Atheists and Religious Folks Are Similar in Their Non-belief

[DRSB]

"Let us assume that there are 1,000 distinct Gods (this undoubtedly underestimates the actual number). To repeat an insight that I believe was first enunciated by Richard Dawkins, all religious folks are atheists when it comes to the other 999 Gods (i.e., other than the God to which they pray). Hence, the extent of "unbelief" between an atheist and a fervently religious person is actually quite small...they are in agreement about their mutual disbelief of 999 Gods and they simply disagree about that one remaining God."

Full article here: http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/hom ... eir-non-be

[Feck]

Think of an apostate Hindu ,they have to give up a lot more gods .

[Loki]

I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours.

It's been said in various ways by various people, and Dawkins almost definitely was not the first.

The fact remains though that the religious are somehow innoculated against this rather obvious truth.

[charlou]

I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours.

It's been said in various ways by various people, and Dawkins almost definitely was not the first.

The fact remains though that the religious are somehow innoculated against this rather obvious truth.

In Judaeo-Christianity, the first two of the ten commandments are imparted in two books of the biblical scriptures thus ...

Exodus 20:2-6

2 I am the Lord your God, who brought you up out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of slavery;

3 Do not have any other gods before me.

4 You shall not make for yourself an idol, whether in the form of anything that is in heaven above, or that is on the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.

5 You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I the Lord your God am a jealous God, punishing children for the iniquity of parents, to the third and the fourth generation of those who reject me,

6 but showing steadfast love to the thousandth generation of those who love me and keep my commandments.


Deuteronomy 5:6–10

6 I am the Lord your God, who brought you up out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of slavery;

7 you shall have no other gods before me.

8 You shall not make for yourself an idol, whether in the form of anything that is in heaven above, or that is on the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.

9 You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I the Lord your God am a jealous God, punishing children for the iniquity of parents, to the third and fourth generation of those who reject me,

10 but showing steadfast love to the thousandth generation of those who love me and keep my commandments.

[DRSB]

Pretty darn unlikable this chap of a god!

[Santa_Claus]

I think the Christian get out is that these other Gods were / are really the Christian God and that the beleivers just haven't heard of Jesus to fine tune their religions.

or summit.

But whatever, all Woo to me.

[charlou]

I think the Christian get out is that these other Gods were / are really the Christian God and that the beleivers just haven't heard of Jesus to fine tune their religions.

Yep, that's another one I grew up with.

[tattuchu]

Yes, God is god. The other religions just have His name wrong. His name is actually...God

[hiyymer]

"Let us assume that there are 1,000 distinct Gods (this undoubtedly underestimates the actual number). To repeat an insight that I believe was first enunciated by Richard Dawkins, all religious folks are atheists when it comes to the other 999 Gods (i.e., other than the God to which they pray). Hence, the extent of "unbelief" between an atheist and a fervently religious person is actually quite small...they are in agreement about their mutual disbelief of 999 Gods and they simply disagree about that one remaining God."

Full article here: http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/hom ... eir-non-be

Gods are necessary because life inside our heads is irrational. If life inside our heads were rational and scientific, then life inside our heads would be meaningless. Rationalism is just a habit of thinking where everything is scientific and happens for a logical reason except us; us being that experience of self in control that our brain creates. As Hawking/Mlodinow state it in the "The Grand Design":

"Recent experiments in neuroscience support the view that it is our physical brain, following the known laws of science, that determines our actions, and not some agency that exists outside those laws."

There is no actual uncaused cause, free will, intentional self. That model is created by your brain for its own purposes. What is happening is in physical reality and is following the known laws of science. We have deconstructed what really exists and it is both rational and meaningless (deterministic and amoral). As the religionist rightfully points out, an atheist's god is their self. An atheist is their own god. There is nothing right or wrong about that. But it is not rational or scientific. It is a leap of faith. Life inside our heads is irrational. That's where the meaning comes from. As a rationalist, I have a god, and I deny everyone else's god. By any stretch of reason my god does not exist as the responsible intentional free-willed agent that I experience; just as other people experience their gods, and do so partly as an acceptance of the true nature of self. What we do with our gods is another matter.

