The Coronavirus Thread

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Re: The Coronavirus Thread

Post by Brian Peacock » Thu Dec 02, 2021 8:10 am

The O-variant accounted for 74% of Covid genomes sequenced in South Africa during November.

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Re: The Coronavirus Thread

Post by JimC » Thu Dec 02, 2021 8:29 am

We must remember that in terms of natural selection the real enemies of any particular covid variant are other variants, competing for our delicious bodies...
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Re: The Coronavirus Thread

Post by Tero » Thu Dec 02, 2021 1:02 pm

Vaccine (regular kind) has components that confuse immune system.
https://www.bbc.com/news/health-59418123.amp
the virus is likely to do the same. To avoid both you would need to completely isolate.
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Re: The Coronavirus Thread

Post by Tero » Thu Dec 02, 2021 1:05 pm

That vaccine uses a harmless vector and produces the spike protein of fancier vaccines:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oxford– ... 19_vaccine
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Re: The Coronavirus Thread

Post by Scot Dutchy » Thu Dec 02, 2021 1:56 pm

Sense is starting to prevail.

EU must consider mandatory Covid jabs, says Von der Leyen
European Commission president says EU states need to discuss idea in response to spread of Omicron variant

The EU must consider mandatory vaccination in response to the spread of the “highly contagious” Omicron Covid variant across Europe, the European Commission president has said.

In a call to action, Ursula von der Leyen said the EU’s 27 member states should rapidly deploy booster doses and a commission communique backed countries opting to temporarily enforce pre-travel PCR tests even within the bloc’s borders.

There have been a total of 59 identified cases in the EU of the Omicron variant all of which have involved mild symptoms or been asymptomatic.

Asked whether she supported the Greek government in its imposition of a €100 (£85) monthly fine on those aged 60 and over who failed to get a Covid jab, Von der Leyen said the spread of the disease and lack of vaccine take-up in parts of the EU meant mandatory vaccination had to be on the table as a policy response.
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Re: The Coronavirus Thread

Post by JimC » Thu Dec 02, 2021 8:18 pm

"Mandatory" is complex, in the sense that the devil will be in the detail. Virtually everyone accepts that it is mandatory to have a driver's licence to get behind the wheel, and that if you are caught driving without one, you cop a hefty fine.

Even in the pro-vaccine part of the population (a large majority), there would be many who would not accept something similar for vaccination, unless it was only mandatory to be vaccinated in specific places, situations and occupations, but not mandatory in general life. After all, no one demands that you have a driver's licence if you decide that you are not going to drive...
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Re: The Coronavirus Thread

Post by Joe » Thu Dec 02, 2021 8:31 pm

Yeah, here in the US there is a generally assumed exemption for religious and medical reasons.
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Re: The Coronavirus Thread

Post by macdoc » Thu Dec 02, 2021 8:49 pm

Hammer comes down in Germany

https://edition.cnn.com/2021/12/02/euro ... index.html

The vaccination tracing it is linked to contact tracing here ....no sign in ....no service.

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Re: The Coronavirus Thread

Post by Scot Dutchy » Fri Dec 03, 2021 12:58 am

JimC wrote:
Thu Dec 02, 2021 8:18 pm
"Mandatory" is complex, in the sense that the devil will be in the detail. Virtually everyone accepts that it is mandatory to have a driver's licence to get behind the wheel, and that if you are caught driving without one, you cop a hefty fine.

Even in the pro-vaccine part of the population (a large majority), there would be many who would not accept something similar for vaccination, unless it was only mandatory to be vaccinated in specific places, situations and occupations, but not mandatory in general life. After all, no one demands that you have a driver's licence if you decide that you are not going to drive...
Do you have compulsory measles and polio vaccinations? We do as does many countries in Europe. The driving licence thingy is not a good comparison. Not having a licence has no influence on the rest of society.
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Re: The Coronavirus Thread

Post by JimC » Fri Dec 03, 2021 2:26 am

Scot Dutchy wrote:
Fri Dec 03, 2021 12:58 am
JimC wrote:
Thu Dec 02, 2021 8:18 pm
"Mandatory" is complex, in the sense that the devil will be in the detail. Virtually everyone accepts that it is mandatory to have a driver's licence to get behind the wheel, and that if you are caught driving without one, you cop a hefty fine.

