Casual conversation about being pro-social and atheist at the same time

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Re: Casual conversation about being pro-social and atheist at the same time

Post by Svartalf » Sun Sep 19, 2021 11:01 am

Scot Dutchy wrote:
Fri Sep 17, 2021 8:44 pm
All labels given by the religious. We are simply the default and they are the exception. I dont have a label.
Actually, the prevalence of religion everywhere and at all times seems to show that there is something in the human mind that makes us tend to believe in sky daddy tales.
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Re: Casual conversation about being pro-social and atheist at the same time

Post by rainbow » Sun Sep 19, 2021 1:00 pm

Svartalf wrote:
Sun Sep 19, 2021 10:58 am
rainbow wrote:
Fri Sep 17, 2021 3:15 pm
camoguard wrote:
Wed Sep 15, 2021 7:54 pm
P.S. I use non-belief and atheism in a sloppy manner intended to be inclusive of the breadth of nonbelievers and unitarians and secular humanists kinds of people.
I don't believe in Atheists.
normal, you Africans are 50% christian, 50% muslim, and 100% traditional religionists.
:x My ancestors disagree! :x
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Re: Casual conversation about being pro-social and atheist at the same time

Post by pErvinalia » Sun Sep 19, 2021 1:25 pm

He forgot 50% witch doctors!
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Re: Casual conversation about being pro-social and atheist at the same time

Post by JimC » Mon Sep 20, 2021 9:36 am

Which doctors?
Nurse, where the fuck's my cardigan?
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Re: Casual conversation about being pro-social and atheist at the same time

Post by Scot Dutchy » Mon Sep 20, 2021 9:40 am

Nice one Jim. :hehe:
"Wat is het een gezellig boel hier".

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Re: Casual conversation about being pro-social and atheist at the same time

Post by Tero » Mon Sep 20, 2021 12:55 pm

Atheism? Atheism? That's so early 2000s. All that Dawkins stuff and clubs and forums and Pappa getting kicked out of the women atheists forum. I don't want to remember all that.

As far as right wingers, we can fight them and insult them on covid, guns, abortions and science. No need to bring god into it. Just make fun of their special rights as church groups.
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Re: Casual conversation about being pro-social and atheist at the same time

Post by camoguard » Tue Sep 21, 2021 9:35 pm

Svartalf wrote:
Sun Sep 19, 2021 11:01 am
Scot Dutchy wrote:
Fri Sep 17, 2021 8:44 pm
All labels given by the religious. We are simply the default and they are the exception. I dont have a label.
Actually, the prevalence of religion everywhere and at all times seems to show that there is something in the human mind that makes us tend to believe in sky daddy tales.
I watched the Nova episode about the Bible (https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/bible/) . In a nutshell, there's no truth to the Bible. What's mindblowing as a southern American is that all that psuedo historical stuff in the old testament like Joshua blowing the horn... you'd imagine that the horn blowing was false but maybe the military conquests happened. Nope. Didn't happen.

But it does have a narrative that has gotten me thinking. Religion starts as a bunch of agreed nonsense that is essentially the entry code into your minority club. And then at some point, it's a pyramid scheme where the OGs start saying it's true and using the language of truth as a loyalty test. Further in time, culture is permeated with the fantastic stories and those are accepted blindly by many.

So religion is common because each minority pocket used a fantasy story as an identifier, grew to cult status, and hung around long enough to join the list of nutjob religions.

If you imagine each religion as a solution to the problem of "How do I get a group of people to work together?" The different outcomes make sense in a way where the ends justify many means.

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Re: Casual conversation about being pro-social and atheist at the same time

Post by Scot Dutchy » Tue Sep 21, 2021 10:44 pm

Please tell us something new.
"Wat is het een gezellig boel hier".

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Re: Casual conversation about being pro-social and atheist at the same time

Post by JimC » Tue Sep 21, 2021 11:00 pm

Scot Dutchy wrote:
Tue Sep 21, 2021 10:44 pm
Please tell us something new.
A bit sneering, Scot. I thought Cam's thoughts were interesting and well-taken...
Nurse, where the fuck's my cardigan?
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Re: Casual conversation about being pro-social and atheist at the same time

Post by Scot Dutchy » Tue Sep 21, 2021 11:11 pm

Heard it all before Jim.
"Wat is het een gezellig boel hier".

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Re: Casual conversation about being pro-social and atheist at the same time

Post by Hermit » Tue Sep 21, 2021 11:30 pm

camoguard wrote:
Tue Sep 21, 2021 9:35 pm
Religion starts as a bunch of agreed nonsense that is essentially the entry code into your minority club. And then at some point, it's a pyramid scheme where the OGs start saying it's true and using the language of truth as a loyalty test. Further in time, culture is permeated with the fantastic stories and those are accepted blindly by many.

So religion is common because each minority pocket used a fantasy story as an identifier, grew to cult status, and hung around long enough to join the list of nutjob religions.

