Brit NHS "Free Healthcare for All" lie.

[mistermack]

Because I am unemployed until September, and receiving benefits, I was able to go and get a free eye-test today. I will be picking up two free pairs of glasses next week: one for distance, one for reading.

It is terrible to be so exploited by communists all the time in this country!

Er, they aren't free dude. Somebody has to pay for them. Why shouldn't YOU pay for them?

It's called national insurance.
Remember insurance? That thing you can't afford ?

[Xamonas Chegwé]

Because I am unemployed until September, and receiving benefits, I was able to go and get a free eye-test today. I will be picking up two free pairs of glasses next week: one for distance, one for reading.

It is terrible to be so exploited by communists all the time in this country!

Er, they aren't free dude. Somebody has to pay for them. Why shouldn't YOU pay for them?

I did. I paid National Insurance contributions from every wage-packet I ever earned. I pay what I can - I get what I need. It's nothing like perfect but it's better than having to choose between keeping your house and paying for cancer meds.

[Seth]

Because I am unemployed until September, and receiving benefits, I was able to go and get a free eye-test today. I will be picking up two free pairs of glasses next week: one for distance, one for reading.

It is terrible to be so exploited by communists all the time in this country!

Er, they aren't free dude. Somebody has to pay for them. Why shouldn't YOU pay for them?

It's called national insurance.
Remember insurance? That thing you can't afford ?

TANSTAAFL! Do you understand the concept of "insurance?" I don't think so. One of the fundamental concepts of "insurance" is that nothing is free and somebody has to pay for a claim made against an insured peril. One of the other classic concepts of "insurance" is that one VOLUNTARILY pays into a specified risk pool in hopes of getting more out of the pool than one has to pay into it in the long run. A third classic concept is that the insurer always receives more in premiums than it dispenses in claims, because if it doesn't, it goes bankrupt, and that concept applies to "national" insurance just as certainly as it does every other kind of insurance.

But the fundamental question with "national insurance," which is not voluntary but is instead compulsory is, "Why should anybody but you be FORCED to pay for your medical care?"

A disturbing corollary to that is that if you force me to pay for your medical care, I demand the right to control your lifestyle so as to reduce the risk of having to pay a claim for some illness or injury that might be avoided if you are prohibited from engaging in certain "risky" activities...like driving, smoking, drinking, eating, walking, running, climbing, skiing, boating, golfing, etc.. Since I am forced to pay for your medical needs occasioned by such activities, it's only reasonable that I be allowed to minimize my exposure in the risk pool by controlling your life.

I don't know about you, but I refuse to give anyone such control of my life, so I don't contribute to systems that force others to pay for my health care needs.

It's called "personal liberty." Try it sometime.

[Seth]

Because I am unemployed until September, and receiving benefits, I was able to go and get a free eye-test today. I will be picking up two free pairs of glasses next week: one for distance, one for reading.

It is terrible to be so exploited by communists all the time in this country!

Er, they aren't free dude. Somebody has to pay for them. Why shouldn't YOU pay for them?

I did. I paid National Insurance contributions from every wage-packet I ever earned. I pay what I can - I get what I need. It's nothing like perfect but it's better than having to choose between keeping your house and paying for cancer meds.

Of course it is...for you. But is it better for those who are forced to pay for your "needs" when the costs are greater than your contributions? I don't happen to think so...because I am not a greedy thief willing to steal from others to fund my personal needs.

[Xamonas Chegwé]

Because I am unemployed until September, and receiving benefits, I was able to go and get a free eye-test today. I will be picking up two free pairs of glasses next week: one for distance, one for reading.

It is terrible to be so exploited by communists all the time in this country!

Er, they aren't free dude. Somebody has to pay for them. Why shouldn't YOU pay for them?

It's called national insurance.
Remember insurance? That thing you can't afford ?

TANSTAAFL! Do you understand the concept of "insurance?" I don't think so. One of the fundamental concepts of "insurance" is that nothing is free and somebody has to pay for a claim made against an insured peril. One of the other classic concepts of "insurance" is that one VOLUNTARILY pays into a specified risk pool in hopes of getting more out of the pool than one has to pay into it in the long run. A third classic concept is that the insurer always receives more in premiums than it dispenses in claims, because if it doesn't, it goes bankrupt, and that concept applies to "national" insurance just as certainly as it does every other kind of insurance.

