Objective Reality

Do you believe in objective reality

Bacon
2
18%
Cheese
2
18%
Yes
1
9%
No
2
18%
Not sure, how can we be sure of anything?
1
9%
The entire bacon and cheese sandwich.
3
27%
 
Total votes: 11

User avatar
rainbow
Posts: 13528
Joined: Fri Jun 08, 2012 8:10 am
About me: Egal wie dicht du bist, Goethe war Dichter
Location: Africa
Contact:

Objective Reality

Post by rainbow » Thu Jan 30, 2020 6:25 am

Within Schroedinger's Universe existence can only be established by observation.

Discuss.
I call bullshit - Alfred E Einstein
BArF−4

User avatar
pErvinalia
On the good stuff
Posts: 59297
Joined: Tue Feb 23, 2010 11:08 pm
About me: Spelling 'were' 'where'
Location: dystopia
Contact:

Re: Objective Reality

Post by pErvinalia » Thu Jan 30, 2020 6:51 am

Define "observation". More accurately it is probably better to say "interaction".
Sent from my penis using wankertalk.
"The Western world is fucking awesome because of mostly white men" - DaveDodo007.
"Socialized medicine is just exactly as morally defensible as gassing and cooking Jews" - Seth. Yes, he really did say that..
"Seth you are a boon to this community" - Cunt.
"I am seriously thinking of going on a spree killing" - Svartalf.

User avatar
Hermit
Posts: 25806
Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2009 12:44 am
About me: Cantankerous grump
Location: Ignore lithpt
Contact:

Re: Objective Reality

Post by Hermit » Thu Jan 30, 2020 7:01 am

May I plead the fifth problem of induction? If not, I'll have the pizza Napoletana, thanks. And don't spare the garlic.
I am, somehow, less interested in the weight and convolutions of Einstein’s brain than in the near certainty that people of equal talent have lived and died in cotton fields and sweatshops. - Stephen J. Gould

User avatar
rainbow
Posts: 13528
Joined: Fri Jun 08, 2012 8:10 am
About me: Egal wie dicht du bist, Goethe war Dichter
Location: Africa
Contact:

Re: Objective Reality

Post by rainbow » Thu Jan 30, 2020 7:14 am

pErvinalia wrote:
Thu Jan 30, 2020 6:51 am
Define "observation". More accurately it is probably better to say "interaction".
Exactly.

Does a bacon and cheese sandwich still taste good if nobody has eaten it yet?
Are the components more tasty when combined, that is - an interaction?
If so, does this imply consiousness?
I call bullshit - Alfred E Einstein
BArF−4

User avatar
rainbow
Posts: 13528
Joined: Fri Jun 08, 2012 8:10 am
About me: Egal wie dicht du bist, Goethe war Dichter
Location: Africa
Contact:

Re: Objective Reality

Post by rainbow » Thu Jan 30, 2020 7:20 am

Hermit wrote:
Thu Jan 30, 2020 7:01 am
May I plead the fifth problem of induction? If not, I'll have the pizza Napoletana, thanks. And don't spare the garlic.
Talking about garlic, if Aliens were to land in France, might they not deduce that humans smell slightly odd?
I call bullshit - Alfred E Einstein
BArF−4

User avatar
Svartalf
Offensive Grail Keeper
Posts: 40340
Joined: Wed Feb 24, 2010 12:42 pm
Location: Paris France
Contact:

Re: Objective Reality

Post by Svartalf » Thu Jan 30, 2020 7:26 am

What's odd with the smell of garlic? it's those who don't eat it in proper amounts that are weird.
Embrace the Darkness, it needs a hug

PC stands for "Patronizing Cocksucker" Randy Ping

User avatar
rainbow
Posts: 13528
Joined: Fri Jun 08, 2012 8:10 am
About me: Egal wie dicht du bist, Goethe war Dichter
Location: Africa
Contact:

Re: Objective Reality

Post by rainbow » Thu Jan 30, 2020 8:05 am

Mais Il faut manger pour vivre et non vivre pour manger, non?
I call bullshit - Alfred E Einstein
BArF−4

User avatar
Hermit
Posts: 25806
Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2009 12:44 am
About me: Cantankerous grump
Location: Ignore lithpt
Contact:

Re: Objective Reality

Post by Hermit » Thu Jan 30, 2020 8:47 am

rainbow wrote:
Thu Jan 30, 2020 7:20 am
Hermit wrote:
Thu Jan 30, 2020 7:01 am
May I plead the fifth problem of induction? If not, I'll have the pizza Napoletana, thanks. And don't spare the garlic.
Talking about garlic, if Aliens were to land in France, might they not deduce that humans smell slightly odd?
If Aliens were to land in France I'd expect them to be of a sufficiently advanced mindset to avoid making such a mistake. Of course the mistake is not the perception that the frogs smell slightly odd. It is the awareness that humans they have no experience of may not necessarily emanate the same stench as those whose olfactory assaults they have endured. In short, they would have learnt the lesson Bertrand Russell's turkey did not.
I am, somehow, less interested in the weight and convolutions of Einstein’s brain than in the near certainty that people of equal talent have lived and died in cotton fields and sweatshops. - Stephen J. Gould

User avatar
Svartalf
Offensive Grail Keeper
Posts: 40340
Joined: Wed Feb 24, 2010 12:42 pm
Location: Paris France
Contact:

Re: Objective Reality

Post by Svartalf » Thu Jan 30, 2020 8:57 am

rainbow wrote:
Thu Jan 30, 2020 8:05 am
Mais Il faut manger pour vivre et non vivre pour manger, non?
Foutaise.
Embrace the Darkness, it needs a hug

