Speed of Light and Energy...?

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dj357
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Re: Speed of Light and Energy...?

Post by dj357 » Thu Apr 08, 2010 12:42 pm

colubridae wrote:
dj357 wrote: photons (commonly known as light) are considered to be massless packets of electro-magnetic radiation that exhibit particle-wave duality. i understand photons are the poster child for quantum mechanics. i understand they behave differently than we would normally see things in everyday, but I understand light and these concepts.
Dude that wasn't the question I asked. Let me lead you through this, otherwise you will just make yourself look like a fucking idiot and you don't want that do you?

Once again it is very important:-

Do you know why light travels at a constant speed in all frames of reference?

(there is one correct answer)

(i Have to go on a lesson shortly so I won't be back till later today - be patient)
Wikipedia: It is an upper bound on the speed at which energy, matter, and information can travel, as surpassing it "would lead to the destruction of the essential relation between cause and effect."
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Re: Speed of Light and Energy...?

Post by Nautilidae » Thu Apr 08, 2010 1:32 pm

dj357 wrote: Wikipedia: It is an upper bound on the speed at which energy, matter, and information can travel, as surpassing it "would lead to the destruction of the essential relation between cause and effect."

Not only that, but a massive object traveling at velocity c would gain an infinite amount of mass and become infinitely thin. This would prevent it from traveling at c in the first place.

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Re: Speed of Light and Energy...?

Post by dj357 » Thu Apr 08, 2010 1:34 pm

Nautilidae wrote:
dj357 wrote: Wikipedia: It is an upper bound on the speed at which energy, matter, and information can travel, as surpassing it "would lead to the destruction of the essential relation between cause and effect."

Not only that, but a massive object traveling at velocity c would gain an infinite amount of mass and become infinitely thin. This would prevent it from traveling at c in the first place.
based on the Lorentz factor
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Re: Speed of Light and Energy...?

Post by Nautilidae » Thu Apr 08, 2010 1:38 pm

dj357 wrote:
Nautilidae wrote:
dj357 wrote: Wikipedia: It is an upper bound on the speed at which energy, matter, and information can travel, as surpassing it "would lead to the destruction of the essential relation between cause and effect."

Not only that, but a massive object traveling at velocity c would gain an infinite amount of mass and become infinitely thin. This would prevent it from traveling at c in the first place.
based on the Lorentz factor
I apologize, but is this an attempt to show that length reduction and mass gain are not physical phenomena?

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Re: Speed of Light and Energy...?

Post by dj357 » Thu Apr 08, 2010 1:44 pm

Nautilidae wrote:I apologize, but is this an attempt to show that length reduction and mass gain are not physical phenomena?
no, just showing that I understand the reason infinite mass would be required
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Re: Speed of Light and Energy...?

Post by Nautilidae » Thu Apr 08, 2010 1:46 pm

dj357 wrote:
Nautilidae wrote:I apologize, but is this an attempt to show that length reduction and mass gain are not physical phenomena?
no, just showing that I understand the reason infinite mass would be required
Ah, alright. I apologize for the misunderstanding :td:

Now that we have discussed it, do you understand why time is relative depending on the frame of reference?

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Re: Speed of Light and Energy...?

Post by dj357 » Thu Apr 08, 2010 1:46 pm

dj357 wrote:
Nautilidae wrote:I apologize, but is this an attempt to show that length reduction and mass gain are not physical phenomena?
no, just showing that I understand the reason infinite mass would be required
actually, hang on. how the hell does an object magically become infinitely thin...? length contraction actually happens...? I was udner the impression that length contraction was merely an observed effect but not an actual effect upon the body travelling near or at the speed of light
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Re: Speed of Light and Energy...?

Post by Nautilidae » Thu Apr 08, 2010 1:49 pm

dj357 wrote:
dj357 wrote:
Nautilidae wrote:I apologize, but is this an attempt to show that length reduction and mass gain are not physical phenomena?
no, just showing that I understand the reason infinite mass would be required
actually, hang on. how the hell does an object magically become infinitely thin...? length contraction actually happens...?
Yes, length contraction actually occurs.

