Celebrity Sexual Harassment Charge Sheet

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Re: Celebrity Sexual Harassment Charge Sheet

Post by Brian Peacock » Fri Nov 17, 2017 1:25 pm

Forty Two wrote:
Brian Peacock wrote:What? But it's just a touch on the knee. Why is everybody so quick to tell boys and girls that such trivial actions are worthy of being categorised as sexual harassment? Norma really needs to chill out and get proper perspective on this.
Indeed, because if that's all that she reports happened, then it's a big nothing.

The reason more facts are needed is because we don't know if he's referring to studying or something else. My dad used to tell me all that time that I knew what I had to do to pass a test or do well in school. Do my homework and study.

Someone who says "he told me I knew what I needed to do to pass that test," and "I felt uncomfortable because I think he meant something sexual" is not giving enough information to conclude it was about sex.
Yeah. Norma probably just misread the signs and misinterpreted the situation. It wasn't creepy, it was just a touch on the knee. I mean, if we ask Dad and Harry if they were being creepy blowjob hunters they're bound to say "No" aren't they? As I said, Norma just needs to chill out and stop assuming men are being creepy when they're just being, well, you know, men.
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Clinton Huxley » 21 Jun 2012 » 14:10:36 GMT
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Re: Celebrity Sexual Harassment Charge Sheet

Post by Forty Two » Fri Nov 17, 2017 1:52 pm

It's not about "probably." She MIGHT have misread the signs, because people misread each other's intentions and meanings from time-to-time. I do, and you do. Women are no less likely to do so.

It may have been creepy, but FROM THE INFORMATION PRESENTED we cannot conclude that it was sexual harassment, or even that it was, in fact, creepy.

In the example Hermit gave, Norma doesn't even allege that it was creepy or sexual harassment. All she says is that her father told her she knew what she needed to do to pass the test. There was no suggestion in the facts presented that the communication was creepy or sexual, or even that Norma took it that way. If you took it that way, that's your inference of things not alluded to in the text.

What do you think the "dad" is suggesting? That if his daughter engages in sex, that's how she'll do well on the test? How does that even make sense? He doesn't grade her test. And, do we assume that when a father talks to their kid about what they need to do to pass tests that they are creepily alluding to sexual favors?

And, when I said that the facts given were insufficient, your reply was sarcasm -- Norma probably just misread the signs and misinterpreted the situation, it wasn't creepy, ti was just a touch on the knee." Well, again, I did not say "probably" anything. But, it is plausible that Norma, like any other human being, did misread signs and misinterpreted the situation. It is possible that it was not creepy, and was just a touch on the knee. Interestingly, in the fact pattern presented Norma does not say how she interpreted the situation, and she did not say it was creepy, and she did not say that she felt uncomfortable or that she thought her father was implying something untoward at all. Think about it - you added that.
“When I was in college, I took a terrorism class. ... The thing that was interesting in the class was every time the professor said ‘Al Qaeda’ his shoulders went up, But you know, it is that you don’t say ‘America’ with an intensity, you don’t say ‘England’ with the intensity. You don’t say ‘the army’ with the intensity,” she continued. “... But you say these names [Al Qaeda] because you want that word to carry weight. You want it to be something.” - Ilhan Omar

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Re: Celebrity Sexual Harassment Charge Sheet

Post by Animavore » Fri Nov 17, 2017 1:55 pm

Stallone now.
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Re: Celebrity Sexual Harassment Charge Sheet

Post by JimC » Fri Nov 17, 2017 9:32 pm

42, I suppose that it's possible, in a starlet/director conversation, a touch on the knee and a comment about knowing what you need to do to get the gig might be perfectly innocent...

In fantasy land...
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Re: Celebrity Sexual Harassment Charge Sheet

Post by Forty Two » Fri Nov 17, 2017 10:57 pm

It all depends on the context of the statement. With only two lines of facts, we fill in all the blanks ourselves, wth our presupposition that the director is a man (which was not stated in the facts) and that the director put his hand there in a way and with a tone of voice that indicated some sort of sexual implication.

What if the director were a woman, and the starlet was crying about how she doesn't know how she's going to make it, and the director patted her knee "there there" you can do it - you know what you have to do to get this gig - do it. And, what she's referring to is "going out there to that audition and knocking 'em dead." I think it's even conceivable that a male director had that kind of conversation with a female starlet.

I think that there are many times people touch each other in general conversation and interaction. There are many things we say to each other on a daily basis that, if couched in terms of appropriateness, and presented in a dry, literal fashion, would seem improper.

So, no, I won't say that it's "fantasy land" that a touch on the knee and that comment might be perfectly innocent. It might. And, of course, there are many ways that such a scenario could be perfectly non-innocent as well. I'm not here suggesting that people reporting these instances are all full of it. Not at all. All I'm doing is the absolute bare minimum of analysis of the facts presented. I'm not imposing some severe burdenn - all I'm doing is asking what, exactly, happened. To me, someone saying that he said "X" and touched my knee and I feel uncomfortable, is not enough.

