Americans don't need tax havens

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Americans don't need tax havens

Post by Rum » Wed Apr 06, 2016 7:28 pm

Seems your filthy rich corporate free market exploiters have set up their own little schemes and can manage quite nicely without the help of Panama. No need for them to rub shoulders with the likes of Asad's cousin, our Prime Minister's father, to name a tiny fraction of the greedy bastards under the microscope right now. That's capitalism for you.

From the Beeb: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-35966612

Panama Papers: Where are the Americans?


The huge leak of documents from the Panamanian law firm Mossack Fonseca has revealed how tax havens are used to hide wealth.

It is the biggest leak in history, but many have questioned why only a few Americans have been implicated so far.

US news outlet Fusion, which was part of the International Consortium of Investigative Journalists (ICIJ) that revealed the files, said journalists were able to identify 211 people with addresses in the US who owned companies in the data. But it was not clear if all of them were US citizens.

Experts said more names could become clear as other files of the 11.5m leaked documents were examined. Americans seeking to avoid tax, they said, might prefer other well-known tax havens or US states with relaxed regulations.

Another reason could be that stricter US laws had made tax evasion more difficult for American citizens.


'Americans do not need to go far'

Laws in the US states of Delaware, Nevada and Wyoming have made it easy for corporations to create shell companies there to avoid higher taxes in their own states, experts say.

Foreign companies are also said to have taken advantage of these regulations.

Critics say these arrangements were responsible for transforming Delaware into an onshore version of the Cayman Islands, a well-known tax haven, according to a report by the New York Times.

Officials in Delaware said this comparison was "inaccurate".

But watchdog group Transparency International said the state was "synonymous" with "anonymous companies and ghost corporations", being "one of the most symbolic cases of corruption".

It is not only about Delaware. Prof Jason Sharman, at Griffith University in Nathan, Australia, told Reuters news agency in 2011: "Somalia has slightly higher standards than Wyoming and Nevada."

These two US states were among the many places Mossack Fonseca said it offered services.

Last year's Financial Secrecy Index, published by the Tax Justice Network, said a "failure to enact legislation that would require transparency and the exploitation of these gaps by private operators" made US states including Delaware, Nevada and Wyoming "leaders" in offshore secret incorporations.

William Sharp, from US-based Sharp Partners PA, said: "Forming a Nevada or Delaware limited liability company can be done overnight and typically with very little, if any, substantive operations. To the extent that Americans are looking for corporate confidentiality, Nevada and Delaware certainly provide that."

Delaware, Nevada and Wyoming have promised to crack down on secret business but so far no relevant measures have been taken, according to the Tax Justice Network.


'Nobody can crack through'

This is how the Tax Justice Network says the operation works. A businessman sets up a shell company in Delaware, for example, using a local company formation agent.

This local agent provides nominee officers and directors, typically lawyers, whose information, such as passport details, will become public.

But as the nominees are bound by attorney-client privilege not to reveal details, it is hard to get to the names of the real owners of that company, and they may well be another shell company.

"The company can run millions through its bank account but nobody - whether domestic or foreign law enforcement - can crack through that form of secrecy," the Tax Justice Network says.

How assets are hidden and taxes dodged


'They may go elsewhere'


Singapore skylineImage copyright Reuters
Image caption
Singapore would be one of the preferred options for Americans seeking to avoid taxes

A report by US website Politico suggested that Americans who wanted to avoid taxes preferred other places, like Bermuda, the Cayman Islands or Singapore, and not Panama.

These countries speak English, operate under a derivative of English common law and have political systems seen as more stable, it said.

"If there was a leak from Singapore, as opposed to Panama, which is what we have so far, we might find more [evasion]," Reuven Avi-Yonah, a law professor at the University of Michigan, told Politico.

He said estimates of the annual costs of illegal tax evasion for the US ranged from $20bn (£14bn) to $70bn.

However, Mr Sharp said US laws like the Foreign Account Tax Compliance Act (FATCA) and other cross-border initiatives had meant that the "tax evasion game [was] principally over for American taxpayers".

"The list of known countries used by Americans to evade taxes is growing shorter as the day grows longer," he said.


Panama Papers - tax havens of the rich and powerful exposed
◾Eleven million documents held by the Panama-based law firm Mossack Fonseca have been passed to German newspaper Sueddeutsche Zeitung, which then shared them with the International Consortium of Investigative Journalists. BBC Panorama and UK newspaper The Guardian are among 107 media organisations in 76 countries which have been analysing the documents. The BBC does not know the identity of the source
◾They show how the company has helped clients launder money, dodge sanctions and evade tax
◾Mossack Fonseca says it has operated beyond reproach for 40 years and never been accused or charged with criminal wrong-doing
◾Tricks of the trade: How assets are hidden and taxes evaded
◾Panama Papers: Full coverage; follow reaction on Twitter using #PanamaPapers; in the BBC News app, follow the tag "Panama Papers"
◾ Watch Panorama on the BBC iPlayer (UK viewers only)

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Re: Americans don't need tax havens

Post by pErvinalia » Thu Apr 07, 2016 12:01 am

Why do you hate freedum?!
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Re: Americans don't need tax havens

Post by piscator » Thu Apr 07, 2016 12:09 am

There's so few Americans because Hillary's ruinous Trade Bill brought American standards of financial reporting to Panama, at least WRT Americans.