PC stands for "Patronizing Cocksucker" Randy Ping

User avatar
JimC
The sentimental bloke
Posts: 73016
Joined: Thu Feb 26, 2009 7:58 am
About me: To be serious about gin requires years of dedicated research.
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Contact:

Re: Objective Reality

Post by JimC » Thu Jan 30, 2020 10:08 am

My take:

There is a real, material universe, not some weird spirit realm. However, our ability to accurately model this reality is severely limited, in that evolution has designed our cognitive apparatus to work in a quick and dirty way, so our personal models are excellent at avoiding sabre tooth tigers and mating, but not so good at discerning what lies behind. Science and maths let us get deeper in, but the picture of reality that emerges becomes, inevitably, more and more distant from the personal cognitive models that have worked so well in a survival sense.
Nurse, where the fuck's my cardigan?
And my gin!

User avatar
Brian Peacock
Tipping cows since 1946
Posts: 37956
Joined: Thu Mar 05, 2009 11:44 am
About me: Ablate me:
Location: Location: Location:
Contact:

Re: Objective Reality

Post by Brian Peacock » Thu Jan 30, 2020 10:38 am

rainbow wrote:
Thu Jan 30, 2020 7:20 am
Hermit wrote:
Thu Jan 30, 2020 7:01 am
May I plead the fifth problem of induction? If not, I'll have the pizza Napoletana, thanks. And don't spare the garlic.
Talking about garlic, if Aliens were to land in France, might they not deduce that humans smell slightly odd?
Only if they had some kind of schema classifying the range of human olfactory experience in relation to the socially constructed normative values associated with the perception of certain combinations of air-born molecules.

I for one believe that our true lizard masters smell like rose petals cast upon a harvest breeze.
Rationalia relies on voluntary donations. There is no obligation of course, but if you value this place and want to see it continue please consider making a small donation towards the forum's running costs.
Details on how to do that can be found here.

.

"It isn't necessary to imagine the world ending in fire or ice.
There are two other possibilities: one is paperwork, and the other is nostalgia."

Frank Zappa

"This is how humanity ends; bickering over the irrelevant."
Clinton Huxley » 21 Jun 2012 » 14:10:36 GMT
.

User avatar
rainbow
Posts: 13528
Joined: Fri Jun 08, 2012 8:10 am
About me: Egal wie dicht du bist, Goethe war Dichter
Location: Africa
Contact:

Re: Objective Reality

Post by rainbow » Thu Jan 30, 2020 12:12 pm

Svartalf wrote:
Thu Jan 30, 2020 8:57 am
rainbow wrote:
Thu Jan 30, 2020 8:05 am
Mais Il faut manger pour vivre et non vivre pour manger, non?
Foutaise.
:roll:
Les conneries sont de la nourriture pour l'exquis
:Erasb:
I call bullshit - Alfred E Einstein
BArF−4

User avatar
rainbow
Posts: 13528
Joined: Fri Jun 08, 2012 8:10 am
About me: Egal wie dicht du bist, Goethe war Dichter
Location: Africa
Contact:

Re: Objective Reality

Post by rainbow » Thu Jan 30, 2020 12:16 pm

Brian Peacock wrote:
Thu Jan 30, 2020 10:38 am
rainbow wrote:
Thu Jan 30, 2020 7:20 am
Hermit wrote:
Thu Jan 30, 2020 7:01 am
May I plead the fifth problem of induction? If not, I'll have the pizza Napoletana, thanks. And don't spare the garlic.
Talking about garlic, if Aliens were to land in France, might they not deduce that humans smell slightly odd?
Only if they had some kind of schema classifying the range of human olfactory experience in relation to the socially constructed normative values associated with the perception of certain combinations of air-born molecules.

I for one believe that our true lizard masters smell like rose petals cast upon a harvest breeze.
...a bit like β-ionone with a touch of geraniol and perhaps some tones of geosmin?
I call bullshit - Alfred E Einstein
BArF−4

User avatar
rainbow
Posts: 13528
Joined: Fri Jun 08, 2012 8:10 am
About me: Egal wie dicht du bist, Goethe war Dichter
Location: Africa
Contact:

Re: Objective Reality

Post by rainbow » Thu Jan 30, 2020 12:18 pm

JimC wrote:
Thu Jan 30, 2020 10:08 am
My take:

There is a real, material universe, not some weird spirit realm. However, our ability to accurately model this reality is severely limited, in that evolution has designed our cognitive apparatus to work in a quick and dirty way, so our personal models are excellent at avoiding sabre tooth tigers and mating, but not so good at discerning what lies behind. Science and maths let us get deeper in, but the picture of reality that emerges becomes, inevitably, more and more distant from the personal cognitive models that have worked so well in a survival sense.
A bit tedious, but some good stuff:
I call bullshit - Alfred E Einstein
BArF−4

User avatar
laklak
Posts: 20981
Joined: Tue Feb 23, 2010 1:07 pm
About me: My preferred pronoun is "Massah"
Location: Tannhauser Gate
Contact:

Re: Objective Reality

Post by laklak » Thu Jan 30, 2020 2:42 pm

We're amoebas crawling around a petri dish, bumping into the sides and making up stories about it all.
Hermit wrote:
Thu Jan 30, 2020 7:01 am
... I'll have the pizza Napoletana, thanks. And don't spare the garlic.
That is a damn good idea for dinner tonight. Cooking for one is a pain. Might even order a pie, you know, splurge. Live a little.
Yeah well that's just, like, your opinion, man.

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 11 guests