That's what I'm doing, also, with the Al Franken accusation. I see a woman saying she was "groped" by Al Franken, and the only example she points to is an image where Al Franken is not groping her, but pretending to grope her. He's clearly making a joke, which a lot of people find is inappropriate. But, he wasn't leeringly fondling her - he was joking around. He was a comedian. And, the issue of him kissing her - that was part of a comedy thing with the USO tour. Excuse me, I need more than the public descriptions we've seen so far. Otherwise, I don't see much there to go on.
“When I was in college, I took a terrorism class. ... The thing that was interesting in the class was every time the professor said ‘Al Qaeda’ his shoulders went up, But you know, it is that you don’t say ‘America’ with an intensity, you don’t say ‘England’ with the intensity. You don’t say ‘the army’ with the intensity,” she continued. “... But you say these names [Al Qaeda] because you want that word to carry weight. You want it to be something.” - Ilhan Omar

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Re: Celebrity Sexual Harassment Charge Sheet

Post by Brian Peacock » Fri Nov 17, 2017 11:05 pm

Forty Two wrote:It all depends on the context of the statement. With only two lines of facts, we fill in all the blanks ourselves, wth our presupposition that the director is a man (which was not stated in the facts) and that the director put his hand there in a way and with a tone of voice that indicated some sort of sexual implication....
And if the starlet says that when the director touched her knee she was fully aware of the so-called trivial action's implicit meaning, that he was being creepy, that he was trying it on, is that a fact as well?
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Clinton Huxley » 21 Jun 2012 » 14:10:36 GMT
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Re: Celebrity Sexual Harassment Charge Sheet

Post by Brian Peacock » Sun Nov 19, 2017 12:00 pm

Aled Jones off air after claim of inappropriate behaviour

https://www.theguardian.com/media/2017/ ... _clipboard

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Clinton Huxley » 21 Jun 2012 » 14:10:36 GMT
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Re: Celebrity Sexual Harassment Charge Sheet

Post by mistermack » Sun Nov 19, 2017 12:08 pm

I've had girls SIT on my knee, but they wouldn't let me fuck em.

And when I was 18, a lovely big blond sat ME on her knee, while her (pro wrestler) boyfriend glared at us and I went red.

It doesn't always mean you're offering a shag.
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Re: Celebrity Sexual Harassment Charge Sheet

Post by Hermit » Sun Nov 19, 2017 12:15 pm

Forty Two wrote:
Hermit wrote:
Forty Two wrote:Yes - however, sexual harassment is not purely subjective. It has a subjective and objective component.

It is objective, in that the conduct must be itself harassing and based on sex.
Norma: "Dad, I want to pass my maths test."
Dad, touching Norma's knee: "Norma, you know what to do to get that pass, don't you?"

Norma: "Harry, I really want that rôle"
Harry Cohn, touching Norma's knee: "Norma, you know what to do to get that rôle, don't you?"
Exactly - subjective and objective components.
The action and the words are objective - and near enough to identical for the purpose of this discussion. The context in each scenario is also objective, and the difference in context gives the objectively (near)identical words and actions an objectively different significance, assuming that dad is not hinting at having some sexual interaction with his child, of course.
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Re: Celebrity Sexual Harassment Charge Sheet

Post by mistermack » Sun Nov 19, 2017 6:28 pm

I suppose one of these days even grabbing them by the pussy will be considered abusive.

You couldn't make it up !
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Re: Celebrity Sexual Harassment Charge Sheet

Post by laklak » Sun Nov 19, 2017 7:38 pm

Lie down with dogs, get fleas. Lie down with Harvey, get a starring role. For the right film I'll suck his dick, I ain't proud, and I could use the dosh.
Yeah well that's just, like, your opinion, man.

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Re: Celebrity Sexual Harassment Charge Sheet

Post by mistermack » Sun Nov 19, 2017 8:28 pm

In the old days, women learned how to deal with cads :

While there is a market for shit, there will be assholes to supply it.

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Re: Celebrity Sexual Harassment Charge Sheet

Post by DRSB » Sun Nov 19, 2017 9:58 pm

Not sure which thread to post this in:
17 women have accused Donald Trump of sexual misconduct. It’s time to revisit those stories
https://qz.com/1130324/17-women-have-ac ... dea611c762

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Re: Celebrity Sexual Harassment Charge Sheet

Post by Brian Peacock » Sun Nov 19, 2017 10:33 pm

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Clinton Huxley » 21 Jun 2012 » 14:10:36 GMT
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Re: Celebrity Sexual Harassment Charge Sheet

Post by DRSB » Mon Nov 20, 2017 7:55 am

All the sickos so far: List: All of the Hollywood power players accused of sexual assault or harassment
https://www.usatoday.com/story/life/peo ... 827004001/

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