Richard Dawkins: 'Jesus would have been an atheist"

[Animavore]

Svartalf wrote:

From what I get, he was an end of times guy mostly because so many of his followers were convinced he was one.

I think there is a lot of truth in this...

Wrong. He mentions end times in all four gospels and claims that it will happen within the lifetimes of his followers. He wasn't even the only apocalyptic rabbi around at the time. Bart Ehrman is a great source for this.

[Svartalf]

Not that directly, and it happening in the lifetimes of the followers is inferred, but not really claimed (you'd believe that such a claim would have made the religion founder by the end of the second century if it had been made). Or I'll have to pack my bible and come to Dublin for a bible study course at Casa Anima....

[Schneibster]

I'll buy "Jesus was a socialist." I'll even buy "Christianity was a revolution." But I'm pretty sure Jesus wasn't an atheist. He might have been a closet deist.

closet deist? for a guy who's touted as the son of Dog, that's an accusation that doesn't make sense.

Well, he's not gonna tell everybody after he's gone around preaching all over the place, is he now?

And you're assuming he's the Son of Gawd. I'm not; I'm assuming it's all bullshit and he was just another Middle East revolutionary with a religious bug up his ass.

[JimC]

I'll buy "Jesus was a socialist." I'll even buy "Christianity was a revolution." But I'm pretty sure Jesus wasn't an atheist. He might have been a closet deist.

closet deist? for a guy who's touted as the son of Dog, that's an accusation that doesn't make sense.

Well, he's not gonna tell everybody after he's gone around preaching all over the place, is he now?

And you're assuming he's the Son of Gawd. I'm not; I'm assuming it's all bullshit and he was just another Middle East revolutionary with a religious bug up his ass.

But he may have truly believed it, unlike L Ron Hubbard...

Which makes a certain difference to the narrative...

[Animavore]

Not that directly, and it happening in the lifetimes of the followers is inferred, but not really claimed (you'd believe that such a claim would have made the religion founder by the end of the second century if it had been made). Or I'll have to pack my bible and come to Dublin for a bible study course at Casa Anima....

He tells them that there are those among him who will not taste death before his prophecy is fulfilled. That's hardly an inference. And a prophecy failing has never put off religious types before. Check When Prophecy Fails for a modern day example.

[Schneibster]

I'll buy "Jesus was a socialist." I'll even buy "Christianity was a revolution." But I'm pretty sure Jesus wasn't an atheist. He might have been a closet deist.

closet deist? for a guy who's touted as the son of Dog, that's an accusation that doesn't make sense.

Well, he's not gonna tell everybody after he's gone around preaching all over the place, is he now?

And you're assuming he's the Son of Gawd. I'm not; I'm assuming it's all bullshit and he was just another Middle East revolutionary with a religious bug up his ass.

But he may have truly believed it, unlike L Ron Hubbard...

Which makes a certain difference to the narrative...

Well, we're gettin' pretty far afield. I didn't say he was a deist, after all, just that that was about as close as I could see him getting to atheism.

[Feck]

I'm waiting for RD to read Crumple's posts ,decide in his infinite multi- doctorial wisdom that the End of civilisation is nigh and go all Harold Camping stylee

[Gawdzilla Sama]

We will never have an read on the actual person, of course. Nobody wrote his words at the time, and by the time they got around to doing the Gospels religious politics was the mission.

And I might as well leave this here too.

[borealis]

Derailing a little bit of the Jesus -theme.
I went through that interview and wasn't that a bit sad, on 06:35 "..I wasn't much good at anything, actually."

[Svartalf]

Not that directly, and it happening in the lifetimes of the followers is inferred, but not really claimed (you'd believe that such a claim would have made the religion founder by the end of the second century if it had been made). Or I'll have to pack my bible and come to Dublin for a bible study course at Casa Anima....

He tells them that there are those among him who will not taste death before his prophecy is fulfilled. That's hardly an inference. And a prophecy failing has never put off religious types before. Check When Prophecy Fails for a modern day example.

Well, at the end of John, when he tells John, "stay here until I come back", there's a rumor that he has just made John immortal, which implies that even his followers did not necessarily believe the thing was about to come within a human lifetime.

[Animavore]

Yeah. The(y) Catholic church made up the 'wandering Jew' to get around this. They no longer believe that

Edit: Wiki tells me the crossed out bit is false.

[Svartalf]

Neither same episode, nor same sources... Good Ol' Isaac Laquedem has no biblical foundation at all.

[Tyrannical]

Sounds like Dawkins jumped the shark on that one. Maybe he is going a little senile?

[Svartalf]

You're late Tyr, that could have been predicated already in early 2010