How close is The Labour Party to pure Communism today?

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How close is The Labour Party to pure Communism today?

Post by aufbahrung » Wed Aug 17, 2022 7:34 pm

Corban was close to being a true commie would have handed Putin the nuke fleet in days of being elected and leftwing things that would make Stalin smile. Now with Starmer in danger of being elected how close is the UK to a revolutionary leftwing takeover? How close is The Labour Party to pure Communism today?
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Re: How close is The Labour Party to pure Communism today?

Post by Brian Peacock » Wed Aug 17, 2022 9:43 pm

Nonsense. You really must stop getting your political information and analysis from people like the 4th Viscount Rothermere, Frederick Barclay, Conrad Black and Rupert Murdoch.
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Clinton Huxley » 21 Jun 2012 » 14:10:36 GMT
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Re: How close is The Labour Party to pure Communism today?

Post by pErvinalia » Thu Aug 18, 2022 12:05 am

How close is Crumple to Armageddon today?
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Re: How close is The Labour Party to pure Communism today?

Post by Hermit » Thu Aug 18, 2022 1:52 am

aufbahrung wrote:
Wed Aug 17, 2022 7:34 pm
Corban was close to being a true commie would have handed Putin the nuke fleet in days of being elected and leftwing things that would make Stalin smile. Now with Starmer in danger of being elected how close is the UK to a revolutionary leftwing takeover? How close is The Labour Party to pure Communism today?
Corbyn is a social democrat. Putin is a right wing authoritarian much beloved by other right wing authoritarians - like Donald Trump - and nobody else. Starmer is a wishy-washy "third way" Labour politician, who, like Blair before him, simply claims he can run capitalism better than the Tory mob.

The UK's Labour party in general has not been anywhere near communism since its policy calling for the nationalisation of the means of production (clause IV of the Labour Party Rule Book) has been deleted in 1995. From then on it has been about a "new capitalism". As Blair put it during the GFC ‘New world, new capitalism’ conference in 2009:
The new capitalism is therefore not about a return to the past. The change we seek should not be about replacing the free enterprise system or the market but about sustaining them in a way that is stable and enduring.
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Re: How close is The Labour Party to pure Communism today?

Post by Brian Peacock » Sat Aug 20, 2022 7:43 am

In recent years the avowed Right have taken to calling everyone to the left of them (the vast majority of people when polled about their views) socialists, communists, far-left extremists, or Antifa. Its led to things like Biden, a natural conservative, being called a radical far-left socialist etc.

That aside Crumps, the question to ask is not how dangerous or threatening this-or-that party's views are, but who is encouraging you to consider that party dangerous and threatening, and whose interests are they representing.
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Clinton Huxley » 21 Jun 2012 » 14:10:36 GMT
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Re: How close is The Labour Party to pure Communism today?

Post by aufbahrung » Sat Aug 20, 2022 9:53 am

Brian Peacock wrote:
Sat Aug 20, 2022 7:43 am
In recent years the avowed Right have taken to calling everyone to the left of them (the vast majority of people when polled about their views) socialists, communists, far-left extremists, or Antifa. Its led to things like Biden, a natural conservative, being called a radical far-left socialist etc.

That aside Crumps, the question to ask is not how dangerous or threatening this-or-that party's views are, but who is encouraging you to consider that party dangerous and threatening, and whose interests are they representing.
Communism never said sorry for the two billion dead under its rule, gulags, mass starvations and year zeroes and other plans for paradise that turned to hell
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Re: How close is The Labour Party to pure Communism today?

Post by pErvinalia » Sat Aug 20, 2022 11:02 am

Two billion eh? What orifice did you pull that one out of?
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Re: How close is The Labour Party to pure Communism today?

Post by Svartalf » Sat Aug 20, 2022 11:19 am

seth's ass via soupy's gut
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Re: How close is The Labour Party to pure Communism today?

Post by JimC » Sat Aug 20, 2022 9:57 pm

aufbahrung wrote:
Sat Aug 20, 2022 9:53 am
Brian Peacock wrote:
Sat Aug 20, 2022 7:43 am
In recent years the avowed Right have taken to calling everyone to the left of them (the vast majority of people when polled about their views) socialists, communists, far-left extremists, or Antifa. Its led to things like Biden, a natural conservative, being called a radical far-left socialist etc.

That aside Crumps, the question to ask is not how dangerous or threatening this-or-that party's views are, but who is encouraging you to consider that party dangerous and threatening, and whose interests are they representing.
Communism never said sorry for the two billion dead under its rule, gulags, mass starvations and year zeroes and other plans for paradise that turned to hell
Leaving aside from the inflated number, the culprits were totalitarian states with a surface veneer of communist ideology.
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Re: How close is The Labour Party to pure Communism today?

Post by Sean Hayden » Sat Aug 20, 2022 11:41 pm

Veneer is what humans do best. --pernicious social climbing bullshitters, the lot.

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Re: How close is The Labour Party to pure Communism today?

Post by pErvinalia » Sun Aug 21, 2022 12:45 am

Am not.
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Re: How close is The Labour Party to pure Communism today?

