Global war on drugs 'has failed'

[JimC]

I have disagreed very strongly with Ian, and found him to be respectful and thoughtful. You, on the other hand, are such a hater I would like to ask you a question (just to help illustrate how bigoted, hateful and ignorant you are)
What are the best things about the USA?

Ian has been wrong a lot, maybe even more often than you (because you only have ONE subject) but he can learn. I have every confidence that reason could win over Ian. Also, I have every confidence that bigotry and hatred of his group, OR yours, would not win him over.

Can you offer some positive comments about the USA? Or are you just a broken record?

Very sensible comments, IMO. I too disagree with Ian from time to time (maybe somewhat less than Cunt), but he is amenable to reasoned debate. Sandinista is attacking Ian as if he was a mindless, "my country right or wrong" patriot, which is a very long way from the truth indeed.

[Geoff]

What are the best things about the USA?

It's a long way away

Both he and Sandy are speaking from Canada, so that doesn't really help...

Canada? Never heard of it - is it new?

Used to be ours, we gave it to the French a while ago, when we found out it was empty...

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Canada is where we keep the snowbirds in the summer.

[sandinista]

I have disagreed very strongly with Ian, and found him to be respectful and thoughtful. You, on the other hand, are such a hater I would like to ask you a question (just to help illustrate how bigoted, hateful and ignorant you are)
What are the best things about the USA?

Ian has been wrong a lot, maybe even more often than you (because you only have ONE subject) but he can learn. I have every confidence that reason could win over Ian. Also, I have every confidence that bigotry and hatred of his group, OR yours, would not win him over.

Can you offer some positive comments about the USA? Or are you just a broken record?

yah...a "hater" Funny you say that as I have seen hate spewed at everything and everyone from the middle east, to christians, to muslims, to socialist countries, to "rednecks" to jews and on and on and fucking on. Why would I want to offer positive comments towards the US? Why? To appease the americans on this forum, good luck with that...fuck it. When everyone on this board starts to give positive sides to everything they are gripping about then maybe I'll join in, till then forget it. Not you in particular because to be honest, I don't even know a thing about your online persona or whathaveyou, but for anyone, lets list the best things about religious fundamentalists, the best things about Saudi Arabia, about "terrorists", about the catholic church, about North Korea, about Cuba or Venezuela, or the Congo or Pakistan, or Iran or nazi skins.

[sandinista]

What are the best things about the USA?

That's hardly fair. Sandy doesn't know a thing about the USA, so you should ask him questions like that.

coming from someone who knows nothing about anything at all.

[Arse]

Sandinista, your obsession with America is as boring as Gawd's obsession with the Joos.

So, what do people think should be done about the drugs then?

[Ian]

I have disagreed very strongly with Ian, and found him to be respectful and thoughtful. You, on the other hand, are such a hater I would like to ask you a question (just to help illustrate how bigoted, hateful and ignorant you are)
What are the best things about the USA?

Ian has been wrong a lot, maybe even more often than you (because you only have ONE subject) but he can learn. I have every confidence that reason could win over Ian. Also, I have every confidence that bigotry and hatred of his group, OR yours, would not win him over.

Can you offer some positive comments about the USA? Or are you just a broken record?

yah...a "hater" Funny you say that as I have seen hate spewed at everything and everyone from the middle east, to christians, to muslims, to socialist countries, to "rednecks" to jews and on and on and fucking on. Why would I want to offer positive comments towards the US? Why? To appease the americans on this forum, good luck with that...fuck it. When everyone on this board starts to give positive sides to everything they are gripping about then maybe I'll join in, till then forget it. Not you in particular because to be honest, I don't even know a thing about your online persona or whathaveyou, but for anyone, lets list the best things about religious fundamentalists, the best things about Saudi Arabia, about "terrorists", about the catholic church, about North Korea, about Cuba or Venezuela, or the Congo or Pakistan, or Iran or nazi skins.

Sandi, the reason you're called a hater is because of your routine use of blanket statements of derision against entire societies, even if the facts you're using to back them up are cherry-picked and/or what you're saying does not apply to many or even most people in that society. As a single example, yesterday you said this sort of thing by you is perfectly justified and you trotted out the fact that 40% of Americans are polled as being creationists as your proof that "Americans have a warped view of sex". 40% of something... and you go on about "Americans this" or "Americans that" with some other bit of data. Guess what: in an election, 40% is a landslide loss. (And what creationism has to do with attitudes towards sex, I really don't know). In my book, you don't get to attribute your hate and mockery to the other 60% as well without someone calling you on it.

