A glimpse into the future: 24-7 monitoring.

[Coito ergo sum]

Surveillance system monitors conversations
A controversial covert surveillance system that records the public's conversations is being used in Britain.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/technology/n ... tions.html

Well, we'd best just embrace it. Because it's coming.

[AshtonBlack]

Coming? It was here a good number of years ago.
Just not being used in civvie street.

[Feck]

All conversations are monitored ..BT have been recording all theirs for years the mobile companies keep records of the position of all cell phones .

Did you think Homeland security was to keep you safe ???????????

[AshtonBlack]

All conversations are monitored ..BT have been recording all theirs for years the mobile companies keep records of the position of all cell phones .

Did you think Homeland security was to keep you safe ???????????

GCHQ in the UK.

[Feck]

I heard a senior policeman say "Nothing to hide Nothing to fear" on television when asked about this .....The irony is not even funny .

Echelon ? The Anthrax attacks ? where did the weaponized anthrax spores come from ? I'm a lot more worried by our Governments than I am by a rag head with some TATP (oops that ones flagged !!! )

[Feck]

Section 44 ...........etc



George Orwell was right got the date a bit wrong should have called the book 2004 .

[Coito ergo sum]

....if this is just to be expected and no big deal, because it's been happening for years and years, then why was there all the complaints about warrantless wiretapping a few years back?

[Feck]

....if this is just to be expected and no big deal, because it's been happening for years and years, then why was there all the complaints about warrantless wiretapping a few years back?

When the wall came down they found that East Germany had rooms full of recording equipment ..every phone call was recorded This was shouted as an example of how terrible communist regimes were and how lucky we all are in the free west . HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA .
Some of us made a noise about our loss of freedoms but strangely CES they are the very people you despise

HOW big a noise did you want us to make when the cops are quoting Orwell ? When was the last time you demonstrated ? When was the last time Antiterrorism powers were used on you ? War on Terror ,that would be the nebulous enemy our Governments can keep on fighting where ever and whenever they like and If you complain then YOUare the enemy . DO YOU READ THE NEWS ? The country with the highest oil consumption invaded the country with the second highest reserves Freedom ?Democracy ? don't make me laugh Your Government is owned and ours has It's tongue firmly stuck up it's arse hole .
And the best of it is with all this power and influence ,the triumph of the free market is going to cost 30-40%of our money .

[Coito ergo sum]

....if this is just to be expected and no big deal, because it's been happening for years and years, then why was there all the complaints about warrantless wiretapping a few years back?

When the wall came down they found that East Germany had rooms full of recording equipment ..every phone call was recorded This was shouted as an example of how terrible communist regimes were and how lucky we all are in the free west . HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA .
Some of us made a noise about our loss of freedoms but strangely CES they are the very people you despise

What are you talking about? I'm just curious about why a lot of people who appear to be among those who would have a problem with warrantless wiretapping are all "ho hum - whatever" about this issue.

HOW big a noise did you want us to make when the cops are quoting Orwell ?

I don't care what noise you make. I thought there might be consistency, that's all. You can't on the one hand shout cries of fascism and the downfall of western civilization when it comes to limited warrantless wiretapping, and then go "ho hum - whatever, we've had this for years and it's no big deal" (or words to that effect) on the other and be consistent. I was very surprised by the inconsistency. Maybe it's because Bush isn't President anymore. People can't use it as a political attack on the establishment when their guys are the establishment. Now it's just not as big a deal. Right?

When was the last time you demonstrated ?

A month ago. What does that have to do with anything?

When was the last time Antiterrorism powers were used on you ?

None, as far as I can tell. What does that have to do with the price of tea in China?

War on Terror ,that would be the nebulous enemy our Governments can keep on fighting where ever and whenever they like and If you complain then YOUare the enemy .

Lots of people have freely complained with no repercussions with the exception of opposition to their views. The opposition was extreme, vitriolic, open and unapologetic, and rightly so. Nobody said they were the enemy, nor were they treated as such.

I never liked the term "War on Terror.' I've made the point before that we can't fight "terror" and we can't fight "terrorism" anymore than we can fight any other "ism." We fight "terrorists," and "terrorist groups," and "state sponsors of terrorism." War on Terror was a bad public relations thing, and I never liked it.

DO YOU READ THE NEWS ?

More than most.

The country with the highest oil consumption invaded the country with the second highest reserves

That's correct.

Freedom ?Democracy ? don't make me laugh Your Government is owned and ours has It's tongue firmly stuck up it's arse hole .

Owned by whom?

We certainly have a lot of freedom here in the US. I can say, write, publish and express any idea, with only extremely limited limitations. I can go where I like. I can listen to and buy what I like. I can freely assemble. I can petition the government for redress of grievances. I can work, play, hunt, read, study, whatever.

What's the point you are making anyway? That the conduct described in the OP is good? What?

And the best of it is with all this power and influence ,the triumph of the free market is going to cost 30-40%of our money .

LOL!

Triumph of the free market? Are you bananas? What a joke.

The market is getting less free, not more free.

[Mysturji]

Somebody please PM me when the revolution starts.
I'd feel a right fucking twat storming the gates of Downing Street all by myself.

[Feck]

Your OP stated that you are losing some of your freedom ,we agree this is a BAD thing ...I'm just a bit confused because you seem to link that with your current government? and some of us have been screaming and protesting about this for a LONG time .Your Government is owned by the Market (not saying any of ours was any better.)

I would agree with you that the libertarians should have been protesting this harder than the "loony left"

My point was that if international politics takes little or no account of rights or laws why do you think Merikans are going to go unscathed by the Big Brother governments that got us into this mess in the first place .


There were protests about about human rights and liberty BUT they all seemed to be from the opposite end of the political spectrum to you .