Post by JimC » Sun Aug 21, 2022 1:47 am

Sean Hayden wrote:
Sat Aug 20, 2022 11:41 pm
Veneer is what humans do best. --pernicious social climbing bullshitters, the lot.
Some veneers are less toxic than others...
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Re: How close is The Labour Party to pure Communism today?

Post by Brian Peacock » Sun Aug 21, 2022 4:38 am


aufbahrung wrote:
Brian Peacock wrote:
Sat Aug 20, 2022 7:43 am
In recent years the avowed Right have taken to calling everyone to the left of them (the vast majority of people when polled about their views) socialists, communists, far-left extremists, or Antifa. Its led to things like Biden, a natural conservative, being called a radical far-left socialist etc.

That aside Crumps, the question to ask is not how dangerous or threatening this-or-that party's views are, but who is encouraging you to consider that party dangerous and threatening, and whose interests are they representing.
Communism never said sorry for the two billion dead under its rule, gulags, mass starvations and year zeroes and other plans for paradise that turned to hell
You want an abstract concept to apologise to you? Does that other abstract concept Capitalism communicate with you directly - perhaps in the way the religious hear the word of God inside their skulls?

Putting that unforthcoming apology to the side, it seems the Left want to lead you to a false utopia by rationing your choices and limiting your freedoms, controlling your thought processes, and deciding what kind of stuff you can own -- as if none of this is a feature of Capitalism, eh?

OK, Soviet style communism was at best a hardship and at worse detrimental to the lives, livelihoods, and well-being of millions of people, but if the idea that giving everyone free broadband, increasing the research and overseas aid budgets as a proportion of GDP, rebuilding the UKs creaking energy, water and transport infrastructure for a more sustainable future, protecting people from exploitative housing and labour practises, divesting state hand outs for the arms trade and fossil fuel industries, restructuring the education system to focus on the personal development of the individual rather than merely providing training for the workplace, restoring general funding to the public services we all rely on to pre 2010 levels, adopting tougher climate change mitigation and adaptation policies, or boosting investment in green jobs in the forgotten regions of the country that never realky recovered from the deindustrialisation of the 1980s (Labour manifestos 2017/19) is communism, and therefore automatically dangerous and threatening, then don't you need to ask yourself what kind of world you actually want to live in? Do you really want to live in a world where timely cancer treatment, adequate housing, high quality sustainable jobs and protections against exploitative work practices are a bad thing?

You fear the Labour party are a radical force that, given power, will hurry us us back to the bad old days before Thatcher, but only because that's what you've been primed to fear, and even though the political wing of contemporary, global capital have been calling the political shots unopposed from that time onwards. Indeed, Starmer has just dumped all that popular stuff from his predecessor's manifestos in favour of the kind of pale blandishments forwarded by Cameron's so-called Compassionate Conservatism - the technocratic fiction that there's nothing fundamentally wrong with contemporary Capitalism, it just need a better, kinder adminstrator.

The irony is that everything the Right's romantic stories about the past hold dear were actually the result of a post war settlement driven, structured and implemented by ordinary working people through the political force of the Labour Party. Before the 1970s even the Tories were in favour of full employment policies, a comprehensive education system and a health and social care system that met people's immediate needs that was free at the point of delivery, income support that kept families from destitution between jobs and protected workers from exploitative practises, rent and mortgage-lending controls, high taxes for top earners and a commercial tax system that proritised reinvestment over short-term profit extraction. They had to be because people had a living memory of the time before those things became a feature if our society.

If you've bought into those stories and you'd like to live in that glorious, halcyon, bygone age again do you really think the Right are going take you there - and that the Left, who haven't been in power for 40 years, are what's stopping them?

What can the Left take away that Capital doesn't already own and rent back to you? The majority of us don't own our own time, and if the example of American is anything to go by pretty soon we won't even own our own bodies. And the social contract that says we trade those kinds of fundamental freedoms away during the working week to protect our societies from Communism, and so we can apply the soothing balm of consuming stuff at the weekend, does rather depend on a functioning economy and us having some disposable income - and how's that working out at the moment?

If the world is going to hell in a handbag it's not the existence of the Left that is driving it but the Right, which actually has it's hands on the tiller.


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There are two other possibilities: one is paperwork, and the other is nostalgia."

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Clinton Huxley » 21 Jun 2012 » 14:10:36 GMT
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Re: How close is The Labour Party to pure Communism today?

Post by aufbahrung » Sun Aug 21, 2022 4:56 am

I agree - capitalism as it stands today is little more than communism....we need total deregulation. Make strikes illegal. And privatise the NHS.
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Re: How close is The Labour Party to pure Communism today?

Post by Brian Peacock » Sun Aug 21, 2022 5:14 am

So a better world for you is one in which people have no rights, no say over their working conditions, and get by only on what a deregulated economy lets them have?

I apologise, you're not hankering for a return to the 'good old days' of the post WWII settlement, you're actually dreaming of returning society to the golden age of the late Regency/early Victorian era.
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"It isn't necessary to imagine the world ending in fire or ice.
There are two other possibilities: one is paperwork, and the other is nostalgia."

Frank Zappa

"This is how humanity ends; bickering over the irrelevant."
Clinton Huxley » 21 Jun 2012 » 14:10:36 GMT
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