The internet and social life

[Bella Fortuna]

If you added the hours you spend here to your annual leave you could have a month off a year.

As I said earlier in this thread - there are no rules to this. As I also said, meeting a bunch of people from herein RL makes the experience richer. They don't come across totally as the same persona exactly, though close enough, but none of them really go to the same lengths as you do to 'play' a character, i.e. 'Dev' - and maybe that's the difference. This forum and their presence in it is simply nearer RL to those who are happy to take the step into real life meetings.

I personally find getting to know the real people, with the blurrier and more complex reality of who they are versus a one-dimensional 'character,' far more rewarding. It does demand more psychologically to develop real friendships (even if you never do meet in person), and hence requires more of a commitment than just time spent for passing entertainment value here - but I think it can be greatly worth the investment. Truthfully, the attitude that forum members are just personas unconnected with real flesh-and-blood individuals I find a little disturbing.

[devogue]

Truthfully, the attitude that forum members are just personas unconnected with real flesh-and-blood individuals I find a little disturbing.

Of course I realise that people here are connected to real flesh and blood individuals, but the point is that we are choosing to interact in a very particular and (and necessary) way, by means of the internet.

I already know loads of people in the flesh, shit loads more than I know here. I interact with them in a particular way - no way would I want to chat with my best RL friend, my dad or my wife on an internet forum - Mrs Dev's one time ambition to register on TAF or wherever seriously freaked me out. In the same way I don't want to have loads of meetings with people I've met online - I don't want to know the vast majority of you in real life because I feel that it would diminish the enjoyment I take out of this community in its natural form.

[Pappa]

I don't want to know the vast majority of you in real life because I feel that it would diminish the enjoyment I take out of this community in its natural form.

I've always felt that meeting forum members only added to the enjoyment (even the one's I've never met).

[Hermit]

I'm not sure that the things which seem so new about talking online are really that new, I suspect they are near to things we lost as people moved about more geographically and long standing communities dwindled. Telling stories, chewing the cud, commenting on the state of the world, and that most human thing, trying to figure it all out - I think we are moving back to a more natural state where these things are everyday parts of life, away from the transience of constant flows of strangers or near strangers. I suspect in countries with less fluid people movement, and less TV a great deal of time is spent as we do here, in fact that's more than just a suspicion.

Thank you so much for bringing that to my attention, Floppit. It is so true and obvious, but if you had not remarked on it, it would have escaped my attention altogether, and that is even though I became aware of Marshall McLuhan's prediction some time during the seventies that electronic means of communications will turn this planet into something he called 'the global village'.

[Tigger]

Good post, Dev, as usual. Well written and considered, but I disagree, and that will probably have to be the way it is. When you say - and it's not taken out of context, just a snippet, not a quote mine for insidious purposes, you cannot and should not then expect members of the community who use the forum as it really is, as an internet forum full of avatars, sigs, and the rough and tumble of internetica, to feel the same hurt and emotions that you feel because you have met other people in real life. The onus is on you to fit back in with the unique electronic vibe of the internet forum, not on other members to accommodate your new found extra-forum relationships., I can only say that is total bollocks from my perspective. Why I can't expect that is beyond me and many others, especially here. You have found that there is a more human side to the people that you have met in real life, yet you prefer to hide behind your online persona rather than taking life by the bollocks and using the Internet for what it is: it is a means of communication between people, not avatars and pretence, and that is that. If you haven't got the will (or time) to take it to the next level as many of here have, then you are not, frankly, in a position to criticise us and have the (or any) forum stay the way you want it. You yourself have said things change and we can't stop them. It has moved on, we have, a lot of us, moved on with it. Join us.

[JimC]

If you added the hours you spend here to your annual leave you could have a month off a year.

As I said earlier in this thread - there are no rules to this. As I also said, meeting a bunch of people from herein RL makes the experience richer. They don't come across totally as the same persona exactly, though close enough, but none of them really go to the same lengths as you do to 'play' a character, i.e. 'Dev' - and maybe that's the difference. This forum and their presence in it is simply nearer RL to those who are happy to take the step into real life meetings.

Much truth there is in this post...

Dev has an idiosyncratic view of forum life which I am sure is true for him, and it is perfectly reasonable that this leads him to avoid local meet-ups; a pity, I think, but a decision I can respect.

However, I doubt his reasoning generalises for the majority, whose various meet-ups have indeed been a source of innocent merriment...

If your assertion about members who are thoroughly into playing a character is true (as I suspect it is), then one would predict that a certain Clinton Huxley may be averse to meet-ups as well, which would alson be a pity...

However, I must not speak for the great man himself; Clinton, get your arse down to this thread and comment!

[Bella Fortuna]

I'd love to meet Clinton someday.

I'd love even more to meet the real person behind that character who has kept us so entertained.

[JimC]

I'd love to meet Clinton someday.

I'd love even more to meet the real person behind that character who has kept us so entertained.

So would I, but if Rum's theory is correct, it may be unlikely...

However, hopefully Clinton will prove us wrong one day!

[FBM]

Shouldn't the subject line read 'The Internet or social life'?

[AshtonBlack]

I'd love to meet Clinton someday.

I'd love even more to meet the real person behind that character who has kept us so entertained.

This too, I would like to buy him a beer one day!

[Rum]

I'd love to meet Clinton someday.

I'd love even more to meet the real person behind that character who has kept us so entertained.

This too, I would like to buy him a beer one day!

I'd buy him a nice glass of Bordeaux any day!

[floppit]

I am "devogue" here, and I use my persona like an avatar in Second Life or something.

