Goings-on in North Korea

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Seabass
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Re: Goings-on in North Korea

Post by Seabass » Fri Mar 16, 2018 9:23 pm

Hermit wrote:
Forty Two wrote:
Seabass wrote:And by the way, Hermit gave the correct interpretation. You gave the "alternative" interpretation—the one that supports the insane right-wing alternate reality perpetuated by all your favorite "news" sources like Infowars, Breitbart, Daily Caller, and "News Busters".
There's nothing to respond to.
You posted an outrageously quotemined piece, to which you then proceeded to add an absurd interpretation that does not even make sense after the question Clinton replied to was snipped. I called you out on that, and you now claim there's nothing to respond to? It looks to me that you're fleeing into a tanty in order to distract us from the fact that you can't find anything to defend your nonsense with.
I guess he's really just going to move on without acknowledging any error, huh... :hehe:

Honestly, I don't generally fault people for walking away from an argument after a few exchanges. At some point you have to agree to disagree and move on. But in this instance his error was so egregious, I kind of felt like a mea culpa was in order.
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Re: Goings-on in North Korea

Post by Forty Two » Wed Apr 18, 2018 2:47 pm

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nati ... story.html

This could be Trump's ticket to reelection. CIA director Pompeo met with Kim Jong Un over Easter weekend, and now the North and the South are set to announce an official end to the Korean War. https://www.cnbc.com/2018/04/17/north-a ... o-war.html

Trump projected a possible meeting in June between himself and Kim Jong Un.

If Trump can get an agreement to denuclearize Kim's regime, and reduce the tensions at the border, he will have a monumental achievement toward world peace to run on, and will have accomplished something few leaders in the world have accomplished in any other circumstances.

Wow.
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Re: Goings-on in North Korea

Post by Tero » Wed Apr 18, 2018 10:56 pm

Kim is ready to hear Trump’s plan to disarm SE Asia. The US has way too many missiles aimed at N Korea.

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Re: Goings-on in North Korea

Post by JimC » Wed Apr 18, 2018 11:32 pm

I suspect that the concessions Kim would demand would involve a reduction in US forces in East Asia, the western Pacific and South Korea in particular, which would be dangerous to concede, if the US still wants to be a dominant player in the Pacific.
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Re: Goings-on in North Korea

Post by Brian Peacock » Thu Apr 19, 2018 1:56 am

I'm sure Kim has a little list of suggestions his Chinese friends have impressed upon him too.
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Re: Goings-on in North Korea

Post by pErvinalia » Thu Apr 19, 2018 3:01 pm

Seabass wrote:
Hermit wrote:
Forty Two wrote:
Seabass wrote:And by the way, Hermit gave the correct interpretation. You gave the "alternative" interpretation—the one that supports the insane right-wing alternate reality perpetuated by all your favorite "news" sources like Infowars, Breitbart, Daily Caller, and "News Busters".
There's nothing to respond to.
You posted an outrageously quotemined piece, to which you then proceeded to add an absurd interpretation that does not even make sense after the question Clinton replied to was snipped. I called you out on that, and you now claim there's nothing to respond to? It looks to me that you're fleeing into a tanty in order to distract us from the fact that you can't find anything to defend your nonsense with.
I guess he's really just going to move on without acknowledging any error, huh... :hehe:
Yep. :sigh:
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Re: Goings-on in North Korea

Post by laklak » Thu Apr 19, 2018 3:52 pm

Cage Match to the death. That's the only way to make sure.
Yeah well that's just, like, your opinion, man.

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Re: Goings-on in North Korea

Post by pErvinalia » Thu Apr 19, 2018 4:02 pm

I hope they accidentally kill each other.

I've got to admit, I'm fascinated by this whole thing. There's such a large possibility that Trump will fuck this up spectacularly.
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Re: Goings-on in North Korea

Post by Forty Two » Thu Apr 19, 2018 5:17 pm

JimC wrote:I suspect that the concessions Kim would demand would involve a reduction in US forces in East Asia, the western Pacific and South Korea in particular, which would be dangerous to concede, if the US still wants to be a dominant player in the Pacific.
Kim won't be able to demand concessions as to our presence in the Pacific region. The US doesn't concede to anyone the right to restrict our presence on the high seas.

