Catcher in the Rye

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lordpasternack
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Re: Catcher in the Rye

Post by lordpasternack » Mon Jul 13, 2009 5:49 pm

Cormac wrote:
Mysturji wrote:
lordpasternack wrote:
Charlou wrote:Back on topic, and Catcher in the Rye is not a book I'm inclined to read any time soon as I have stacks of other books higher up my list of must reads ... So many books, so little time ...
It's a very short book... :dono:
But it seems so much longer. :yawn:
Yes.

Reading that book is like slowly inserting hot needles in ones eyes, and under one's fingernails and toenails...
Perhaps it's like Marmite? :biggrin:
Then they for sudden joy did weep,
And I for sorrow sung,
That such a king should play bo-peep,
And go the fools among.
Prithee, nuncle, keep a schoolmaster that can teach
thy fool to lie: I would fain learn to lie.

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Re: Catcher in the Rye

Post by Xamonas Chegwé » Mon Jul 13, 2009 5:50 pm

Cormac wrote:
FBM wrote:I've read that it helps to keep in mind that the narration is actually Holden talking to his psychiatrist or therapist, as the story reveals that he was put under psychiatric care. It was hard to pinpoint a single point that the book was trying to make, and you have to get into analyzing imagery and word choice and such, all of which makes it too much work, IMO. It was a worthwhile read for me, but nothing I'd rave about, exactly.
Like Ulysses and Finnegan's Wake by Joyce. Utter bollox.

His earlier stuff was excellent, but then his ego masturbation took over, and he began to write fuck all.
I liked Dubliners but I found Portrait of the artist a little meh in places. I tried Ulysses once but couldn't get more than 20 pages in - like you said, pure masturbation.
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Re: Catcher in the Rye

Post by Cormac » Mon Jul 13, 2009 6:29 pm

lordpasternack wrote:
Cormac wrote:
Mysturji wrote:
lordpasternack wrote:
Charlou wrote:Back on topic, and Catcher in the Rye is not a book I'm inclined to read any time soon as I have stacks of other books higher up my list of must reads ... So many books, so little time ...
It's a very short book... :dono:
But it seems so much longer. :yawn:
Yes.

Reading that book is like slowly inserting hot needles in ones eyes, and under one's fingernails and toenails...
Perhaps it's like Marmite? :biggrin:
Exactly - fucking disgusting. :)
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Re: Catcher in the Rye

Post by Cormac » Mon Jul 13, 2009 6:32 pm

Xamonas Chegwé wrote:
Cormac wrote:
FBM wrote:I've read that it helps to keep in mind that the narration is actually Holden talking to his psychiatrist or therapist, as the story reveals that he was put under psychiatric care. It was hard to pinpoint a single point that the book was trying to make, and you have to get into analyzing imagery and word choice and such, all of which makes it too much work, IMO. It was a worthwhile read for me, but nothing I'd rave about, exactly.
Like Ulysses and Finnegan's Wake by Joyce. Utter bollox.

His earlier stuff was excellent, but then his ego masturbation took over, and he began to write fuck all.
I liked Dubliners but I found Portrait of the artist a little meh in places. I tried Ulysses once but couldn't get more than 20 pages in - like you said, pure masturbation.
Portrait of the Artist as a Young Man is, in today's world, a bit meh. But it is an interesting exposition of the hypocrisy of Ireland at the time - the young man attending the "sodality" - a catholic holier than thou club where young men competed to seem holier than all the others, after which, said same young man repairs to a pub where he gets hammered, followed by a visit to a prostitute.

Dublin at the time had the biggest population of prostitutes per capita in the entire British Empire.

I've read both Ulysses and Finnegan's Wake. Boooring.
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Re: Catcher in the Rye

Post by FBM » Tue Jul 14, 2009 1:41 am

Cormac wrote:
FBM wrote:I've read that it helps to keep in mind that the narration is actually Holden talking to his psychiatrist or therapist, as the story reveals that he was put under psychiatric care. It was hard to pinpoint a single point that the book was trying to make, and you have to get into analyzing imagery and word choice and such, all of which makes it too much work, IMO. It was a worthwhile read for me, but nothing I'd rave about, exactly.
Like Ulysses and Finnegan's Wake by Joyce. Utter bollox.

His earlier stuff was excellent, but then his ego masturbation took over, and he began to write fuck all.
I guess I was exposed to his later stuff first, because I couldn't stomach even one book, though several parts of Dubliners were very interesting. On the whole, his style seemed like just so much self-aggrandizing posing. I've never had any patience or tolerance or respect for someone who writes in a deliberately obscure, impenetrable fashion.
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Re: Catcher in the Rye

Post by Cormac » Tue Jul 14, 2009 6:13 am

FBM wrote:
Cormac wrote:
FBM wrote:I've read that it helps to keep in mind that the narration is actually Holden talking to his psychiatrist or therapist, as the story reveals that he was put under psychiatric care. It was hard to pinpoint a single point that the book was trying to make, and you have to get into analyzing imagery and word choice and such, all of which makes it too much work, IMO. It was a worthwhile read for me, but nothing I'd rave about, exactly.
Like Ulysses and Finnegan's Wake by Joyce. Utter bollox.

