Dawkins on Alien Rubbish

[HomerJay]

What I'm saying is that Dawkins could have just said "alien to science". Then we could have been more certain he didn't mean to imply that the teachings were rubbish because they were foreign or non-human.

You'd have to be an absolute fucking moron to think he meant it was non-human.

But then you've said it more than once!

[Exi5tentialist]

Okay, go tell him that. I'm sure he'll consult with you in the future regarding word usage.

Sounds like, apart from yet another attempt to needle me, you agree with me. In any event, you haven't really come up with anything convincing to suggest that I've misinterpreted Dawkins's motivation. The fact is, he's an absolute bigot, and he uses language to match.

Now you trot out what you really intend with this thread. A dig at Dawkins. Pity you're no where near his league.

Oh my God, you don't there's any possibility of that right-wing Dick being in my league do you? I don't want to be anywhere near the same league as him, thank you very much.

I think Dawkins was playing with the racism card before anyone else snatched it out of his hand to see what he was concealing. Pity your angle of view isn't as direct as mine.

Anyway thanks for the conversation Gawdzilla, I'm signing off for now.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

See you in Hell, Exi.

[klr]

Okay, go tell him that. I'm sure he'll consult with you in the future regarding word usage.

Sounds like, apart from yet another attempt to needle me, you agree with me. In any event, you haven't really come up with anything convincing to suggest that I've misinterpreted Dawkins's motivation. The fact is, he's an absolute bigot, and he uses language to match.

Yet again, you're the one making bald claims about facts. And yet again, you've proffered not a shred of evidence. Does Dawkins have a case history of racist and bigoted comments and actions that might conceivably allow this turn of phrase to be interpreted in such a negative manner?

Frankly, this is getting more than tiresome.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

One online course in philosophy and we have a genius on our hands.

[Jason]

Okay, go tell him that. I'm sure he'll consult with you in the future regarding word usage.

Sounds like, apart from yet another attempt to needle me, you agree with me. In any event, you haven't really come up with anything convincing to suggest that I've misinterpreted Dawkins's motivation. The fact is, he's an absolute bigot, and he uses language to match.

Yet again, you're the one making bald claims about facts. And yet again, you've proffered not a shred of evidence.

This is a war on religion and Dawkins is fanning the flames with propaganda and you ask for evidence?

Does Dawkins have a case history of racist and bigoted comments and actions that might conceivably allow this turn of phrase to be interpreted in such a negative manner?

Racism? Not that I'm aware, well apart from his smug sense of superiority and aloofness, but he seems to disperse that with some egalitarian sense. Bigoted? Absolutely.

Frankly, this is getting more than tiresome.

Yes it is.

[Jason]

One online course in philosophy and we have a genius on our hands.

Open University offers quality course materials and instructors, or so I've heard. All available over the interwebz thingie

[Gawdzilla Sama]

This is a war on religion and Dawkins is fanning the flames with propaganda and you ask for evidence?

And what's wrong with a war on religion?

[Gawdzilla Sama]

One online course in philosophy and we have a genius on our hands.

Open University offers quality course materials and instructors, or so I've heard. All available over the interwebz thingie

So does Liberty University.

[Jason]

It's not my war for one, but that was not the point. The point is the instrument being used in it, as it is always used in war, propaganda.

I shouldn't have to explain this. :\

[Hermit]

And calm down, I'm just stating an opinion - that's not threatening to you is it?

It's not. Your willful twisting of the situation is exasperating.

you haven't really come up with anything convincing to suggest that I've misinterpreted Dawkins's motivation.

and there you go again. Earlier in this thread are quotes where Dawkins has clearly and unambiguously explained what he means with 'alien rubbish' and 'rubbish liner'. Here is one of them again, this time from the Telegraph:

"Every single person I met believes if there is any disagreement between the Koran and science, then the Koran wins," he said.

"I spoke to a group of girls, and to a senior science teacher who believes the world is 6,000 years old.

"It's just utterly deplorable. These are now British children who are having their minds stuffed with alien rubbish."

If you're so confident about what he meant, I presume you'll be looking for him to be prosecuted for hate speech.

Or write a letter to the editor of every one of the many newsrags calling him out on his deliberate ambiguity and the racial/cultural clash it promotes. I understand he sometimes replies to such things.

Perhaps he'll let us know his intent and you'll have your evidence.

His intent has already been reported in the media - quite clearly and unambiguously. It's not easy to miss, unless you and Exi do so willfully. I have quoted one or two instances earlier in the thread as well, but you seem to have missed those too.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

It's not my war for one, but that was not the point. The point is the instrument being used in it, as it is always used in war, propaganda.

I shouldn't have to explain this. :\

The paranoia over the word "propaganda" can be traced back to Reichsministerium für Volksaufklärung und Propaganda or Propagandaministerium days. Propaganda means "information". It's focused in many cases, but any alert mind can filter out the tripe without much trouble. The problem comes from the fact that most people's minds are far from alert.

So, using "propaganda" pejoratively is rather silly. It's like claiming using the word "alien" meaning one is a racist. Absurd.

[Jason]

It's not my war for one, but that was not the point. The point is the instrument being used in it, as it is always used in war, propaganda.

I shouldn't have to explain this. :\

The paranoia over the word "propaganda" can be traced back to Reichsministerium für Volksaufklärung und Propaganda or Propagandaministerium days. Propaganda means "information". It's focused in many cases, but any alert mind can filter out the tripe without much trouble. The problem comes from the fact that most people's minds are far from alert.

So, using "propaganda" pejoratively is rather silly. It's like claiming using the word "alien" meaning one is a racist. Absurd.

Did I use it as a pejorative?

Propaganda is not unbiased information. It is sometimes not even correct information. It is the use of media, whatever the mode, to sway public opinion. It is not in itself an 'evil', but it is rarely completely honest. I assume this is what you mean by your white washing phrase 'focused in many cases'. Well I think there is something wrong with your filter.

To clarify, I never said the word 'alien' was indicative of a racist mind. I've merely suggested, in a circuitous way so that I might overcome some of the thicker walls around here, that its use in context could be suggestive of the intent to incite others to racial discrimination, if not outright racism, focused towards a particular group. Whether this was intentional or not, it cannot be said. I simply mark this down in my mind and continue along. If there is something to it, a pattern will emerge.

I guess they didn't give you navy boys much in the way of intelligence gathering training huh.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Exi2 used alien as a racist term, not yet. Didn't say you did. And just because something is propaganda doesn't automatically make it "bad". That's the point I'm trying to make, a point I didn't think I'd have to explain.

[Jason]

Exi2 used alien as a racist term, not yet. Didn't say you did. And just because something is propaganda doesn't automatically make it "bad". That's the point I'm trying to make, a point I didn't think I'd have to explain.

Not bad, but rarely completely honest. I thought I said as much.