So to put it in the Queen's English: It wasn't much of a fucking tax haven then, was it?

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Re: Americans don't need tax havens

Post by pErvinalia » Thu Apr 07, 2016 12:35 am

Sounds like they don't need it given those three states.

The other important thing to remember about this is that paying close to zero tax isn't a requirement to be involved in tax evasion. Paying ten percent corporate tax in Ireland while your country's corp tax rate is 30%, is still ethically tax evasion. There will be plenty of companies in the US using Ireland and other similar countries for tax minimisation purposes.
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Re: Americans don't need tax havens

Post by laklak » Thu Apr 07, 2016 12:48 am

I believe minimizing the amount of tax one pays is a moral imperative. It's for the government's own good, after all. You wouldn't let your child eat all the candy they wanted, with no oversight, would you? Of course not, what sort of shitty parent would you be then? Same is true with governments. They don't have fully developed brains and can't understand the consequences of their actions. NEVER let them eat as much tax as they want, they'll get bloated and end up with Type II Liarbetes. We wouldn't want that. Keep them on a reasonable diet, help them Just Say No to profligate spending and silly Foreign Adventurism. They'll thank you in the end.
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Re: Americans don't need tax havens

Post by piscator » Thu Apr 07, 2016 1:55 am

Yep. My business activities employ a shitload of people. Some dole-bandit bogan slapass on the other side of the planet has no business lecturing me on my business taxes. I already pay bookkeepers and accountants to do that.

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Re: Americans don't need tax havens

Post by Tyrannical » Thu Apr 07, 2016 3:12 am

From the names so far, there are very few from US/EU. Probably because they pick a law firm that's closer than Panama.
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Re: Americans don't need tax havens

Post by JimC » Thu Apr 07, 2016 5:55 am

The best way to avoid personal tax is to only accept payment in cash. Declare a certain amount, spend the rest on gin...
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Re: Americans don't need tax havens

Post by piscator » Thu Apr 07, 2016 11:57 am

For the benefit of all you Loyal Subjects of the Crown, Americans are entitled to pay as little in taxes as they are legally obliged to pay. Moreover, publicly funded corporations bear a legal responsibility to maximize earnings for shareholders.
If that means forming a Delaware or North Dakota corporation, or moving to Bahrain, then so be it.


Flip side of this is the De Beers Syndicate is classified a Criminal Organization in the US, as they violate American antitrust laws, and DeBeers executives are subject to arrest anywhere on US soil. There's no shortage of very legal diamonds and jewelers in the US, but De Beers as an entity is non grata.

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Re: Americans don't need tax havens

Post by pErvinalia » Thu Apr 07, 2016 12:03 pm

This isn't an argument about legality. What happens in Panama is generally legal in most countries. It's about the morality of it. And like all conservatives you'll find yourself on the wrong side of history yet again when this sort of theft is clamped down on.
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Re: Americans don't need tax havens

Post by Rum » Thu Apr 07, 2016 12:12 pm

So called 'aggressive tax avoidance' is being made illegal here. It is obviously, by its very nature, very complex, but people who hide their money in Russian doll style companies, within companies and so on will be on the receiving end of HMRC's spotlight - if of course they can be found.

It really is all about greed and taking all you can and not even paying up what is legally required.

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Re: Americans don't need tax havens

Post by pErvinalia » Thu Apr 07, 2016 12:15 pm

Taxes are theft. GIVE ME FREEDUM, OR GIVE ME DEATH!
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Re: Americans don't need tax havens

Post by Tero » Thu Apr 07, 2016 12:50 pm

Jim needs taxes. Oh, no, it was just taxis. After the gin. Never mind.

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Re: Americans don't need tax havens

Post by laklak » Thu Apr 07, 2016 1:22 pm

We need to move towards more user fees and fewer general taxes. For example, each U.S. soldier should be equipped with a credit card reader. When the Saudis want them to blow up some more Iraqis they insert a credit card and are charged accordingly. I leave the specific menu and costs to the policy wonks.
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Re: Americans don't need tax havens

Post by Svartalf » Thu Apr 07, 2016 1:40 pm

rEvolutionist wrote:Taxes are theft. GIVE ME FREEDUM, OR GIVE ME DEATH!
do you prefer to be beheaded, hanged, shot or impaled. No state will let you have freedum.
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