His earlier stuff was excellent, but then his ego masturbation took over, and he began to write fuck all.
I guess I was exposed to his later stuff first, because I couldn't stomach even one book, though several parts of Dubliners were very interesting. On the whole, his style seemed like just so much self-aggrandizing posing. I've never had any patience or tolerance or respect for someone who writes in a deliberately obscure, impenetrable fashion.
Yep, that is why I don't have much time for his two major works. Mind you, there were some interesting ideas in them. They did lay some foundations for later works.
For example, his idea in Ulysses was to relate a story in real time, as narrated through the individual observer in an unmediated uncensored manner - as if you were plugged into the protagonists head. Clever idea, until one realises what fucking boredom you'll create writing a book on this basis. It was fairly revolutionary for its time though.
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Re: Catcher in the Rye

Post by FBM » Tue Jul 14, 2009 6:33 am

The whole 'stream of consciousness' thing was a good idea, and I tried both Joyce's and Faulkner's attempts at it. It's OK for a few pages, but after that it just gets annoying. I really don't enjoy spending 5 minutes interpreting every other sentence, only to figure out that the story itself isn't very interesting. I can do that with philosophy, but not novels. The Catcher in the Rye was the best attempt at it that I found readable.
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Re: Catcher in the Rye

Post by Feck » Tue Jul 14, 2009 11:20 am

CITR ? I've read it several times ,I have tried to find some empathy with Holden , but I just can't .Holden is a phoney :lol:
As for the merits of the book , I didn't like it I reread because I thought maybe there were depths my shallow brain had missed
I loved Lozzers Post , typical of Holden ;)
Did anyone get the Idea that Holden might be gay ?
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Re: Catcher in the Rye

Post by Gawdzilla Sama » Tue Jul 14, 2009 11:21 am

Hated the damn thing.
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Re: Catcher in the Rye

Post by Pappa » Tue Jul 14, 2009 12:29 pm

I liked it as a fairly pointless 'day in the life of' type book - but that was it. Try reading Brett Easton Ellis' Less Than Zero - similar sort of thing.
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Re: Catcher in the Rye

Post by FBM » Tue Jul 14, 2009 3:27 pm

OK, I've been holding back, but now I've had enough soju to make this joke:

After you catch 'er in the rye, what are you going to do to her?
















I'm so sorry. So deeply sorry. I hope no one is deeply scarred by that.
"A philosopher is a blind man in a dark room looking for a black cat that isn't there. A theologian is the man who finds it." ~ H. L. Mencken

"We ain't a sharp species. We kill each other over arguments about what happens when you die, then fail to see the fucking irony in that."

"It is useless for the sheep to pass resolutions in favor of vegetarianism while the wolf remains of a different opinion."

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Re: Catcher in the Rye

Post by Xamonas Chegwé » Tue Jul 14, 2009 3:30 pm

FBM wrote:OK, I've been holding back, but now I've had enough soju to make this joke:

After you catch 'er in the rye, what are you going to do to her?


I'm so sorry. So deeply sorry. I hope no one is deeply scarred by that.
Just go away now. :nono:
A book is a version of the world. If you do not like it, ignore it; or offer your own version in return.
Salman Rushdie
You talk to God, you're religious. God talks to you, you're psychotic.
House MD
Who needs a meaning anyway, I'd settle anyday for a very fine view.
Sandy Denny
This is the wrong forum for bluffing :nono:
Paco
Yes, yes. But first I need to show you this venomous fish!
Calilasseia
I think we should do whatever Pawiz wants.
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Re: Catcher in the Rye

Post by FBM » Tue Jul 14, 2009 3:31 pm

Xamonas Chegwé wrote:
FBM wrote:OK, I've been holding back, but now I've had enough soju to make this joke:

After you catch 'er in the rye, what are you going to do to her?


I'm so sorry. So deeply sorry. I hope no one is deeply scarred by that.
Just go away now. :nono:


:leave:
"A philosopher is a blind man in a dark room looking for a black cat that isn't there. A theologian is the man who finds it." ~ H. L. Mencken

"We ain't a sharp species. We kill each other over arguments about what happens when you die, then fail to see the fucking irony in that."

"It is useless for the sheep to pass resolutions in favor of vegetarianism while the wolf remains of a different opinion."

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Re: Catcher in the Rye

Post by lordpasternack » Tue Jul 14, 2009 3:44 pm

FBM wrote:OK, I've been holding back, but now I've had enough soju to make this joke:

After you catch 'er in the rye, what are you going to do to her?
Well, the title of the story comes from a misinterpreted Robert Burns song - "Comin' thro the Rye" - wherein Burns says:

Gin a body meet a body
Comin thro' the rye,
Gin a body kiss a body,
Need a body cry?


But frankly - I think Burns would have gone for more than a mere kiss: http://www.bbc.co.uk/robertburns/works/ ... r_fairing/

:hehe:
Then they for sudden joy did weep,
And I for sorrow sung,
That such a king should play bo-peep,
And go the fools among.
Prithee, nuncle, keep a schoolmaster that can teach
thy fool to lie: I would fain learn to lie.

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Re: Catcher in the Rye

Post by FBM » Tue Jul 14, 2009 3:47 pm

lordpasternack wrote:
FBM wrote:OK, I've been holding back, but now I've had enough soju to make this joke:

After you catch 'er in the rye, what are you going to do to her?
Well, the title of the story comes from a misinterpreted Robert Burns song - "Comin' thro the Rye" - wherein Burns says:

Gin a body meet a body
Comin thro' the rye,
Gin a body kiss a body,
Need a body cry?


But frankly - I think Burns would have gone for more than a mere kiss: http://www.bbc.co.uk/robertburns/works/ ... r_fairing/

:hehe:
:lol: I didn't know that! Yes, I think Burns would've given her the full Monty if he'd had the chance...^^^
"A philosopher is a blind man in a dark room looking for a black cat that isn't there. A theologian is the man who finds it." ~ H. L. Mencken

"We ain't a sharp species. We kill each other over arguments about what happens when you die, then fail to see the fucking irony in that."

"It is useless for the sheep to pass resolutions in favor of vegetarianism while the wolf remains of a different opinion."

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