The US Healthcare Mass Debate

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Seth
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Re: Trumpcare

Post by Seth » Fri Mar 17, 2017 9:16 pm

Tero wrote:That's how taxes work, seth. Tax the rich. Our only tool.
No, Tero, that's how thieves work.

Taxes pay for your fair share of what you use by way of government services or infrastructure and only that.

Everything else is theft by the Marxists of the world.
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pErvinalia
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Re: Trumpcare

Post by pErvinalia » Fri Mar 17, 2017 9:22 pm

Seth wrote:
pErvin wrote:
Tyrannical wrote:Want affordable health care for all Americans?

A good start is kicking out all the "poor" illegals and their anchor babies. Don't care how "hard" or "hardly" :hehe: they work, what ever it is doesn't come close to paying enough taxes for the benefits they consume.

Does it really take a rocket scientist to figure out that the country will be richer as a whole when you can kick out 10-20 million parasites?
How do illegals get benefits? Wouldn't the very fact that they are illegal preclude them from getting benefits?
It's supposed to, but for the last 8 years Obama ignored the laws prohibiting them from doing so.
So Obama personally gives them welfare cheques? :roll:
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Tero
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Re: Trumpcare

Post by Tero » Fri Mar 17, 2017 9:53 pm

You say thief I say it's democracy.

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Re: Trumpcare

Post by Tero » Sun Mar 19, 2017 3:40 am

Pence takes terrible Trump-don't-care nightmare to Florida
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/03 ... 6-win.html

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Re: Trumpcare

Post by Tyrannical » Sun Mar 19, 2017 4:03 am

Tero wrote:You say thief I say it's democracy.
I say Republic. You can take your mob rule and..........
A rational skeptic should be able to discuss and debate anything, no matter how much they may personally disagree with that point of view. Discussing a subject is not agreeing with it, but understanding it.

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Re: Trumpcare

Post by Brian Peacock » Sun Mar 19, 2017 8:39 am

Seth wrote:
Tero wrote:That's how taxes work, seth. Tax the rich. Our only tool.
No, Tero, that's how thieves work.

Taxes pay for your fair share of what you use by way of government services or infrastructure and only that.

Everything else is theft by the Marxists of the world.
This is by no means an uncommon trope in right of centre politics; the notion of an inherent deficit in fairness when it comes to taxation. However, while this might be promoted as a common concern or a criticism about monies being gathered and spent on something that does not benefit the well being of the general population and, therefore, merely represents a tool by which government supports and/or enlarges its own scope and reach, when one drills down into individual issues one invariably encounters the base position that it is illegitimate for a government to distribute revenues on something that the individual doesn't (or shouldn't) personally approve of.

Whether it be funding Lesbian theatre groups, trips to the seaside for children in remand centres, or benefits for people you have been told aren't really disabled, a sense of indignation and even OUTRAGE is engendered in and by people who confuse government spending with household expenditure: "If they're spending my taxes on so-called diversity training for liberal yoghurt knitters that's less money to spend on me and my kind."

It's curious to note that this kind of manufactured indignation rarely extends to government expenditure which supports company share prices or the offsetting of a bank's tax liabilities against employee bonuses and executive expenses.
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Tero
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Re: Trumpcare

Post by Tero » Wed Mar 22, 2017 1:51 pm

CNN
A fractured health system
One of the main failings, these experts believe, is the fragmented nature of American medicine. It's a problem Congress' debate doesn't address, they say. Doctors and researchers work in silos and are disincentivized to collaborate.
Most government health care and private insurance pay doctors per service. Volume, rather than value, of care gets rewarded more, the new reports argue.
"It is a model that has made all the wrong decisions in terms of caring for patients," said Sheila Burke, a member of the panel and an adjunct lecturer in public policy at the Malcolm Wiener Center for Social Policy at Harvard's John F. Kennedy School of Government.