[DRSB]

So god must be the quintessential atheist then, if I get your logic correctly?

[Atheist-Lite]

It's just stuff happening. The model of reality we percieve in our everyday lives is low grain compared with the fine grained context of countless chemicals & physcial processes interacting with one another. Being low grain it is understandable that some will cling onto low accuracy or counter-factual explanations for their existance. Every day we see strings of events and sequences often with no script except the one we give. It is woo to say anything is meaningful although some explanations serve a purpose and perhaps the purpose of religion is to provide a social tent which is stable over time and recalled because of its absurdity? set against the banal nature of the every day?

[BrettA]

I'd say that it's not about the closeness of 999 v. 1000... 0 and 1 are worlds apart.

It's whether you want special privileges and wish to impose your beliefs (or lack) on others through changing society.

I'd say too amny of the religious try to change the definition of science, to change our school systems and its teaching, to interfere with the political process, to promote that atheists shouldn't be allowed to celebrate the CIVIC holiday of Christmas/Xmas/Mythmas/whatever, to NOT pay their fair way in society due to tax privileges (leeches, all - making atheists pay for them!), killing doctors and hassling women who need medical treatment because of religion's whacked-out concept of a (lol) 'soul', similarly trying to stop stem cell research, lying that condoms won't help fight AIDS, indoctrinating innocent kids w/o their knowledge... and on and on and on and on.

I humbly suggest that atheists do almost none of that and most don't spend much time re atheism, while a vastly higher percentage of the religioud do spend time and resources on their religion.

[Hermit]

I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours.

It's been said in various ways by various people, and Dawkins almost definitely was not the first.

The fact remains though that the religious are somehow innoculated against this rather obvious truth.

In Judaeo-Christianity, the first two of the ten commandments are imparted in two books of the biblical scriptures thus ...

Exodus 20:2-6

2 I am the Lord your God, who brought you up out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of slavery;

3 Do not have any other gods before me.

4 You shall not make for yourself an idol, whether in the form of anything that is in heaven above, or that is on the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.

5 You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I the Lord your God am a jealous God, punishing children for the iniquity of parents, to the third and the fourth generation of those who reject me,

6 but showing steadfast love to the thousandth generation of those who love me and keep my commandments.


Deuteronomy 5:6–10

6 I am the Lord your God, who brought you up out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of slavery;

7 you shall have no other gods before me.

8 You shall not make for yourself an idol, whether in the form of anything that is in heaven above, or that is on the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth.

9 You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I the Lord your God am a jealous God, punishing children for the iniquity of parents, to the third and fourth generation of those who reject me,

10 but showing steadfast love to the thousandth generation of those who love me and keep my commandments.

Has anyone noticed that the command "you shall have no other gods before me" does not even imply that no other gods exist?

[wheels5894]

Has anyone noticed that the command "you shall have no other gods before me" does not even imply that no other gods exist?

Quite. There were obviously quite a few gods around at the time and mu8ch of this stuff was possibly written in Babylon or after the return so will be been imbued with the Babylonian pantheon (YHWH is a lesser member of then pantheon) I'd say that the way this is put is very much the work of men and not god. Although there could be arguments to the contrary, god would know that Baal and so existed or did not exist and could, therefore, have had a better expression of him being the only one. It smells of men hedging their bets to me.

[Chuck Jones]

Atheism is a belief system, hence the similarity. The reason why atheists don't like admitting that atheism is a belief system is the same same reason why they try to make out that theists have the burden of proof whereas they don't. It's because atheists are desperate to remove anything which puts them in the same boat as theists. They want to put the whole burden of proof onto theists, and they want to put the label of "belief" entirely with theists. Atheists are fucking cheats. No wonder society regards them as oddities. Atheists should be put in zoos. It's like the old saying goes, no one likes an atheist.