Again, the analogy of blacks works. I could point out the fact that herpes simplex A is three times more common in blacks than whites as proof that African-Americans are more likely to sleep around and practice unsafe sex and are a corrupt culture. Sure, a million points can be brought up for discussion to explain this, but if I'm challenged I've got my statistical fact, and I'll use it to justify my bias against all of black society. And if the person challenging me happens to be black... well, obviously this person is just a racist who's being defensive at the idea that his race isn't the best. Captain Darkie can't take criticism of Niggaland. Sandi - that's exactly what you do towards me and the three hundred million of us south of the border. Yes, you're engaged in internet hate speech. You.

Your diatribe above, that lots of forum members spew hate at lots of things just like you do, is not accurate either. Maybe it happens, but I for one don't ascribe entire judgements to entire societies. I don't care much for the Saudi government, but when when was the last time you heard me spew hatred towards the people of the country? I have quite a bit of expertise on North Korea, but the North Korean people get sympathy from me. Unlike Gawd, I draw a distinct line between criticizing Israel's government and criticizing every Jew in the world. I see plenty of reasons to dislike Iran's government, but I guarantee I've never said anything bad about "the Iranians", passing harsh judgment to the society as a whole. I'm quite certain of this one - my cousin is married to an Iranian man. I give a bit of a pass to anger and even hyperbole directed at capitalism or socialism or Islamism or voodooism or whatever... those are belief systems. I don't attack Iranianism. There is no such thing. And damn if even I can't figure out what Americanism is, if there even is such a thing. I don't think there is. If you have some idea of what it means, then that's your definition, based on your understanding of the country to your south.

So you've got a couple American friends and you're aware that there are plenty of good things about this country? Well then don't go on bitching about "the Americans are such and such" every time you find some bit of news which reinforces your own biases and prejudices. Try making a distinction between a policy and a society, or between one segment of a culture and another. When you do that, I'm fine with it. Criticize Uncle Sam in Washington all you like; I share several of your criticisms. But what set this drama off was your typical, nonchalant comment that "Americans are scared of sex", which you justified by pointing out the blurred-out buttcracks on Survivor.

I would accept as an axiom that there's no such thing as seeing a country go down in flames (which you've said you'd like to see about the US) without also seeing its people suffer. Maybe that's okay with you. But every time you rail against "the Americans", perhaps you're thinking of some select statesmen or businessmen or policies or whatever, but when I hear hateful comments about "the Americans are this and that", I think of my little kids, my friends, my parents, half the people on this forum, etc. So make some goddamned distinctions about just who you're writing about when you want to write something hateful.

[Cunt]

Can you offer some positive comments about the USA? Or are you just a broken record?

yah...a "hater" Funny you say that as I have seen hate spewed at everything and everyone from the middle east, to christians, to muslims, to socialist countries, to "rednecks" to jews and on and on and fucking on. Why would I want to offer positive comments towards the US? Why? To appease the americans on this forum, good luck with that...fuck it. When everyone on this board starts to give positive sides to everything they are gripping about then maybe I'll join in, till then forget it. Not you in particular because to be honest, I don't even know a thing about your online persona or whathaveyou, but for anyone, lets list the best things about religious fundamentalists, the best things about Saudi Arabia, about "terrorists", about the catholic church, about North Korea, about Cuba or Venezuela, or the Congo or Pakistan, or Iran or nazi skins.

Thanks for helping me make that point, sandinista. That was considerate of you and shows your thoughtfulness.

Tell me, all those countries and groups are clearly NOT good enough for you. Who exactly IS good enough? Which country should we be more like? You like to tear stuff down, and so do I, but what do you stand behind?

And can you only see in black and white? Or are there shades of gray?

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Can you offer some positive comments about the USA? Or are you just a broken record?

yah...a "hater" Funny you say that as I have seen hate spewed at everything and everyone from the middle east, to christians, to muslims, to socialist countries, to "rednecks" to jews and on and on and fucking on. Why would I want to offer positive comments towards the US? Why? To appease the americans on this forum, good luck with that...fuck it. When everyone on this board starts to give positive sides to everything they are gripping about then maybe I'll join in, till then forget it. Not you in particular because to be honest, I don't even know a thing about your online persona or whathaveyou, but for anyone, lets list the best things about religious fundamentalists, the best things about Saudi Arabia, about "terrorists", about the catholic church, about North Korea, about Cuba or Venezuela, or the Congo or Pakistan, or Iran or nazi skins.

Thanks for helping me make that point, sandinista. That was considerate of you and shows your thoughtfulness.

Tell me, all those countries and groups are clearly NOT good enough for you. Who exactly IS good enough? Which country should we be more like? You like to tear stuff down, and so do I, but what do you stand behind?

