors, and importantly all of the other factors need to be dealt with too.

[Coito ergo sum]

Yup. I don't understand where this notion comes from, ...

From Science.

What proposition are you citing that article for?

[Coito ergo sum]

Yup. I don't understand where this notion comes from, ...

From Science.

You appear to have responded to something you think I said, rather than what I actually said.

Do you dispute the claim that you can eat healthier and cheaper by buying groceries and preparing your own meals than you can by eating fast food?


I know there tends to be a correlation between obesity and low income, but clearly cost isn't the only factor at work here. Your article also mentions convenience, education, and taste.

I wasn't responding just to you really, but to the general attitude of personal anecdotes in the thread, about how brilliant we all are at buying cheep healthy food, with the underlying implication that all these poor obese people must be bringing it on themselves by eating too much and therefore deserve what they get (I'm not claiming you think that.). Of course cost isn't the only factor, but it is one of the factors, and importantly all of the other factors need to be dealt with too.

No no...this isn't about bashing any particular group. The fact is obese people, rich, poor, middle class, whoever, are that way because they eat too much (most of them anyway, aside from medical issues). There really isn't another reason why people get fat. They eat more than their body needs to maintain its weight.

If you need to be touchy-feely about it, and avoid using the word "fault" or whatever, that's fine. There are, of course, social forces that cause people to eat too much. Much of it, however, is a sedentary lifestyle and an increase in the total per day calorie intake over the past 30 years. The weight gain is clearly explainable by the reduction in activity level among Americans, and the increase in calories per day.

[laklak]

We need to genetically engineer our soldiers. Make them 9 feet tall, 400 pounds, with large testicles and enormous schwanzstuckers. We can breed them up from NBA players.

[Clinton Huxley]

We need to genetically engineer our soldiers. Make them 9 feet tall, 400 pounds, with large testicles and enormous schwanzstuckers. We can breed them up from NBA players.

Something would go wrong and they would rebel against their makers. I've seen the movies.

[PsychoSerenity]

I wasn't responding just to you really, but to the general attitude of personal anecdotes in the thread, about how brilliant we all are at buying cheep healthy food, with the underlying implication that all these poor obese people must be bringing it on themselves by eating too much and therefore deserve what they get (I'm not claiming you think that.). Of course cost isn't the only factor, but it is one of the factors, and importantly all of the other factors need to be dealt with too.

No no...this isn't about bashing any particular group. The fact is obese people, rich, poor, middle class, whoever, are that way because they eat too much (most of them anyway, aside from medical issues). There really isn't another reason why people get fat. They eat more than their body needs to maintain its weight.

If you need to be touchy-feely about it, and avoid using the word "fault" or whatever, that's fine. There are, of course, social forces that cause people to eat too much. Much of it, however, is a sedentary lifestyle and an increase in the total per day calorie intake over the past 30 years. The weight gain is clearly explainable by the reduction in activity level among Americans, and the increase in calories per day.

But it is about a particular group. Not about bashing it, but recognizing that there is a problem and dealing with it. None of what you've said there deals with the fact that there is a correlation between low income and obesity (and many other health issues too). This is a social problem that needs to be tackled by society as a whole with a deep understanding of all the contributing factors. You can't expect individuals to deal with it on their own, because if they could do that, it wouldn't be a problem in the first place. You certainly can't expect business to deal with it, because let's face it, there's not much money to be made in helping the poor. There's no point in saying "people are obese because they eat too much" because everyone fucking knows that already. It doesn't solve the problem.

[Coito ergo sum]

I wasn't responding just to you really, but to the general attitude of personal anecdotes in the thread, about how brilliant we all are at buying cheep healthy food, with the underlying implication that all these poor obese people must be bringing it on themselves by eating too much and therefore deserve what they get (I'm not claiming you think that.). Of course cost isn't the only factor, but it is one of the factors, and importantly all of the other factors need to be dealt with too.

No no...this isn't about bashing any particular group. The fact is obese people, rich, poor, middle class, whoever, are that way because they eat too much (most of them anyway, aside from medical issues). There really isn't another reason why people get fat. They eat more than their body needs to maintain its weight.

If you need to be touchy-feely about it, and avoid using the word "fault" or whatever, that's fine. There are, of course, social forces that cause people to eat too much. Much of it, however, is a sedentary lifestyle and an increase in the total per day calorie intake over the past 30 years. The weight gain is clearly explainable by the reduction in activity level among Americans, and the increase in calories per day.

But it is about a particular group. Not about bashing it, but recognizing that there is a problem and dealing with it. None of what you've said there deals with the fact that there is a correlation between low income and obesity (and many other health issues too). This is a social problem that needs to be tackled by society as a whole with a deep understanding of all the contributing factors. You can't expect individuals to deal with it on their own, because if they could do that, it wouldn't be a problem in the first place. You certainly can't expect business to deal with it, because let's face it, there's not much money to be made in helping the poor. There's no point in saying "people are obese because they eat too much" because everyone fucking knows that already. It doesn't solve the problem.

Correlation is not causation, as we all know.

I can certainly agree with a societal solution. However, masking the real problem by saying it's not about eating too much food is simply ignoring the real problem. How we get people to eat less is something I'm wide open to. Eat less, exercise more. How do you propose we do that?

YOU'VE not proposed any solution either.

But, the first step in solving a problem is CORRECTLY IDENTIFYING THE PROBLEM. I've identified the problem. My solution would be to increase primary school and adult education in the area of nutrition, diet and exercise. Rather than eliminate physical education from primary school, I would recommed increasing it. I would suggest providing resources at hospitals so that new parents can have information on the proper feeding of children, and the proper amount of exercise, and how to exercise, so that they can take steps to monitor their children's obesity. I would strictly control the kinds of foods served by public school cafeterias, and fund better food service there.

Beyond that, I'm not sure, but I'm open to suggestions. I don't like authoritarian measures, that has the government setting dietary requirements and what people can and can't order in restaurants. I think we have a right to do what we please with our own bodies, and I know I'm going to barbecue the hell out of this weekend -- I'm going to eat steak, sausage, and chicken on the grill, in large quantities, along with potato chips (not the crappy baked variety either), and I'm going to smoke cigars and eat nacho dip and tortilla chips. Lots of beer too.

I'm overweight, technically speaking - I'm 6' 2" and I could stand to lose some weight. What would you have society do to me to make me lose weight?

EDIT: And, if "everybody fucking knows that already" -- why do half the posters on this board deny it in every thread about weight?

[Eddie]

We can breed them up from NBA players.

Sending the black people to do the dirty work, eh?

[Woodbutcher]

Obesity is caused by an overactive gland....usually the mouth.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

I'm not overweight, I'm underheight.