Now, our presence on the peninsula, that is where there is a deal to be made. Because the US wants a reduction. A lot of South Koreans want the US forces reduced or out of there. And, there is good benefit to the US if we could draw down that force.
“When I was in college, I took a terrorism class. ... The thing that was interesting in the class was every time the professor said ‘Al Qaeda’ his shoulders went up, But you know, it is that you don’t say ‘America’ with an intensity, you don’t say ‘England’ with the intensity. You don’t say ‘the army’ with the intensity,” she continued. “... But you say these names [Al Qaeda] because you want that word to carry weight. You want it to be something.” - Ilhan Omar

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Re: Goings-on in North Korea

Post by mistermack » Thu Apr 19, 2018 7:46 pm

Those two loonies speak the same language so maybe they can do a deal.

What would you do if you were Kim? Is he really living a good life, bossing that shithole?
He could take a few billion and get the fuck out of there, and reunite the country.
Live the life of a billionaire in safety, or worry every day that someone will bump you off?
I'd take the money and run.
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Re: Goings-on in North Korea

Post by Tero » Thu Apr 19, 2018 8:01 pm

Avcording to Wiki, there are no nukes to disarm in South:
In 1991, President George H W Bush announced the withdrawal of all naval and land-based tactical nuclear weapons deployed abroad, including approximately 100 such weapons based in South Korea.[18] In December 1991, the governments of North and South Korea signed a Joint Declaration on the Denuclearization of the Korean Peninsula, and in January 1992, the North concluded a comprehensive safeguards agreement with the IAEA.

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Re: Goings-on in North Korea

Post by Tero » Thu Apr 19, 2018 9:30 pm

Kim still wants to remove the nukes daddy Bush already took out.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/ ... says-seoul

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Re: Goings-on in North Korea

Post by JimC » Thu Apr 19, 2018 9:45 pm

Forty Two wrote:
JimC wrote:I suspect that the concessions Kim would demand would involve a reduction in US forces in East Asia, the western Pacific and South Korea in particular, which would be dangerous to concede, if the US still wants to be a dominant player in the Pacific.
Kim won't be able to demand concessions as to our presence in the Pacific region. The US doesn't concede to anyone the right to restrict our presence on the high seas.

Now, our presence on the peninsula, that is where there is a deal to be made. Because the US wants a reduction. A lot of South Koreans want the US forces reduced or out of there. And, there is good benefit to the US if we could draw down that force.
He can't realistically gain any "de-nuclearisation, given that the US doesn't have (I gather) any land-based nukes in SK, but has many missile subs as close as required...

If he gains major US troop reductions in SK, perhaps he might even fancy his chances at an invasion...
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Re: Goings-on in North Korea

Post by Forty Two » Fri Apr 20, 2018 1:26 pm

The North won't invade the South unprovoked. The only way the North invades the south is if they think they are faced with an fairly imminent existential threat -- i.e. if Kim were convinced he and his regime were going to be taken out, he'd set the whole thing on fire - it would be his last hope. But, the North, as big as their army is, does not have the means to invade and hold South Korea or even a significant part of it. They can destroy a lot of stuff and kill a lot of people, but they can't take and hold cities. Their military is hungry, and they would run out of supplies quickly.

What Kim needs is a compromise. He's solidified his rule, and he has shown his people that he can bring the US to the table and was able to develop the powerful nukes. So, we give him that PR victory, ratchet down the heat, withdraw most US forces, and communicate that we aren't going to try to take him down, and at the same time he dismantles his nukes.
“When I was in college, I took a terrorism class. ... The thing that was interesting in the class was every time the professor said ‘Al Qaeda’ his shoulders went up, But you know, it is that you don’t say ‘America’ with an intensity, you don’t say ‘England’ with the intensity. You don’t say ‘the army’ with the intensity,” she continued. “... But you say these names [Al Qaeda] because you want that word to carry weight. You want it to be something.” - Ilhan Omar

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Re: Goings-on in North Korea

Post by JimC » Fri Apr 20, 2018 9:37 pm

You may be right about the invasion scenario (I hope you are), but I think you are being overly optimistic about the likely outcome of any talks...
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