Healthcare... America and the rest

[Tero]

Seth, Trump does not care about you, your insurance or your support. You got him in, now he dumps you. Loser!

[Scot Dutchy]

Most European countries have a universal care system making health affordable to their citizens but of course Seth can never understand how they work. I remember back on the RD forum he claimed he did not need insurance as he could pay for it himself.

[Seth]

"whole purpose of Obamacare is to wipe out the private health care insurance industry"

Total bullshit, once again.

Nope.

Firstly, they can opt out and keep only corporate clients.

And that, were it true, would ensure the survival of the private health care industry serving the general public how, exactly.

Second, they were part of the deal.

They didn't have a choice, but they were certainly looking to make quick profits while they could...until the system collapsed, which they knew it would, at which point they would abandon the field as soon as it became unprofitable, which they have done.

It actually would have worked, had all the states played along.

No, it wouldn't have worked, ever. It was always economically infeasible.

It might have cost a bit, but many self employed enteroreneurs used it. Several of my hair cutters were on it, as the Super Cuts franchise owner offered zero benefits. He was under the total number of employees required to have to.

"Might have cost a bit?" Do you have any idea how much individual premiums have jumped in the last year? Go look it up for fuck's sake. People cannot afford to buy health insurance and still feed their kids so they are "opting out" and are paying the government fine instead, which was a pretty obvious flaw in the plan to begin with that makes it again clear that the system was built to fail.

If you can avoid "contributing" to the pool costs by paying a fine that's something like 10 percent of the average cost of a policy, as most young people are doing, why would you buy a policy you don't need costing ten times that? Young people aren't idiots and even the liberal millennials told Obama to go fuck himself and paid the fine rather than pay for some old fart like me who needs a lung transplant because he's been smoking for 50 years.

And do you think the architects of Obamacare didn't know this was going to happen? They aren't that stupid. They knew all along that people would refuse to pay the outrageous premiums that would necessarily occur and would pay a relatively paltry fine instead, which would cause a failure of income to the system, which would cause a failure of the exchanges and departure of private insurers, which would raise premiums, which would cause more abandonment of the system, which would, and has, caused fiscal insolvency of the whole system and it's imminent collapse, at which point emergency measures will be "necessary" and socialized medicine for all will be forcibly imposed...or would have been if Hillary had won.

Take off those liberal rose colored glasses and smell the coffee because you're living in a fantasy.

[Seth]

Most European countries have a universal care system making health affordable to their citizens but of course Seth can never understand how they work.

That's because they don't work because they can't work because they are founded on fault math. They are all on the demise and they are taking entire national economies down with them as they go. The only way to prevent that economic collapse is for the system to deny treatment, delay treatment, provide inferior treatment and let people die because they are too expensive to treat. And that's exactly what's happening. Indeed in some places they've passed euthanasia laws so they can kill them off rather than treat them...like the guy euthanized for alcoholism the other day.

Socialized medicine comes down to giving someone a sticking plaster for lung cancer and calling it "socialized medicine."

[Tero]

"Do you have any idea how much individual premiums have jumped in the last year? Go look it up for fuck's sake."

Already signed up. It's going to work fine until Trump pulls the rug from under us because 60 million voters want that. Or maybe they wanted to "make America great again." Who knows what they wanted. We pretty much know what they will get. Expensive insurance. Unless they are sick people. Then they get nothing.

[Seth]

"Do you have any idea how much individual premiums have jumped in the last year? Go look it up for fuck's sake."

Already signed up. It's going to work fine until Trump pulls the rug from under us because 60 million voters want that. Or maybe they wanted to "make America great again." Who knows what they wanted. We pretty much know what they will get. Expensive insurance. Unless they are sick people. Then they get nothing.

Clearly you haven't looked it up. 'Nuf said.

[Tero]

It cost me a few hundred more a month. I get the subsidy.

[Seth]

It cost me a few hundred more a month. I get the subsidy.

Which is to say that you steal from others to subsidize your health care.

[Tero]

Just like you stealing from others for auto insurance.

By the way, I don't actually get anything. I had one physical and one flu shot. My wife got neither. The subsidy is merely a gift from Obama to insurance companies for doing a little paperwork.

[Scot Dutchy]

Just got my new health insurance charges in for next year; €137 per month that inclusive additional extra 3* insurance. You can get basic insurance for €100 per month. That is for the best health care in Europe.

[Forty Two]

It cost me a few hundred more a month. I get the subsidy.

"a few hundred more a month"

$300 a month is $3,600 per year, more.... lol

And, you get a subsidy?

So much for reduced premiums, reduced costs in the medical industry, reduced fraud, etc. So much for "affordable" care promised by the "Affordable Care Act." More expensive = more affordable.

[Sean Hayden]

When you say 100 a month for the best healthcare in Europe, does that mean that whatever care you need the 100 a month you've been paying means you'll get it, nothing more is needed, ever?

[Scot Dutchy]

We have an own cost of €350 a year but that is for only for certain things. Once paid the rest of the year is covered. I have 3* coverage on top of basic which includes just a lot more.

[Sean Hayden]

Sorry, I'm just ignorant of these things. Online I usually get the impression from people that they don't ever expect to go into their own pockets, ever. So, if you have a heart attack for example, do you expect to be completely covered for all costs? A quick search reveals that the costs vary wildly across the US and so to then does what we can expect to pay after insurance.

[Tero]

My out of pocket is some $6000 for heart attack.