But the fundamental question with "national insurance," which is not voluntary but is instead compulsory is, "Why should anybody but you be FORCED to pay for your medical care?"

A disturbing corollary to that is that if you force me to pay for your medical care, I demand the right to control your lifestyle so as to reduce the risk of having to pay a claim for some illness or injury that might be avoided if you are prohibited from engaging in certain "risky" activities...like driving, smoking, drinking, eating, walking, running, climbing, skiing, boating, golfing, etc.. Since I am forced to pay for your medical needs occasioned by such activities, it's only reasonable that I be allowed to minimize my exposure in the risk pool by controlling your life.

I don't know about you, but I refuse to give anyone such control of my life, so I don't contribute to systems that force others to pay for my health care needs.

It's called "personal liberty." Try it sometime.

You are free to have your health care cost you A SHITLOAD more than mine costs me - despite the fact that I am forced to pay without giving persimmon. Yay freedum!

[Xamonas Chegwé]

Because I am unemployed until September, and receiving benefits, I was able to go and get a free eye-test today. I will be picking up two free pairs of glasses next week: one for distance, one for reading.

It is terrible to be so exploited by communists all the time in this country!

Er, they aren't free dude. Somebody has to pay for them. Why shouldn't YOU pay for them?

I did. I paid National Insurance contributions from every wage-packet I ever earned. I pay what I can - I get what I need. It's nothing like perfect but it's better than having to choose between keeping your house and paying for cancer meds.

Of course it is...for you. But is it better for those who are forced to pay for your "needs" when the costs are greater than your contributions? I don't happen to think so...because I am not a greedy thief willing to steal from others to fund my personal needs.

Of course not. In Merka, you leave that sort of thing to health insurance companies and consultants. But, hey, they need to pay for that Pebble Beach membership somehow, right?

[Seth]

You are free to have your health care cost you A SHITLOAD more than mine costs me - despite the fact that I am forced to pay without giving persimmon. Yay freedum!

Persimmons have little to do with it, and yes, that's what I'm free to do...well, except not any more. What you are NOT free to do is force OTHER PEOPLE to pay for your needs without their permission. That's despotic tyranny, armed robbery and nothing else.

[Seth]

Because I am unemployed until September, and receiving benefits, I was able to go and get a free eye-test today. I will be picking up two free pairs of glasses next week: one for distance, one for reading.

It is terrible to be so exploited by communists all the time in this country!

Er, they aren't free dude. Somebody has to pay for them. Why shouldn't YOU pay for them?

I did. I paid National Insurance contributions from every wage-packet I ever earned. I pay what I can - I get what I need. It's nothing like perfect but it's better than having to choose between keeping your house and paying for cancer meds.

Of course it is...for you. But is it better for those who are forced to pay for your "needs" when the costs are greater than your contributions? I don't happen to think so...because I am not a greedy thief willing to steal from others to fund my personal needs.

Of course not. In Merka, you leave that sort of thing to health insurance companies and consultants. But, hey, they need to pay for that Pebble Beach membership somehow, right?

And I'm free not to do business with them if I don't want to...or at least I used to be free. Now I'm compelled to buy insurance from such people by law, which, by the way, I refuse to obey. Eventually they will send out jackbooted thugs with machine guns to try to force me to comply. They will not succeed.

[Xamonas Chegwé]

And I'm free not to do business with them if I don't want to...or at least I used to be free. Now I'm compelled to buy insurance from such people by law, which, by the way, I refuse to obey. Eventually they will send out jackbooted thugs with machine guns to try to force me to comply. They will not succeed.

I hope there will be Youtube of this.

[Seth]

And I'm free not to do business with them if I don't want to...or at least I used to be free. Now I'm compelled to buy insurance from such people by law, which, by the way, I refuse to obey. Eventually they will send out jackbooted thugs with machine guns to try to force me to comply. They will not succeed.

I hope there will be Youtube of this.

I'll try to have my GoPro up and running, but no guarantees it'll make it out of police custody.

[pErvinalia]

Because I am unemployed until September, and receiving benefits, I was able to go and get a free eye-test today. I will be picking up two free pairs of glasses next week: one for distance, one for reading.

It is terrible to be so exploited by communists all the time in this country!

