Energy problems before we solve green energy

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Tero
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Re: Energy problems before we solve green energy

Post by Tero » Sat Jun 11, 2022 7:25 pm

2C25D589-DAAE-4603-B340-7E6B76345D52.jpeg
Fracking was only ever a short term solution. Tar sands a little longer, but it makes crap diesel fuel.
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Re: Energy problems before we solve green energy

Post by Tero » Mon Jun 27, 2022 10:36 am

Scarcity of oil will cause prices to go up and down like now for the rest of the time we run on oil. Coal prices stable. Running electric cars on power produced by coal would get us about the same emissions without all the drilling.

At http://www.internationalskeptics.com/fo ... 50&page=15
RE: oil prices and domestic production.

Another aspect of this is we can't have it both ways. The financing and economics of extraction only work when the price is high. As soon as prices fall to a level consumers are satisfied with, the ROI of domestic extraction falls apart. The Bakken play (Dakotas) is a premier example of this. The price rises, work on wells begins, billions are spent, the price falls, more money is spent capping and securing them, sidelining equipment and handing workers pink slips (but still having to pay unemployment). Lather, rinse, repeat. OPEC has played this masterfully for over a decade now. Not because they are evil, foreign, mustache twirling villains, but because it's business.

The enthusiasm to "drill, baby, drill" just means we're blowing money on developing a dying resource. Many of such fields may never reach significant production before renewables replace them and they are nothing nut a niche product. Speaking of which, another aspect of OPEC's long-term outplaying of these companies is that they are pouring a great deal of their profits into R&D of renewables and desalination. So once they've exhausted their own supply (and we've burned it and thrown it into the atmosphere), they'll be holding the patents and happily license them for a fee. They are frustrating and delaying their rivals' production (as repeatedly stated by others, of a product not suited for American automobiles anyways) until that very resource has become pointless and they have foothold on the market that replaces it.

It's shrewd, it's deviously calculated, and it's working. But it's also hardly unique in a capitalist world.
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Said Peter...what you're requesting just isn't my bag
Said Daemon, who's sorry too, but y'see we didn't have no choice
And our hands they are many and we'd be of one voice
We've come all the way from Wigan to get up and state
Our case for survival before it's too late

Turn stone to bread, said Daemon Duncetan
Turn stone to bread right away...

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Re: Energy problems before we solve green energy

Post by Brian Peacock » Tue Jun 28, 2022 4:24 pm

The crude oil supply isn't scarce btw - but it has been made more insecure by the Ukraine war.
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Clinton Huxley » 21 Jun 2012 » 14:10:36 GMT
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Re: Energy problems before we solve green energy

Post by Tero » Mon Jul 18, 2022 12:30 pm

NYT
Executive action
After Manchin seemed to doom the climate legislation last week, Biden vowed to “take strong executive action to meet this moment.” His authority is much narrower than it would be if Congress passed new legislation, especially given the current Supreme Court’s hostility to many kinds of environmental regulation. But Biden does have several tools he can use.

Among them:

He has directed the E.P.A. to write new rules to reduce pollution from vehicles — the nation’s largest source of planet-warming pollution — and accelerate the transition to electric vehicles.
Even with the recent Supreme Court ruling, the E.P.A. still has the authority to issue narrow rules that would affect coal-and-gas-fired power plants, the second-largest source of greenhouse gas emissions.
The E.P.A. also plans to issue regulations this year to curb leaks of methane from oil and gas wells, another significant source of greenhouse gases.
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Said Peter...what you're requesting just isn't my bag
Said Daemon, who's sorry too, but y'see we didn't have no choice
And our hands they are many and we'd be of one voice
We've come all the way from Wigan to get up and state
Our case for survival before it's too late

Turn stone to bread, said Daemon Duncetan
Turn stone to bread right away...

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Re: Energy problems before we solve green energy

Post by Brian Peacock » Mon Jul 18, 2022 6:04 pm

The nation's largest source of planet-warming pollution is the Combined Armed Services of the United States of America, then it's oil and gas production, and then it's probably all the hot air fascists, racists, and misogynists emit about State's Rights, how Black folks should take the bus if they don't want to get shot in the face by traffic cops, and how a incest rape baby is actually a gift from god etc.
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There are two other possibilities: one is paperwork, and the other is nostalgia."

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"This is how humanity ends; bickering over the irrelevant."
Clinton Huxley » 21 Jun 2012 » 14:10:36 GMT
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Re: Energy problems before we solve green energy

Post by Tero » Wed Sep 14, 2022 11:55 am

Manchin is squeezing relaxed fossil fuel permits after bill already passed:
CNN
"If [Manchin's] complaining about how environmental laws have stood in the way of some of his favorite pipelines and fossil fuel projects, there's a reason for that," Huffman said. "I think we are trying to speak really clearly in support of a clean CR. It's hard to accept a clean CR for everyone except Joe Manchin."

Progressive Sen. Bernie Sanders stopped short of calling on House progressives to vote against a stop-gap spending bill if permitting reform is attached.
https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2022/09/13/poli ... index.html
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Said Peter...what you're requesting just isn't my bag
Said Daemon, who's sorry too, but y'see we didn't have no choice
And our hands they are many and we'd be of one voice
We've come all the way from Wigan to get up and state
Our case for survival before it's too late

Turn stone to bread, said Daemon Duncetan
Turn stone to bread right away...