My comments were made in the light of a right wing merkin commenting on civil liberties because a few of yours might be curtailed ....yes you were right ,Get used to it! we already have it and it was mostly introduced by flag waving right wingers talking about our Freedumb and democracy .

[Coito ergo sum]

Your OP stated that you are losing some of your freedom

No it doesn't, not me anyway. The article is lengthy, and maybe the author said so. The article is also not about the US.

,we agree this is a BAD thing ...

Loss of freedom is generally a bad thing.

I'm just a bit confused because you seem to link that with your current government?

I didn't link it, or seem to link it.

I just posted it as look into the future, when technology will allow the government and others to basically monitor everything 24-7. I also suggested that we can't stop it, so we might as well embrace it.

and some of us have been screaming and protesting about this for a LONG time .Your Government is owned by the Market (not saying any of ours was any better.)

If that were true, then we would not have had some of the omnibus "overhauls" we've just had. Private business is not pleased with what's happening.

Further, "the market" doesn't own anything. Companies and people own things. The market is the system of buying and selling things. It's not a thing.

I would agree with you that the libertarians should have been protesting this harder than the "loony left"

I never said anything about what the Libertarians should do or not do, and I've never used the term "loony left," I can assure you about that.

My point was that if international politics takes little or no account of rights or laws

Yes, that's true, because most countries in this world don't have an Enlightenment concept of the Rights of Man.

why do you think Merikans are going to go unscathed by the Big Brother governments that got us into this mess in the first place .

I never said they would. I said, in the OP, that we can't stop it, so we might as well embrace it. Were you reading someone else's post? Or, were you creating your own post and attributing it to me?

There were protests about about human rights and liberty BUT they all seemed to be from the opposite end of the political spectrum to you .

That's not true. Both ends of the spectrum objected strenuously to warrantless wiretapping.

Once again, though, my point was about consistency. Why would the same people who were livid before, be ho-hum now (especially when we are talking about an even worse invasion)? My guess is because their boys are in the power position now. So, they don't want to criticize for fear of inhibiting all the "good work" that their boys are doing. I see a lot of that - it's the "Oh, we don't criticize Obama for, say, expanding Bush's faith based initiatives by more than double, because he's doing such good work...." Right? Bush was a creep and tearing up the constitution by having his faith-based initiatives, but Obama, ah, no biggie for him.

My comments were made in the light of a right wing merkin

Who, exactly?

commenting on civil liberties because a few of yours might be curtailed ....

You're calling ME "right wing?" Are you mad? Do you even know what "right wing" means?

yes you were right ,Get used to it! we already have it and it was mostly introduced by flag waving right wingers talking about our Freedumb and democracy .

Really? Did you read the article? It's in the U.K., and the U.K. has been worlds ahead of the dumb, right-wing Americans in terms of surveillance. None of your liberal and socialist parties object to them. Do they? If so, they're damn quiet about it.

[Feck]

Well if you feel that the protests about these invasions of civil liberty have diminished it may well be because we were no faced with any choice .

This is not the future BTW .This is now and has been for years . The fact that the newspapers are just now complaining about it is a sham .

Please remind anyone you hear talking about the land of the free etc that WE live in a police state and if conditions are different in the US they won't be for long .

For many years they Government have been adding amendments to the end of Bills ,The one good thing about an unelected 2nd house is that some of these laws have been stopped .

NOTHING TO HIDE NOTHING TO FEAR ,I'm glad I won't have to put up with this for long .

Well you may not be right wing in Merika but from the perspective of the Rest of the world you are .

There is a misconception that the British Government was left wing for the last few years ...it wasn't !

[Coito ergo sum]

Well if you feel that the protests about these invasions of civil liberty have diminished it may well be because we were no faced with any choice .

Once again - I was referring to the "ho hum" attitude here from the same people who were likely up in arms about warrantless wiretapping previously, and not a diminishing of protests overall.

I doubt, however, that people have a "ho hum" attitude about it because we don't have any choice now. That's total bullshit. If anything, now that Obama is leading the free world and the good guys are in power, shouldn't the ability to protest be even greater than it was under that fascist Hitler, GW?

This is not the future BTW .This is now and has been for years . The fact that the newspapers are just now complaining about it is a sham .

This particular technology is relatively new.

Please remind anyone you hear talking about the land of the free etc that WE live in a police state and if conditions are different in the US they won't be for long .

I have no doubt, given that Obama announced his desire to have a "civilian security force" with funding equal to the United States military......I shudder at the thought...and thunderous applause greeting his announcement of that intention - his supporters - supposed liberals - loved the idea of a police force funded to the tune of hundreds of billions of dollars.......

For many years they Government have been adding amendments to the end of Bills ,The one good thing about an unelected 2nd house is that some of these laws have been stopped .

NOTHING TO HIDE NOTHING TO FEAR ,I'm glad I won't have to put up with this for long .

Well you may not be right wing in Merika but from the perspective of the Rest of the world you are .

I'm not "right wing" anywhere.

And, fuck the fucking "Merika" bull-fucking-shit. I am sick of the snarky arrogance from Europeans who think that by virtue of being European they are politically and philosophically ahead of the rest of the world. The puerile "Merkins" and "Merika" and "Amerikkka" shit is just foolishness designed as a put down. Argue the issue or STFU with the snark and the namecalling. Maybe in every friggin' conversation "Europeans" and "British" should be changed to some mocking short form bastardization. I can come up with some good ones.

There is a misconception that the British Government was left wing for the last few years ...it wasn't !

Who cares? The liberal and socialist parties in the UK aren't moving to remove the surveillance, are they? Of course not.

[RuleBritannia]

Who cares? The liberal and socialist parties in the UK aren't moving to remove the surveillance, are they? Of course not.

Britain has liberal and socialist parties? When did that happen?