I like Devogue or devegog as I call you in my head! The same way I appreciate the characters I meet in real life, not the fish fodder but the characters, I like the richer text. I we had the you in real life then we'd lose devogue - bollox! I can't make sense. I think devogue makes things richer not poorer round here, and I thought that even when I thought devogue was very real, like the popular funny kid at school who charms and is charmed by the cream of the crop.

Don't get me wrong, if you ever just changed your mind and wanted SB here I know it'd be bloody cool too, but I'd still have a part of me sad to lose Devegog!

[devogue]

you cannot and should not then expect members of the community who use the forum as it really is, as an internet forum full of avatars, sigs, and the rough and tumble of internetica, to feel the same hurt and emotions that you feel because you have met other people in real life...,

I can only say that is total bollocks from my perspective. Why I can't expect that is beyond me and many others, especially here.

I don't have the time, the will or the desire to meet people as delightful as (for example) FIO, tattuchu or Woodbutcher in real life. That doesn't mean I can't enjoy their presence online enormously, feel a degree of affection for them and be civil to them - it just means that there is next to no chance that I will ever meet them in real life. I hope they don't see that as a slight, and that they can understand my reasons as laid out in my earlier posts.

You do have the time, resources, will and desire to meet people from here in real life. Fair play to you and those you meet, and to anyone who is actively looking to meet other members from here in real life - I can understand that need completely and I genuinely hope that everyone has a wonderful time whenever they meet up - why shouldn't they?

Now, if I really wanted to meet people here I have the money to jump on a plane to England or America, so the means are there, but let's just take me out of the equation now and consider someone else who doesn't have the options I do.

What about the member who hasn't much money, perhaps isn't very mobile, who maybe has an aversion to meeting people because he is naturally shy in real life, but who really enjoys the unique buzz of online interaction? ... I suspect there is at least more than one member here who fits that description (although I admit I couldn't name one). Let's make up a name - Geppetto.

So everyone starts at the same level, including you and Geppetto - we are a fizzing cauldron of electronic personalities, endlessly fascinating and exciting and we interact, but then something happens - something I shall call the "Pinocchio Effect" - the natural and understandable desire of some members to meet in real life with others. Once that happens everything changes - you see a real person, you click with them, you may have a drink and a chat with them, you may sleep with them, but suddenly and forever they are no longer a "username", they are someone who you care for on a much deeper level than exists online. After your meeting you return to the forum and you begin to interact again, but you realise that it's different now, that you are closer, more protective of the person or people you met up with. But nothing has changed for Geppetto - he is justing posting away as usual (as you were a few days before), blissfully unaware of the new feelings seared in your mind by your meeting. He might make a post down the line which once would have had you giggling, but now has you frowning because it's a bit too close to the bone because of your RL friendships.

The point is, you have made the decision to take things to another level by meeting people in real life - you have opened a door to a much more intense emotional experience. You cannot expect and demand that Geppetto (who does not have your "emotion chip", resources or extrovert personality) adjusts to your level, to your expectations about hurt and emotion, because nothing has changed for him and this is still an internet forum, a resource which probably conveys less of the human condition than the sound of a voice on a telephone.

You have found that there is a more human side to the people that you have met in real life, yet you prefer to hide behind your online persona rather than taking life by the bollocks and using the Internet for what it is: it is a means of communication between people, not avatars and pretence, and that is that.

You couldn't be more wrong! I'm not hiding behind my online persona - I revel in my online persona. I enjoy it, I soar with it, I get so much out of it - so much that I daren't compromise it in any way. If I want to meet people in real life I can do that anywhere but (and I realise this sounds a bit precious) the history (and future) of my "devogue" character lies entirely here. Floppit absolutely nails it with her post. Both of our positions are entirely valid, but we are coming from a very strange starting point, the internet - so perhaps mine sounds a bit colder, but I find enough warmth, charm, humour and indivdual character in the online personas here not to want to take things to another level in real life.

If you haven't got the will (or time) to take it to the next level as many of here have, then you are not, frankly, in a position to criticise us and have the (or any) forum stay the way you want it.

Frankly, that's an astonishingly arrogant position to take, especially given the scenario I outlined above. Firstly, I did not "criticise" anyone for meeting up, I merely said that anyone who has held meetings should not expect those who haven't to experience the same emotions and feelings of, say, "hurt". An internet forum can exist without anyone ever meeting up in real life - all that is expected of the internet forum user who wants to be part of the community is that he or she posts.

You yourself have said things change and we can't stop them. It has moved on, we have, a lot of us, moved on with it. Join us.

Yes, things have moved on because online communities do evolve and grow (or diminish), with or without the outside influence. I'm quite happy do move on purely online. I should also say that while they seem to be overwhelmingly good fun and positive, real life meetings have not always gone swimmingly - I know of at least two instances which had a profoundly negative impact on those who experienced them.

[devogue]

Don't get me wrong, if you ever just changed your mind and wanted SB here I know it'd be bloody cool too, but I'd still have a part of me sad to lose Devegog!

Bingo.

I'm just another bloke doing an ordinary job with an ordinary family in an ordinary world. I'm quite a serious 35 year old male with crap taste in clothes and music. I have health problems, I drank too much (I've wised up a bit) and my life is quite grey and monotonous. Like billions of others I have compromised over the years - dreams don't shatter, they fade away - and I realise I have underachieved massively in areas I wouldn't have achieved in anyway.

I don't want to bring that person here, and I don't want to expose him to the community at large in real life either - that would be even worse. This place is my flight of fancy, an escape from real life, never a part of it.

Everyone here has an almost superstar quality within our own group, and you know what they say about meeting your heroes.

Sorry, but I prefer to daub on the face paint, don my silly wig and step out under the pro-silver lights.

[Svartalf]

Shouldn't the subject line read 'The Internet or social life'?

lolwut? I hang out on the net because I can't afford a real social life.