I've lost all faith in Merkins

[Seth]

Close all foreign bases and pull the troops back like Seth said. Take Cuba and the rest of the Caribbean, put two carrier groups across the mouth of the Gulf of Mexico, which has been renamed the Gulf of Florida. It's our lake now, manifest air power and all that. Establish another tier of citizenship, call it 'Merikan Lite, and grant it to Central Americans. Oh, take those bits, too. Establish 1000 mile territorial waters on both coasts, Hawaii, the Marshalls (they're a state now), Guam, and the Philippines. Fuck, all our nurses are Flips now, might as well make them legal, plus we want Subic back.

That's what I'd do if I was Boss.

Gotta take back the Panama Canal. High priority. We'll exchange US citizenship for the State of Panama for fee-title ownership of the Canal, which we built in the first place.

And if we don't like you, or you won't pay the stiff fee, you don't get to use the Canal and can go 'round the Horn and to hell with you.

[rainbow]

We defend half the fucking planet from the other half and have since WWII, so pay up, deadbeats.

When we want your help, we'll ask for it.

You did. Repeatedly.

Nope. I never did.

Then you didn't get any.

...so you were wrong.

This seems to be happening quite often, Seth.

Perhaps it is an early sign of senility. Get it checked out.

[mistermack]

We pull your sorry asses out of the fire twice in one century and this is the thanks we get? Go fuck yourselves, all y'all.

No, what America did was hide, peeping round the corner till they saw who was winning, like the weasely kid in the school yard.
Once it was obvious who was going to win, the weasely kid gets a sly kick in, when the loser is down. That was the US contribution to two ''world'' wars.

The only time the US took on another country before it got worn down, they ended up running away screaming with their ass on fire. ( Saigon )

[Hermit]

And the situation would have been improved by Soviet domination and control of Afghanistan and surrounding areas how, exactly?

It certainly would be better than the situation is now that Afghanistan has been liberated by the defenders of freedom and liberty.

Well, that's international geopolitics for ya. It's been that way for several millennia. People you help out one day turn on you the next.

Well, who would have thunk it? Takes a genius like you to discover that. Just goes to show though, dunnit? The USA, is not special at all. Like pretty much all countries it will do anything to protect its perceived interests, including strategic or tactical support for dictators and religious nutters. If that can be dressed up to look as if they are helping in any way, so much the better.

Do you really expect us NOT to look to our own interests?

What the fuck makes you think that? This question is yet another example of your lack of reading comprehension or yet another example of simply reading things that are just not there or you fell off a ladder and landed on your head.

[pErvinalia]

In one post he's telling us the USA is looking after the rest of us, and then in another post he's telling us that they are looking out for their own interests. It's almost as if Seth just answers anyway he sees fit depending on what point he's trying to argue...

[Hermit]

In one post he's telling us the USA is looking after the rest of us, and then in another post he's telling us that they are looking out for their own interests. It's almost as if Seth just answers anyway he sees fit depending on what point he's trying to argue...

Don't be foolish now, rEv. Think for a second. What is good for the USA is good for everybody! Just like what is good for billionaires is good for the poor. Benefits kinda trickle down. Always.

[Seth]

...so you were wrong.

This seems to be happening quite often, Seth.

Perhaps it is an early sign of senility. Get it checked out.

Depends on my definition of "you" and "help" does it not?

[Seth]

We pull your sorry asses out of the fire twice in one century and this is the thanks we get? Go fuck yourselves, all y'all.

No, what America did was hide, peeping round the corner till they saw who was winning, like the weasely kid in the school yard.

Once it was obvious who was going to win, the weasely kid gets a sly kick in, when the loser is down. That was the US contribution to two ''world'' wars.

Do you really think we would have gone to war on the side of the Axis? Besides, when we entered both wars you all were LOSING, which is why we came to your rescue, so what you say cannot be true.

The only time the US took on another country before it got worn down, they ended up running away screaming with their ass on fire. ( Saigon )

Yeah, Vietnam was a debacle of monumental proportions cause by politicians unwilling to let the military do what it is supposed to do, much the same as in Afghanistan and Iraq.

It was an object lesson in committing to warfare from which we learned some things that kept our combat losses in Iraq below 5000 while pretty much wiping out the standing military of Saddam. Afghanistan is another kettle of fish entirely, and we never should have even attempted to nation-build there. We should have gone Osama hunting and that's it. We almost got him at Tora Bora, and then made the mistake of trying to suppress the Taliban and nation-build in a nation that has never in recorded history, been pacified by anyone. It has to do with the terrain and location. It is our penchant for trying to "save" the oppressed (women and non-Taliban) in Afghanistan that got us stuck to that tar-baby and it was a very bad idea.