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Re: Speed of Light and Energy...?

Post by dj357 » Thu Apr 08, 2010 1:50 pm

Nautilidae wrote:
dj357 wrote:
dj357 wrote:
Nautilidae wrote:I apologize, but is this an attempt to show that length reduction and mass gain are not physical phenomena?
no, just showing that I understand the reason infinite mass would be required
actually, hang on. how the hell does an object magically become infinitely thin...? length contraction actually happens...?
Yes, length contraction actually occurs.
WTF? how...? has this been experimentally proven...?
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Re: Speed of Light and Energy...?

Post by Nautilidae » Thu Apr 08, 2010 2:02 pm

dj357 wrote:
Nautilidae wrote:
dj357 wrote:
dj357 wrote:
Nautilidae wrote:I apologize, but is this an attempt to show that length reduction and mass gain are not physical phenomena?
no, just showing that I understand the reason infinite mass would be required
actually, hang on. how the hell does an object magically become infinitely thin...? length contraction actually happens...?
Yes, length contraction actually occurs.
WTF? how...? has this been experimentally proven...?
Not yet, but it is experimentally testable. If length contraction is correct, we expect distances between stars to appear smaller. From Earth, this means that the angle between the two stars is slightly change.

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Re: Speed of Light and Energy...?

Post by dj357 » Thu Apr 08, 2010 2:15 pm

Nautilidae wrote:Not yet, but it is experimentally testable. If length contraction is correct, we expect distances between stars to appear smaller. From Earth, this means that the angle between the two stars is slightly change.
that doesn't make any sense... if an object with a non-zero rest mass requires infinite mass to travel at the speed of light what causes it to become thin as opposed to compressed or expanded...?

as for experimental testing how can we judge if the distances between stars are smaller than they actually are? if the only way we can measure their distance is through observation, which would show the distance being smaller than it physically is, how can we figure out what the actual distance should be...?
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Re: Speed of Light and Energy...?

Post by newolder » Thu Apr 08, 2010 2:18 pm

dj357 wrote:
Nautilidae wrote:
dj357 wrote:
dj357 wrote:
Nautilidae wrote:I apologize, but is this an attempt to show that length reduction and mass gain are not physical phenomena?
no, just showing that I understand the reason infinite mass would be required
actually, hang on. how the hell does an object magically become infinitely thin...? length contraction actually happens...?
Yes, length contraction actually occurs.
WTF? how...? has this been experimentally proven...?
The lhc@home screensaver shows the rippled pancake structure of massive protons very clearly. :cheers:
“This data is not Monte Carlo.”, …, “This collision is not a simulation.” - LHC-b guy, 30th March 2010.

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Re: Speed of Light and Energy...?

Post by dj357 » Thu Apr 08, 2010 2:21 pm

newolder wrote:The lhc@home screensaver shows the rippled pancake structure of massive protons very clearly. :cheers:
link please...?
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Re: Speed of Light and Energy...?

Post by newolder » Thu Apr 08, 2010 2:23 pm

dj357 wrote:
newolder wrote:The lhc@home screensaver shows the rippled pancake structure of massive protons very clearly. :cheers:
link please...?
http://lhcathome.cern.ch/

It's not issuing work units at the moment but I expect it'll not be too long...

This image is very low quality but I'm still searching for something better...
Image

Slightly better... You can see Heisenberg uncertainty in the orbits...
Image
“This data is not Monte Carlo.”, …, “This collision is not a simulation.” - LHC-b guy, 30th March 2010.

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Re: Speed of Light and Energy...?

Post by dj357 » Thu Apr 08, 2010 2:30 pm

newolder wrote:
dj357 wrote:
newolder wrote:The lhc@home screensaver shows the rippled pancake structure of massive protons very clearly. :cheers:
link please...?
http://lhcathome.cern.ch/

It's not issuing work units at the moment but I expect it'll not be too long...

This image is very low quality but I'm still searching for something better...
Image

Slightly better... You can see Heisenberg uncertainty in the orbits...
Image
I haven't a freaking clue what I'm supposed to be looking at here...
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