Even in the pro-vaccine part of the population (a large majority), there would be many who would not accept something similar for vaccination, unless it was only mandatory to be vaccinated in specific places, situations and occupations, but not mandatory in general life. After all, no one demands that you have a driver's licence if you decide that you are not going to drive...
Do you have compulsory measles and polio vaccinations? We do as does many countries in Europe. The driving licence thingy is not a good comparison. Not having a licence has no influence on the rest of society.
Sure, there have always been childhood vaccinations, strongly recommended, but not compulsory in the sense of forcing parents to get their children vaccinated. There are only a tiny minority who don't, and those kids cannot attend childcare centres...

Driving without a licence certainly does have a potential impact - such people are likely to be untrained, poor drivers who might kill others on the road. It is only if you have no intention of ever driving that has no impact on society. If an unvaccinated person is prepared to be a hermit, not able to take part in social activities or work with others, then they too have no real impact...

You would know from my other posts that I'm strongly in favour of getting as many people vaccinated as possible, and I'm perfectly happy to see serious restrictions on jobs and social activities for the refuseniks. But I would stop short of forcible vaccination, and fines for non-compliance.
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Re: The Coronavirus Thread

Post by pErvinalia » Fri Dec 03, 2021 2:46 am

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Re: The Coronavirus Thread

Post by Scot Dutchy » Fri Dec 03, 2021 10:43 am

Well plenty dont agree with Jim. The Germans and Austrians have already moved and the demand in France, Belgium and Italy is increasing. Greece has also gone down the mandatory road.
It is the religious idiots that are fighting against. Most unvaccinated muslims just simply dont understand and within a week of having special social teams moving into their districts the numbers went up by 6-10%.
A large part of the anti-vax movement is based on ignorance and the wild stories on social media.
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Re: The Coronavirus Thread

Post by JimC » Fri Dec 03, 2021 8:02 pm

Scot Dutchy wrote:
Fri Dec 03, 2021 10:43 am
Well plenty dont agree with Jim. The Germans and Austrians have already moved and the demand in France, Belgium and Italy is increasing. Greece has also gone down the mandatory road.
It is the religious idiots that are fighting against. Most unvaccinated muslims just simply dont understand and within a week of having special social teams moving into their districts the numbers went up by 6-10%.
A large part of the anti-vax movement is based on ignorance and the wild stories on social media.
Your last points are really suggesting (and I agree) that a determined effort to educate ethnic or religious minorities, in their own language and by respected members of their communities is the way to go. When done here with sufficient resources, it has been effective too...
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Re: The Coronavirus Thread

Post by Brian Peacock » Fri Dec 03, 2021 8:22 pm

I think we have to recognise that in any mandatory vaccination protocol or system there will be people who need to be exempted. I mention this only because I detect a general tendency in the media to demonise the unvaccinated and to blame them for the infection rate - particularly in light of the emergence of the Omicron variant. Given the nature of the virus, and that vaccinated people can still become infectious, we also have to acknowledge that the vaccinations aren't a cure, aren't a virus killer, but instead are a general prophylaxis against the consequence of severe infection within the population. Vaccinated people are still contracting Covid and are still needing medical intervention, and unfortunately vaccinated people are still dying from Covid too. As the vaccinated proportion of the population increases so will the proportion of vaccinated people needing that medical intervention and, alas, dying from the effects of the disease. Those who are advised by medics not to have the vaccines need to be supported, as should those clinically extremely vulnerable people who it remains sensible to shield even if they and their immediate families have had their jabs.
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Clinton Huxley » 21 Jun 2012 » 14:10:36 GMT
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Re: The Coronavirus Thread

Post by Brian Peacock » Fri Dec 03, 2021 8:30 pm

Seems that some people would give their right arm to avoid being vaccinated...
Italian Anti-vaxxer Tries To Get COVID Jab In Fake Arm To Obtain 'Vaccine Passport'

As Italy tightens its COVID-19 measures for the country's unvaccinated population, an Italian man turned up at a vaccination centre wearing a fake arm made of silicone, hoping to bluff a medical practitioner into jabbing him. The anti-vaxxer got caught after a health worker suspiciously touched the silicone and asked him to roll up his sleeves. However, the man started begging the nurse to provide him with a vaccination passport, reported The Mirror.

The incident was immediately reported to local authorities, and the man is likely to face critical charges. The unidentified man was also interviewed before he unveiled his fake arm. He also signed a consent form in front of the doctor. After Italy tightened COVID-19 restrictions, unvaccinated people are not allowed to move outside freely....

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Clinton Huxley » 21 Jun 2012 » 14:10:36 GMT
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