War is hell. Military commanders understand this, which is why they are trained to go it, kick ass and then get out. But politicians don't understand war, they think it's a political game, which it's not, so they too-often tie the hands of the military, which leads to excessive troop deaths and injuries and billions of wasted American dollars trying to achieve something that the savages in Afghanistan have never known and have absolutely no interest whatsoever in learning. Leave them to their goats and mud huts is what I say.

[Seth]

And the situation would have been improved by Soviet domination and control of Afghanistan and surrounding areas how, exactly?

It certainly would be better than the situation is now that Afghanistan has been liberated by the defenders of freedom and liberty.

You need to go look up what the Soviets did to the Afghans in occupied zones.

Well, that's international geopolitics for ya. It's been that way for several millennia. People you help out one day turn on you the next.

Well, who would have thunk it? Takes a genius like you to discover that. Just goes to show though, dunnit? The USA, is not special at all. Like pretty much all countries it will do anything to protect its perceived interests, including strategic or tactical support for dictators and religious nutters. If that can be dressed up to look as if they are helping in any way, so much the better.[/quote]

Well, that's the way of the world. Things change. Shit happens. Iran was much better off, more prosperous and much more peaceful under the Shah, whom we supported. Now there's no Shah and the Mullahs are in charge and Iran threatens world peace and stability by developing nuclear weapons. I'd much rather the Shah was in charge.

Do you really expect us NOT to look to our own interests?

What the fuck makes you think that? This question is yet another example of your lack of reading comprehension or yet another example of simply reading things that are just not there or you fell off a ladder and landed on your head.[/quote]

Although the question was largely a rhetorical rebuttal of your silly simplistic propaganda, what then do you expect us to do? We do what we have to do to protect our strategic interests, national security and national sovereignty, just like every other nation on earth does and has always done. We need make no apology for what we are compelled to do by those who choose to make themselves our enemies. Things go so much more smoothly and everybody profits when they choose to be our friends and allies rather than our enemies. You'd think the towelheads in the middle east would know that by now.

[Seth]

In one post he's telling us the USA is looking after the rest of us, and then in another post he's telling us that they are looking out for their own interests. It's almost as if Seth just answers anyway he sees fit depending on what point he's trying to argue...

Rhetoric in action...imagine that. And that you're just now figuring this out doesn't speak well of your intellectual abilities.

[Seth]

In one post he's telling us the USA is looking after the rest of us, and then in another post he's telling us that they are looking out for their own interests. It's almost as if Seth just answers anyway he sees fit depending on what point he's trying to argue...

Don't be foolish now, rEv. Think for a second. What is good for the USA is good for everybody! Just like what is good for billionaires is good for the poor. Benefits kinda trickle down. Always.

Very true, as the standard of living in the US proves beyond any doubt.

[pErvinalia]

In one post he's telling us the USA is looking after the rest of us, and then in another post he's telling us that they are looking out for their own interests. It's almost as if Seth just answers anyway he sees fit depending on what point he's trying to argue...

Rhetoric in action...imagine that. And that you're just now figuring this out doesn't speak well of your intellectual abilities.

I've been pointing this out about you for years. That's why I rightly claim you are probably one of the worst debaters we've seen on the rationalist forums over years.

[Seth]

In one post he's telling us the USA is looking after the rest of us, and then in another post he's telling us that they are looking out for their own interests. It's almost as if Seth just answers anyway he sees fit depending on what point he's trying to argue...

Rhetoric in action...imagine that. And that you're just now figuring this out doesn't speak well of your intellectual abilities.

I've been pointing this out about you for years. That's why I rightly claim you are probably one of the worst debaters we've seen on the rationalist forums over years.

Your opinion is noted. I will say without reservation that you ARE the worst debater that exists anywhere. So there...

[rainbow]

...so you were wrong.

This seems to be happening quite often, Seth.

Perhaps it is an early sign of senility. Get it checked out.

Depends on my definition of "you" and "help" does it not?

No Seth, your senility has nothing to do with the definition of "you".

Please take your meds, they might "help" "you" make sense.

[mistermack]

Do you really think we would have gone to war on the side of the Axis? Besides, when we entered both wars you all were LOSING, which is why we came to your rescue, so what you say cannot be true.

Shows your pathetic grasp of history.
The US didn't come to anybody's rescue. Japan attacked Pearl Harbour, and Hitler declared war on the US.
Americans were then FORCED to stop hiding behind the skirts of Brittania, and actually do some fighting themselves. They didn't join the war. It joined them.