http://www.cnn.com/2017/03/21/health/go ... index.html

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Re: Trumpcare

Post by Forty Two » Wed Mar 22, 2017 4:55 pm

Tero wrote:CNN
A fractured health system
One of the main failings, these experts believe, is the fragmented nature of American medicine. It's a problem Congress' debate doesn't address, they say. Doctors and researchers work in silos and are disincentivized to collaborate.
Most government health care and private insurance pay doctors per service. Volume, rather than value, of care gets rewarded more, the new reports argue.
"It is a model that has made all the wrong decisions in terms of caring for patients," said Sheila Burke, a member of the panel and an adjunct lecturer in public policy at the Malcolm Wiener Center for Social Policy at Harvard's John F. Kennedy School of Government.

http://www.cnn.com/2017/03/21/health/go ... index.html
Great! We have the solution! I am sure the Democrats will produce their minority plan which will remove the silos and incentivize collaboraton between doctors and researchers, and changes reimbursement to doctors so that it is based on value of care, and not per service. Where a doctor cures a patient, the reimbursement rate for radiation treatments and chemotherapy will be higher than where a doctor prescribes that and it fails.

I can't wait to see the draft bill.

Where's the Democrat's plan? I mean, we have a fractured healthcare system, and the Republicans have advanced what they think is a solution. All the Democrats are doing is bitching about it. Where's their plan? :hilarious:
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Re: Trumpcare

Post by Tero » Wed Mar 22, 2017 5:02 pm

The democrat plan is single payer. Bernie will get going Jan of 2019. And President Pence will sign it.

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Re: Trumpcare

Post by Forty Two » Wed Mar 22, 2017 6:05 pm

Tero wrote:The democrat plan is single payer.
LOL, really? When was that drafted and introduced in Congress? I guess when they were selling Obamacare partly on the express assurance that it was not a step toward single-payer, they were just fibbing.
Tero wrote: Bernie will get going Jan of 2019. And President Pence will sign it.
Bernie is going to retire to his new summer house. http://www.vanityfair.com/news/2016/08/ ... mmer-house

Socialism for thee, but not for me.
“When I was in college, I took a terrorism class. ... The thing that was interesting in the class was every time the professor said ‘Al Qaeda’ his shoulders went up, But you know, it is that you don’t say ‘America’ with an intensity, you don’t say ‘England’ with the intensity. You don’t say ‘the army’ with the intensity,” she continued. “... But you say these names [Al Qaeda] because you want that word to carry weight. You want it to be something.” - Ilhan Omar

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Re: Trumpcare

Post by Tero » Wed Mar 22, 2017 8:40 pm

There is no negotiating prices when you just buy insurance. The parties involved determine the price and send you a bill. If you have single payer, a good 20-30% of the customers will be in it. The clinics will appear, eventually, that match the price single payer is willing to pay for routine procedures. Your system never came up with competition pre Bush. Only groups can negotiate. You alone or you and 10 others cannot.
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Re: Trumpcare

Post by laklak » Wed Mar 22, 2017 8:41 pm

Bernie ain't never done shit, didn't do shit during the election, and ain't gonna do shit in the future. He's the most has-been of a has-been around. The only other has-been even close to Bern's has-beenness is Shillary. None of the Democrats gonna do shit other than ineffectually wail and gnash. There's this whole GOP House, Senate, and POTUS thingy, plus pretty soon a GOP SCOTUS.

Of course there's 2018, which I'm sure they're all ramping up for as we speak. Jesus, imagine that, elections are going to start a-fucking-gain. I don't think I can handle it. My liver is already shot to hell, one more political TV ad and I'll just melt into a puddle of metabolic alcohol by-products.
Yeah well that's just, like, your opinion, man.

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Re: Trumpcare

Post by Tero » Thu Mar 23, 2017 3:07 am

Completely useless insurance plans to return?
http://www.vox.com/2017/3/22/15030214/e ... nciliation

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Re: Trumpcare

Post by Tero » Thu Mar 23, 2017 3:13 pm

The GOP wants to take money from Medicare's trust fund and give it to the rich
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/won ... -the-rich/
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Turn stone to bread right away...

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Re: Trumpcare

Post by Tero » Fri Mar 24, 2017 12:23 am

Costs more gives less and adds to deficit:
The legislation to repeal major portions of Obamacare would reduce federal deficits by $150 billion over 10 years, according to the revised estimates. The original bill would have lowered the deficits by $337 billion.

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