And can you only see in black and white? Or are there shades of gray?

Shades of gay?

[sandinista]

Yes, you're engaged in internet hate speech. You.

That's such bullshit. Hatespeech because I said...what? That americans have a warped view on sexuality? That's hate speech, yah OK. Not at all. Ludicrous. Comparing that to racist speech is also ridiculous.

I share several of your criticisms. But what set this drama off was your typical, nonchalant comment that "Americans are scared of sex", which you justified by pointing out the blurred-out buttcracks on Survivor.

So...why does survivor blur butt cracks? That seems like some sort of weird fear of sexuality to me. It's an american show on an american network. So, why? I know before you said something along the lines of "what about the children!!". I would wonder why copious amounts of violence on network tv is just fine but an ass crack needs to be blurred. I would also guess you hate bill Maher and think he's a bigot for constantly saying "americans are fucking stupid" or "this country is full of fucking stupid people". Maybe you should email him with one of you diatribes.

I would accept as an axiom that there's no such thing as seeing a country go down in flames (which you've said you'd like to see about the US) without also seeing its people suffer. Maybe that's okay with you. But every time you rail against "the Americans", perhaps you're thinking of some select statesmen or businessmen or policies or whatever, but when I hear hateful comments about "the Americans are this and that", I think of my little kids, my friends, my parents, half the people on this forum, etc. So make some goddamned distinctions about just who you're writing about when you want to write something hateful.

I actually don't think that was me that said that. I may have agreed in principle, but not my quote. What bothers me more than any of that is when the US ACTS to make countries "go down in flames" whereby thousands of people (just like you) with friends, parents and kids are bombed into mush. What also bothers me much more is that people praise these actions, on this board and elsewhere. You get your panties in a know about some guy on the internet saying "americans are scared of sex", I concern myself over real actions, real people, and real world politics. Every time your country drops bombs on people, occupies their countries, tortures citizens, arrest people with no trail etc, those people are real as well, remember that if it bothers you so much to hear people hoping for the downfall of the US.

Sandinista, your obsession with America is as boring as Gawd's obsession with the Joos.

So, what do people think should be done about the drugs then?

Not obsessed, just what I happen to enjoy posting about here. If it bores you, block my posts or simply don't read them.

On topic, drugs...I think that marijuana should be legalized completely and sold like alcohol and tobacco. I think all other drugs should be de criminalized completely and addicts and users should be dealt with as medical issues, not criminal ones.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Sandy, you're at least as bad as you claim we are, but you're far worse really, because you have no balance. You're a two-legged cow, two left legs. You can be counted on to yap at America's heels like a starving cur hoping we'll fall over dead and you'll have some bones to pick over. You'd be miserable if we did collapse, however, because you would have to find a new target for your bitterness.

[Arse]

Not obsessed, just what I happen to enjoy posting about here. If it bores you, block my posts or simply don't read them.

Its not that simple. A whole load of people respond to you, you respond back and so on, until every thread is hijacked into the topic of "America, is it shit or is it great?" It gets irksome for those of us who were interested in the original thread topic.

On topic, drugs...I think that marijuana should be legalized completely and sold like alcohol and tobacco. I think all other drugs should be de criminalized completely and addicts and users should be dealt with as medical issues, not criminal ones.

I agree.

[sandinista]

Not obsessed, just what I happen to enjoy posting about here. If it bores you, block my posts or simply don't read them.

Its not that simple. A whole load of people respond to you, you respond back and so on, until every thread is hijacked into the topic of "America, is it shit or is it great?" It gets irksome for those of us who were interested in the original thread topic.

On topic, drugs...I think that marijuana should be legalized completely and sold like alcohol and tobacco. I think all other drugs should be de criminalized completely and addicts and users should be dealt with as medical issues, not criminal ones.

I agree.

it is that simple, for anyone not interested in my posts, don't read them. Simple. As for the original thread topic, to NOT speak of america when discussing the "war" on drugs would be disingenuous.

[Ronja]

Gawdzilla and sandinista: you have both been reminded of our rules (see http://www.rationalia.com/forum/viewtop ... 41#p874280) less than 24 hours ago. Since then, you have made posts such as these http://www.rationalia.com/forum/viewtop ... 41#p874401 and http://www.rationalia.com/forum/viewtop ... 80#p874570, which contain more personal attacks. If you do not stop this kind of posting, you will get a cooling off period.

[Coito ergo sum]

Canada? Never heard of it - is it new?

Used to be ours, we gave it to the French a while ago, when we found out it was empty...

It's America's hat.