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Re: Energy problems before we solve green energy

Post by Brian Peacock » Thu Sep 15, 2022 7:31 am

CR?
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"It isn't necessary to imagine the world ending in fire or ice.
There are two other possibilities: one is paperwork, and the other is nostalgia."

Frank Zappa

"This is how humanity ends; bickering over the irrelevant."
Clinton Huxley » 21 Jun 2012 » 14:10:36 GMT
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Re: Energy problems before we solve green energy

Post by Tero » Thu Sep 15, 2022 10:52 am

Continuing Resolution.
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Said Peter...what you're requesting just isn't my bag
Said Daemon, who's sorry too, but y'see we didn't have no choice
And our hands they are many and we'd be of one voice
We've come all the way from Wigan to get up and state
Our case for survival before it's too late

Turn stone to bread, said Daemon Duncetan
Turn stone to bread right away...

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Re: Energy problems before we solve green energy

Post by Tero » Wed Oct 26, 2022 12:13 am

https://esapolitics.blogspot.com
http://esabirdsne.blogspot.com/
Said Peter...what you're requesting just isn't my bag
Said Daemon, who's sorry too, but y'see we didn't have no choice
And our hands they are many and we'd be of one voice
We've come all the way from Wigan to get up and state
Our case for survival before it's too late

Turn stone to bread, said Daemon Duncetan
Turn stone to bread right away...

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Re: Energy problems before we solve green energy

Post by Brian Peacock » Wed Oct 26, 2022 12:56 am

ibid wrote:...In 2021, the share of renewable energy increased worldwide by 8 percent and now accounts for almost one-third of annual global electricity consumption. China, India, the U.S. and the EU are all making progress, but there are major hurdles that prevent us from relying solely on these power sources.

For one, wind and solar energy are intermittent. We currently do not have the ability to effectively store surplus electricity from these sources for distribution on overcast and windless days.

For another, power grids were designed for a steady supply of electricity to avoid power blackouts. This is why natural gas, which burns cleaner than other fossil fuels, is an important part of the solution as a reliable complement to renewable energy...
I'd take issue with that assumption - and much else in the PR handout masquerading as objective journalism.
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"It isn't necessary to imagine the world ending in fire or ice.
There are two other possibilities: one is paperwork, and the other is nostalgia."

Frank Zappa

"This is how humanity ends; bickering over the irrelevant."
Clinton Huxley » 21 Jun 2012 » 14:10:36 GMT
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Re: Energy problems before we solve green energy

Post by Svartalf » Wed Oct 26, 2022 2:13 am

anybody describing wind and solar as renewable is talking bovine crap, because the tech needed to take advantage of those certainly uses a lot of nonrenewable stuff, some of which are likely to become significantly rarer even before those technologies even hit cruising speed.
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Re: Energy problems before we solve green energy

Post by Tero » Thu Oct 27, 2022 12:17 pm

Wind energy uses no special materials. The blades are fiberglass. The generator is a...generator.
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http://esabirdsne.blogspot.com/
Said Peter...what you're requesting just isn't my bag
Said Daemon, who's sorry too, but y'see we didn't have no choice
And our hands they are many and we'd be of one voice
We've come all the way from Wigan to get up and state
Our case for survival before it's too late

Turn stone to bread, said Daemon Duncetan
Turn stone to bread right away...

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Re: Energy problems before we solve green energy

Post by macdoc » Thu Oct 27, 2022 1:41 pm

40 year lifespan on solar panels - aluminum and glass..some don't seem to understand the world.
Too much smoking cow dung I guess. :smoke:

And both have hit "cruising speed" with solar the cheapest form of energy.
Wind and solar reached a 10.2% share of power generation in 2021, which was the first time wind and solar power exceeded more than 10% of global generation. Nuclear consumption grew in 2021 by 4.2% to the highest level since 2006.
Inform yourself .... :bored:
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Re: Energy problems before we solve green energy

Post by Tero » Thu Oct 27, 2022 3:33 pm

Fairy electrons!
https://esapolitics.blogspot.com
http://esabirdsne.blogspot.com/
Said Peter...what you're requesting just isn't my bag
Said Daemon, who's sorry too, but y'see we didn't have no choice
And our hands they are many and we'd be of one voice
We've come all the way from Wigan to get up and state
Our case for survival before it's too late

Turn stone to bread, said Daemon Duncetan
Turn stone to bread right away...

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Tero
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Re: Energy problems before we solve green energy

Post by Tero » Wed Nov 02, 2022 6:59 pm

Oil industry definitely not hurting. But deserves credit for pulling outcof Russia.
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Said Peter...what you're requesting just isn't my bag
Said Daemon, who's sorry too, but y'see we didn't have no choice
And our hands they are many and we'd be of one voice
We've come all the way from Wigan to get up and state
Our case for survival before it's too late

Turn stone to bread, said Daemon Duncetan
Turn stone to bread right away...

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