Missouri puts prayers back in skool...

[Seth]

It's basically saying that the children of fundamentalists should not be taught......science.

Which is within the religious rights of the parents involved.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

They want to retrograde their kids, find. But the school system shouldn't have to jump through hoops for a religious reason.

[Seth]

I hope this one makes it to SCOTUS.

Missouri, meet the First Amendment.

The Scopes Monkey Trial was provoked by the ACLU to get Tennessee's law to SCOTUS, but it was derailed when the upper court threw the conviction out. Since then creationists have been dancing around the law, trying to avoid the point where they will have to explain why they ignored the Lemon Law to the Supremes. If the black robes get the case and decide rationally, ID will be dead in the water nationally.

Not necessarily, since there is a secular argument for intelligent design that does not depend on religious dogma. It's all in how it's presented. The defendants in Kitzmiller v. Dover came to the court with dirty hands (which is to say a documented agenda to insert creationism into the public schools), which is why they lost.

Had they been smart and presented it as a secular argument over evolutionary processes and the ambiguity about whether a "creator" does or could exist that is something less than a deity, they likely would have prevailed.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

The secular argument for ID is bullshit, "creationism in a cheap suit".

[Seth]

They want to retrograde their kids, find. But the school system shouldn't have to jump through hoops for a religious reason.

The school system exists to serve the needs and desires of parents and their children, and therefore may be compelled to reasonably accommodate the religious beliefs and rights of students. It's as simple as an "opt out" notice and the providing of a space for opted-out students to study other subjects during the parts of the curriculum that the parents object to.

[Seth]

The secular argument for ID is bullshit, "creationism in a cheap suit".

Only when it's presented by creationists as a sham argument used to forward creationism.

My secular argument for ID has nothing whatever to do with religion or creationism, it's purely secular and therefore a valid scientific theory every bit as valid as evolutionary theory itself.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

The secular argument for ID is bullshit, "creationism in a cheap suit".

Only when it's presented by creationists as a sham argument used to forward creationism.

My secular argument for ID has nothing whatever to do with religion or creationism, it's purely secular and therefore a valid scientific theory every bit as valid as evolutionary theory itself.

Yeah, you're not the first one to trot that out, either. It's boring.

[Tero]

You do not have to take any biology in MO schools. If Darwin is hiding there, do not take the class.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

You do not have to take any biology in MO schools. If Darwin is hiding there, do not take the class.

And Darwin will come for them when they look for jobs.

[Clinton Huxley]

It's basically saying that the children of fundamentalists should not be taught......science.

Which is within the religious rights of the parents involved.

Maybe the sprogs should have the right to be taught facts.

[Tero]

There is no science requirement to graduate in MO. Fundies not threatened. Unless they go to college.

[Mysturji]

Does this mean if any students who believe in Discordianism take themselves to a quiet corner out of the way they can perform the Turkey Curse? If so that will really piss the fundies off.

[Azathoth]

There is no science requirement to graduate in MO.

[mistermack]

They put it over as the right to pray. What they hide, is the erosion of people's right to not have prayer imposed on them.

If you pray audibly and visibly in a public place, you are interfering with other people's rights.
If the law said that you can pray privately, but you can't have ORGANISED prayer, that would be enough to meet everybody's rights.

But Audible, or visible organised praying at school is obviously interfering with peoples right to a religion-free education.
If you allow it, you are putting subtle peer pressure on those who don't take part.

I would guess that it's not in keeping with the US constitution.

[Seth]

The secular argument for ID is bullshit, "creationism in a cheap suit".

Only when it's presented by creationists as a sham argument used to forward creationism.

My secular argument for ID has nothing whatever to do with religion or creationism, it's purely secular and therefore a valid scientific theory every bit as valid as evolutionary theory itself.

Yeah, you're not the first one to trot that out, either. It's boring.

It's boring to you because you are not able to step outside your anti-theist bias and look at the subject rationally.