If you imagine each religion as a solution to the problem of "How do I get a group of people to work together?" The different outcomes make sense in a way where the ends justify many means.
My guess is that religion started as an attempt to explain phenomena when Homo sapiens began to realise that phenomena have causes but had no way of figuring out what caused them. Take thunder, for example. Something must have caused it, but the cause was invisible. Ah. The god of thunder. There were particular gods for each phenomenon. Polytheism preceded monotheism. Eventually a class of 'experts' evolved, and they wasted no time exploiting their expertise for their own benefit. Then, as humans become more capable of abstraction we got one single, more powerful god who was responsible for everything, and a more powerful class of superior experts to go with him.
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Re: Casual conversation about being pro-social and atheist at the same time

Post by Scot Dutchy » Tue Sep 21, 2021 11:35 pm

Fairy stories just like the Norse Saga's. Goat herders sitting around camp fires. The tallest tale was most appreciated. They even had professional story tellers incorporating the latest gossip into their stories.
"Wat is het een gezellig boel hier".

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Re: Casual conversation about being pro-social and atheist at the same time

Post by Svartalf » Wed Sep 22, 2021 9:48 am

camoguard wrote:
Tue Sep 21, 2021 9:35 pm
Svartalf wrote:
Sun Sep 19, 2021 11:01 am
Scot Dutchy wrote:
Fri Sep 17, 2021 8:44 pm
All labels given by the religious. We are simply the default and they are the exception. I dont have a label.
Actually, the prevalence of religion everywhere and at all times seems to show that there is something in the human mind that makes us tend to believe in sky daddy tales.
I watched the Nova episode about the Bible (https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/bible/) . In a nutshell, there's no truth to the Bible. What's mindblowing as a southern American is that all that psuedo historical stuff in the old testament like Joshua blowing the horn... you'd imagine that the horn blowing was false but maybe the military conquests happened. Nope. Didn't happen.

But it does have a narrative that has gotten me thinking. Religion starts as a bunch of agreed nonsense that is essentially the entry code into your minority club. And then at some point, it's a pyramid scheme where the OGs start saying it's true and using the language of truth as a loyalty test. Further in time, culture is permeated with the fantastic stories and those are accepted blindly by many.

So religion is common because each minority pocket used a fantasy story as an identifier, grew to cult status, and hung around long enough to join the list of nutjob religions.

If you imagine each religion as a solution to the problem of "How do I get a group of people to work together?" The different outcomes make sense in a way where the ends justify many means.
Let's face it, the bible does have a few chips of real history, not many, granted, but some.
Archaeology at Jericho showed that the walls had been demolished several times in the course of its history. more likely from earthquakes than from war... but think ol'Josh was there and blowing his shofar as one of those happened... biblical material!
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Re: Casual conversation about being pro-social and atheist at the same time

Post by Svartalf » Wed Sep 22, 2021 9:53 am

Scot Dutchy wrote:
Tue Sep 21, 2021 11:35 pm
Fairy stories just like the Norse Saga's. Goat herders sitting around camp fires. The tallest tale was most appreciated. They even had professional story tellers incorporating the latest gossip into their stories.
What sögur do you talk about? Icelanders sögur do get some fairy elements, but are mostly based on real facts.
Contemporary sögur are actually accounts made not long after the events.
Thae fairy stuff is mostly from royal sögur, especially the bits that seek to legitimize the king tyyhrough prestigious ancestry or god aided deeds. but it's mostly found in the 'Old Times Sögur', which are mythology pure and simple.
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Re: Casual conversation about being pro-social and atheist at the same time

Post by rainbow » Wed Sep 22, 2021 2:12 pm

camoguard wrote:
Tue Sep 21, 2021 9:35 pm
Svartalf wrote:
Sun Sep 19, 2021 11:01 am
Scot Dutchy wrote:
Fri Sep 17, 2021 8:44 pm
All labels given by the religious. We are simply the default and they are the exception. I dont have a label.
Actually, the prevalence of religion everywhere and at all times seems to show that there is something in the human mind that makes us tend to believe in sky daddy tales.
I watched the Nova episode about the Bible (https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/bible/) . In a nutshell, there's no truth to the Bible. What's mindblowing as a southern American is that all that psuedo historical stuff in the old testament like Joshua blowing the horn... you'd imagine that the horn blowing was false but maybe the military conquests happened. Nope. Didn't happen.

But it does have a narrative that has gotten me thinking. Religion starts as a bunch of agreed nonsense that is essentially the entry code into your minority club. And then at some point, it's a pyramid scheme where the OGs start saying it's true and using the language of truth as a loyalty test. Further in time, culture is permeated with the fantastic stories and those are accepted blindly by many.

So religion is common because each minority pocket used a fantasy story as an identifier, grew to cult status, and hung around long enough to join the list of nutjob religions.

If you imagine each religion as a solution to the problem of "How do I get a group of people to work together?" The different outcomes make sense in a way where the ends justify many means.
Exactly.

Religion has nothing to do with the existence or not of a God or Gods.

It has a social and political purpose.
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