Really? I thought you only got a contribution, not free glasses. I wouldn't mind a free pair.
I get free eye checks because I have raised pressures in the eyes, a form of glaucoma that hasn't yet damaged the optic nerve, but could in the future.
I also get more accurate tests twice a year at the eye department in the local hospital, and will get an operation if the eye-drops stop effectively controlling the condition.

I can't imagine having to think, or worry about the cost, or to have to weigh up the risk against the cost, in my head, without fully understanding it all.

People in this country without pet insurance have to weigh up how much they love their pets, against the cost of veterinary treatment. That's a shitty place to be, but it pales into insignificance, when it's a person who needs treatment.

I wouldn't like it for me, and I wouldn't like it for anyone else, and I do feel sorry for Seth for being in that position. In spite of his sad bluster claiming it's all his own decision.

It's not. The options that he has available to him are out of his control. He decides not to buy health insurance, because US health insurance is such a shit option. An he's actually right about that.

I pay quite a lot to see my eye specialists for tests twice a year. We are clearly not quite as Marxist as you Brits...

Eye tests are usually free under medicare. You should check. You might be paying when you don't have to.

[pErvinalia]

And I'm free not to do business with them if I don't want to...or at least I used to be free. Now I'm compelled to buy insurance from such people by law, which, by the way, I refuse to obey. Eventually they will send out jackbooted thugs with machine guns to try to force me to comply. They will not succeed.

I hope there will be Youtube of this.

I'll try to have my GoPro up and running, but no guarantees it'll make it out of police custody.

Set up live streaming so it goes out to the internet as it happens.

[JimC]

Because I am unemployed until September, and receiving benefits, I was able to go and get a free eye-test today. I will be picking up two free pairs of glasses next week: one for distance, one for reading.

It is terrible to be so exploited by communists all the time in this country!

Really? I thought you only got a contribution, not free glasses. I wouldn't mind a free pair.
I get free eye checks because I have raised pressures in the eyes, a form of glaucoma that hasn't yet damaged the optic nerve, but could in the future.
I also get more accurate tests twice a year at the eye department in the local hospital, and will get an operation if the eye-drops stop effectively controlling the condition.

I can't imagine having to think, or worry about the cost, or to have to weigh up the risk against the cost, in my head, without fully understanding it all.

People in this country without pet insurance have to weigh up how much they love their pets, against the cost of veterinary treatment. That's a shitty place to be, but it pales into insignificance, when it's a person who needs treatment.

I wouldn't like it for me, and I wouldn't like it for anyone else, and I do feel sorry for Seth for being in that position. In spite of his sad bluster claiming it's all his own decision.

It's not. The options that he has available to him are out of his control. He decides not to buy health insurance, because US health insurance is such a shit option. An he's actually right about that.

I pay quite a lot to see my eye specialists for tests twice a year. We are clearly not quite as Marxist as you Brits...

Eye tests are usually free under medicare. You should check. You might be paying when you don't have to.

Eye tests for new specs at an optometrist are usually bulk billed (and I've had a few over the years), but the tests I have are more complicated, and from a private eye specialist. I do get around 40% of that back as a Medicare rebate, and the rest may accrue some tax relief. So far, it's not impacting on the gin budget...

[mistermack]

Yes, national insurance is compulsory. I thought that that was so obvious, even idiots wouldn't need it stating.
Motor insurance is compulsory in the US if you drive.
How awful. Do they send round jackbooted thugs for the premiums? You poor dears.

In Britain, public liability insurance is compulsory for businesses that might have a liability to the public.
It's a good thing. If people run a business that might cause you harm, they don't just say, ''I haven't got the money'' when you claim.

It's all good stuff. But National Health insurance is the best value of all, because there's no middle man.

[rachelbean]

As a new UK citizen I can't wait to vote and do anything in my power to keep the NHS functioning. I've worked and paid taxes since within a few weeks of being here on my first visa and I would gladly pay even more taxes to keep it going, as I believe the majority of British voters would

When I first came over and was not a legal resident I paid to see a private doctor so that I could get my birth control prescription, and then I went to the pharmacy to have it filled. The woman very quietly told me that since I didn't have a national insurance number I needed to pay for my prescription, and I told her that was no problem of course. Then she told me the total, for 3 months of BC which was £8 and I actually started laughing out loud, because at home I had paid $130 for 3 months WITH INSURANCE.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/12/03/healt ... s-500.html